Attention All...

THE SKY IS NOT FALLING. YOUR LINDEN DOLLARS ARE SAFE. RETURN TO YOUR POSTS.

Sheesh.

Here is the EXTREME (read: worst case/best case) consequences of this announcement:

1) you will no longer see 6 dozen "BEST PANTS CONTESTS" at Club Supermega. You'll see maybe 4 now. Big improvement.

2) The inefficient, non-popular clubs will shut down. Finally. 103 clubs will compress into maybe 2 dozen.

3) The money grubbers, the greedy bastards, the scammers, and the linden-dollar-whores will leave this game for greener pastures, like There or TSO. So you won't get suckered into buying a $L30,000 casino slot machine.

4) Things will cost less in-world, if the vendors know what's good for them.

5) People will be less money-conscious in general, like it was pre- 1.2.

6) This is temporary. LLabs might increase stipends if deflation happens too much.

7) Shops and services will make LESS. People will save more. The "elites will rule the world now" argument is bullshit. How are the old folks supposed to make money if no one has it/ spends it?

You will be forced to actually be civil to each other instead of seeing dollar signs every time an avatar walks by.

9) Events that are actually fun might pop up again (no more "SHAKE YOUR BOOTAH FOR DEH LINDENZ" contests every 15 minutes.)

10) People might actually smile more often.

Calm the hell down.

LF

As the L$ becomes more scarce, shopowners will have to respond by lowering prices. My question is this: will we see a corresponding increase in value on GOM? Or will the price on GOM remain steady while everyone earns less in-world?

fitting? moi'

Prices on GOM will rise because the supply of L$ will drop. Less L$ to go around will not fill demand. As such, its value will increase.

Hold what you got, Cash if King..

Constructive BUMP. Hello!

Economics always scare the complete shiz out of people. Especially online gamers. Why? Probably because some of them dish out real money for their enjoyment. But that's beside my point.

Change hurts. What are you going to do? Leave? Okay. You totally have that option. But to scream bloody murder before the changes even come about, before TRYING to adapt(and wow, I thought this was one of humanity's greatest features), or giving it a chance.. we're all gonna run around like chickens with their heads cut off?

I've seen a lot of MMO's make changes. It's always the same thing. Chaos.

Oh well. Thanks Lordfly.. I'm calm, too. No, I'm not SL rich. No, I don't get a "phat" bonus every week. No, my ratings are actually kinda low.

Let's have a cookie.

I'm not runnin' around screaming either, I'm just worried about the newbs is all. Eh. I have no head for economics anyway, but it just sort of seems like it'd be a bit tougher to make yourself in SL if you're starting from scratch ...

I think the big change here will be ratings will be worth less than what it costs to give them, so mining serves no purpose, and it brings them closer back to being a reputation system.

-Adam

Well we have a lot of people here who have never been through a big SL change before.

Consider this option, folks. After this, someday you'll be able to tell all the newbies, "I remember when...." and sound really old. Just like us elite, rich oldbies do now.

I have to go now; my butler just tripped on a brick of gold and is bleeding from the head onto my oriental rug.

True, it might Lo. Though I'm one of those people who didn't depend on ratings. Hell I didn't even know what they DID for a good month, how to get them, how to give them. I squandered and created. I dunno, maybe I'm just a harsh person.

Maybe this is all a push for premium accounts.

Eh well.

Oh dear. I hope he didnt break any priceless ming vases on the way down.

I agree with Michi on this one. It's a lot less change than when 1.2 was announced.

I sure hope to hell you pronounced that as "Vaaaaahzes", Adam. Or I'll refuse you eye contact privileges with my beloved decorative shih-tzu from hereforth, post-haste.

APPARENTLY EVERYONE IS UPSET, APPARENTLY EVERYONE REALY DOES HAVE ISSUES LET THEM SPEAK!

I'm not so sure Alby.

Your crystal ball isn't doing such a good job - remember your other pronouncement?

From 11/5


Quote Originally Posted by Alby Yellowknife -

"This is the 1929 Crash of SL..."



=-=-=-

I see a lot of people getting wound up tight over the GOM value of L$.

Yes, its cool that L$ can be convertted to real USD $....

But c'mon people, the game is called "Second Life" - NOT "Second Income"!

Those that are focused on the value of the L$ compared to the US$ have it backwards, IMHO.

The proper measure, is the value of the L$ as it relates to the cost of land, goods, and services IN-GAME. The GOM is just a side-benefit. People who are there for US$ are there for their own selfish reasons - and NOT to make SL a better game or have cooler events/content!

Just my US$0.02....

Take care,

--Noel "HB" Wade
(Tread Whiplash)

I'd have to agree the sky isn't falling. The only thing I was pissed about was the ratings now costing so much, and the Top Bidders AKA 'Featured' list, but neither one really effects me.

I'm not going to rate anymore. If anyone rates me and expects a rateback, I'm going to calmly explain that I'd rather be given 75 L$ than receive a +3 rating.

I'm not going to use the Featured list, it will be meaningless as far as I'm concerned so why bother? Hell I never used Top Picks before anyway, I know what I like and don't like I don't need their suggestions.

Nothing's really going to change as far as I'm concerned.

Catherine and others -

I've said this in another thread tonight, but it obviously bears repeating here:

PLEASE don't shout or be abusive! Its not the way to win an argument! If you get people all worked up, they will only become defensive and stick to their point no matter what you say!

Plus, the more we bicker, the less the Lindens read.... So if you're hoping for change, being argumentative is shooting yourself in the foot!

LL is not trying to kill themselves - they're simply trying to run a whole online world; and oh BTW, pay their bills, too. Give them a little credit - they're not out to destroy us.

So let's all chill and discuss this in a reasonable manner - the more constructive points and facts and ideas we come up with, the more solutions we will see; and the more the Lindens will have to chew on, when trying to make the right decision. Its in their best interest to do so!

Take care,

--Noel "HB" Wade
(Tread Whiplash)

Big bump.

If there is less money in the system, prices go down. We all benefit.

What it is doing, is forcing people's time horizons to lengthen, especially because the money is being removed from events and stipends, essentially low or no cost sources of wealth.

And that is making people freak because their "fix" is getting cut off.

Now, more people will make stuff, less $L will be floating around, prices will drop dramatically, essentially providing new creators with a floor to support their efforts, while they get better and more popular.

Also this is going to be VERY good for scripters. Who have been getting the short end of the stick in a lot of ways in the SL economy.

I know exactly why LL did this and it was the right move. The other option was to regulate the hell out of everything, or tax people. Either one of those options would have definitely destroyed SL. This may shrink it a bit temporarily, but in the long run it will make it much healthier.

Also, on the "hoarding" issue. Hoarding equals saving. Eventually, that money will go towards large-scale projects that couldn't be done otherwise. There's no point holding on to $L unless you plan to dispose of it at SOME point.

It'd be interesting to see who actually "left" when 1.2 was introduced. I'm sure that the number of threats far exceeded the actual exodus.

Discussion is still open. Whether it's good or bad, at this point, I honestly can't say. It could be either, it could be both, it could be a wash.

The biggest concern for me is -- this shows one thing. One absolute fact.

LL is worried about SL's economy.

This means that, chances are, SOMETHING isn't going right behind the prim curtain, at LL.

The response may or may not be justified, helpful, or correct. Or it may fix it.

But my concern is that LL is obviously worried about something. This could mean that things aren't going as well as we might have thought.

Well if its a GAME then whats the difference?


Well perhaps people will stop living off wellfare and actually do somehing usefull/creative.

Also the land barrons got the same FK in the @ss not to long ago.

And the value of L$ is still half of what it should be.

A lot of people whined cause land was to much, youve got your way at the expense of someone elses happyness.
Now its the other way around.

And serously all this is going to do Is make ratings MEAN what there supposed to.
From now on I wont rate someone just cause they rated me.
It will be,, hey cool you did something deserving of it so here ya go.

Everyone was always in the mindset, well they keep paying me so I guess I'm allowed to do it.
Well guess what, thats the Mindset of a child. SL is for over the age of 18.
And the events junk,, Well tadaa thats what happens when people abuse it regularly.

Since you spammed 3 threads with that post, LJ:


Why should you have to be forced to do something useful in SL? People have every right to come and relax and not build / run anything. What's wrong with having a minor stipend?

We're talking the difference between a few people, and a majority of SL users. BIG difference.


Says you. Philip himself said the L$'s ideal price is desired by LL to be $4/1kL.


Erm, regardless of how the changes might affect the economy, the problem is that we haven't had time to discuss and test them as a community.


Except for the people with money, who will rate and get their friends all rated, and still rate grief, because 25L isn't much to richer players. So, no.


What mindset are you talking about? You're not making much sense here.


What? You break it worse than it was without discussing it with the community first?

Hiro -

Just one minor point: You argue that players with more money will be able to give more ratings than players with little money, because of the cost. This places more "power" in the hands of an "upper-class".

While I totally agree that griefing is a problem and should be dealt with seriously, I would like to point out that SL *IS* and always *WILL BE* a society with different levels of "class". People pay real US$ to have more money, land, etc. It makes sense (that paying more money has tangible benefits), and helps LL pay the bills - so there's no use fighting it.

And while it would be wrong to give those people absolute power over the rest of us, its a basic fact of life that people with more money have more influence... Even in Communist countries its true. So SL is no different from the rest of the world in this aspect.

The up-side, is that our Overlords at LL are probably Benevolent Dictators. *grin* - And as such, they won't put up with rich-folks causing too much disruption. A smooth economy and a general positive attitude in SL society are both vitally important to keep attracting new players to the system, and to encourage players to upgrade their accounts... thus ensuring LL's survival. And in turn, allowing US to continue to play SL.

Take care,

--Noel "HB" Wade
(Tread Whiplash)

Well said...and i point attention to This Thread and particularly...


I am a firm believer all these choices by the Linden's are good ones, despite the bunch of over reactive narrow mindedness i have read about how this is the "End!" If people cannot sit back and think much more "Globally," and less about how they will afford their Hoochie hair and Prim shoes - they won't need to find a Moneyball on every block - they need to step away from the computer...take a deep breathe...that's right hold it.................exchale....Wow! Now that's Good!

Tread, you're my new favorite poster.

You bring up an excellent point, and yes, there will be classes.

But, why should we then extend this class gap between rich and poor? Shouldn't we be looking for more ways to empower the lower end, rather than keep them dependant? And for that matter, aren't the rich dependent on the buying power of the masses? Damn right we are.

But I disagree with your assessment that there's no use fighting it. If you read who's posting, there are a lot of SL rich that are against these changes. And this really isn't about fighting.

It's about telling Linden Lab, "Hey, we know you think this is a good idea to solve some griefing problems, but we need more time to talk about this and come up with a solution that doesn't expand the wealth gap."

Thanks Hiro - Should I be flattered, or scared??

For the record, I didn't mean we shouldn't fight for limits or anything like that - I meant we should expect these classes to be on different levels, and not try to fight their very existence.

You make some good points, but I'd have to see more "insider" information before passing judgement on how good/bad the different parts of these changes are...

And we all need a crystal ball, if we want to claim what affect this is going to have on the "wealth gap" or the various economic minutae that some people are debating.

I firmly believe that a certain weath-gap (as irksome as it might be) is necessary and healthy for the game. You need it to provide incentives and bonuses for people to upgrade their accounts - land isn't going to appeal to everyone, so money and a little bit of power help widen the appeal. As I've said before, we need paying customers to keep LL alive financially - and thus ensure SL remains online. The REALLY TRICKY SCARY part is balancing the wealth-gap; and making sure it stays fun enough to keep new newbies & "lower accounts" growing.

As far as being dependant upon the "poor masses", I think SL "upper-class" is less-so than most RL societies... No labor work-force needed, you see. True, you need big enough markets to sell goods to; but not all "rich" SL'ers are business-people. AND, since the economy is mostly "luxury goods", you really don't HAVE to buy anything except land, if you want to do things.

Ahhh, the vagaries of Economics & Online business ventures...

Take care,

--Noel "HB" Wade
(Tread Whiplash)