All postings on the events calendar under commercial recieved disciplinary action

A rules violation is a rules violation. I don't care who it is that does it, content creator or not. Its about time the rules of the events callendar were enforced. Happy to see it.

I actually sympathize with this poster and for me it points out yet another problem with the entire posting system. This project falls into a grey area for which there isn't any assistance. One the one hand, no, it doesn't fall into the category of a hosted event (although the owner could plan some 2 hour hosted events where he is present and available for discussions, etc.) but, on the other hand, it sure isn't a 24/7 sex party/yard sale/new store grand opening. It sounds like a pretty interesting and innovative use of the "platform" that one could enjoy in a leisurely manner (and I think I'm gonna go check it out today!). My feeling is that there are a lot of these sorts of things out there - but no real way for them to be publicized. Sure, they could buy a classified ad, but to me, that doesn't exactly seem fair. It would be nice if there were a non-profit/cultural/innovative/experimental category -- so attention could be drawn to unique and possibly obscure builds and projects that are not commercial ventures.

Indeed, LL has taken a long overdue step in cleaning up the events listings. Here's to hoping that they continue in providing tools that allow us to enjoy all that SL has to offer.

Anybody know who "you all" is?

I would love to see an "interesting places to visit" place where the owner could describe a non-commercial location and all it has to offer, but I don't see the Lindens doing it anytime soon considering how much trouble they've had with the events list.

This breaks this event rule:
An event is defined as a special group activity that is led by a host on land owned either by the host or by a group the host belongs to. Examples include discussions, group meetings, hosted dances, classes, tours, and competitions.

and it also breaks this event rule:
An event is framed by a beginning and an end time. Thus '24hr Sales' and 'Non-Stop Casinos' are not events.



this breaks this event rule:
An event is framed by a beginning and an end time. Thus '24hr Sales' and 'Non-Stop Casinos' are not events.



Again it breaks both of the rules posted up there

"You all" must be me - seeing it's myself you quoted... now I would challenge you to go back and find evidence to support that I've ever said any such thing, that anyone should come first.

*I* am happy that someone is enforcing the rules they've laid down about events posting - that you read your usual 'star chamber' rubbish into it is what *I* find interesting.

Once again LL has listened to a noisy subset of the 5-10% of forum regulars and assumed--for no good reason whatsoever--that they are representative of the general SL population.

Fix the filtering--don't randomly enforce a rule that's not needed.

Personally I hope this is the beginning of consistent rule enforcement on the events callendar.

It's been quite awhile since I posted any event at all so someone correct me if I am wrong. Before you even get to the form to fill in for the event I remember having to click "I agree" to the rules. Every time an event is listed. By clicking that you agree to abide by those rules. If you do not agree with the rules don't click that, and don't post events. In that case your time might be better spent making a proposal and drumming up support to change the rules.

Until changes are made however the rule should be followed and the rules must be Consistently enforced.

All the events I post are hosted events with a start and end time--events that follow the letter and spirit of the rules as currently written. Feel free to search on my name for events I post. Just because I think a rule is nonsensical, doesn't mean I am violating it.

As for "making a proposal and drumming up support"--why would I bother? This rule change was originally proposed by a Linden, then adopted, after two hours and fifteen posts of forum discussion. Broad player support is clearly not this issue here.

Sorry, I agree so strongly I felt it needed quoting again.

Lias Leandros-

Kudos to you for your outstanding contribution to the world of Second Life...

Sorry you were caught off guard by an abrubt enforcement/house-cleaning
effort by Linden Lab, but you sound like the kind of guy that will adapt and
do well regardless, whether that means coming up with genuine 'events' to
post... or finding other means to get the word out.

Good luck to you!

--
Okay, Okay! It's 'Lab'. But for me it's spelled "Linden Labs(backspace)"
Someday.... I hope... I'll be able to break the habit.

I prefer to ask that they:

Fix filtering and ENFORCE a rule that IS needed.

Because when filtering is fixed, you'll be seeing yet MORE non-events in every category so that you can't possibly miss the great on-going whitesale at Macy's, every day, all prices half off of twice what people won't pay! Stop by now while the blingbling supply lasts!

Enforcment is necessary, I'll take 'random' over 'none'.

Well done, Linden Lab.

I thought it was a resident-created world too. Those that have venues and create events and content should make the rules about the way the community recieves information about such events. Not the service provider or the 20 people who post here because they are in awe of LL.

If absolutely EVERY content provider who made a commercial posting on Friday is posting outside a rule IT IS TIME TO CHANGE THAT RULE and cater to the CUSTOMER that utilizes that service on a daily basis. It is not time to attempt to divide the community and bully the half that develops SL while the forum trolls giggle in glee.

Lias Leandros I have visited your exhibit and agree it is a very worthwhile and outstanding exhibit. But that said as the event rules very clearly state it is not an actual event.

When I visited your establishment you were on hand to answer questions and were very pleasant to deal with. Perhaps you can post it in events when you are actually going to be on hand and have a sign up stating that you are open 24/7 for those times you are not?

I agree there does need to be a category for "exhibits" like this which don't fall under the events yet aren't a "yardsalecasinosbuymycrap" event

*huggles*

Ash

The Events listing is not the place for commercial listings. Post your commercial listings under Classifieds where it belongs. When I'm looking for an event, I do not want to wade through a pile of adverts to find the actual EVENT events.



It's not time to change any rules, its time the rules that are in place be followed.

I utilize the service on a daily basis, and I praise LL for finally doing a little something about the Events listing being stuffed full of non-event crap.

I have not seen your exhibit, and I am definately NOT calling it crap. I am calling the 20 'yard sale' events and thousands of casino listings, and the billion slingotringobingo 'events' crap.

I think we do need more Find catagories, indeed. Finer search granularity is a good thing. It would help people who are actually trying to use the Find to actually find what they are loking fr, or to advertise their event/item/bingohall to people that want to actually find it.

-Ghoti

Opinion:

I agree with Carl Metropolitan. And also with Lias. Though I understood and agreed with the event rules (someone has to be there, and it has to have a beginning and end time) and considered them good rules, people have frequently pointed out that that really doesn't lend itself to something that will last longer, such as a week-long fair, for instance. For that, and for museums and whatnot, new categories would be a good thing.

From what Lias said in his/her first post, it sounds like yet again another problem with the left-hand Linden not knowing what the right-hand Linden is doing. These things are so arbitrary, and so seem to be up to whatever employee gets it in his head to do whatever, that I think LL is in dire need of someone at the helm. Several someones, actually, in the form of a traditional heirarchical organization pattern so familiar in most companies.

I really don't care for heirarchies, businesses, or suits, so I find myself rather astounded at myself for thinking this necessary. But - I guess there is such a thing as too LITTLE structure, too.

I agree with Lias that if you have to wipe out an entire category of people with warnings, there is probably something wrong with your CATEGORY or your RULE - not the people using the system. Or at the very least, with your communication.

I also agree with Lias that this is supposed to be "our world" but in so many ways is not, and that too few people are too influential in causing changes that affect everyone. Which then often come as a surprise to the majority of residents.

I, too, thought there was too much nonsense going on on the events calendars, but it seems to me this was mishandled. I don't think being punitive - especially to people who may not be aware they have done anything wrong, and who are providing content to LL - is the right way to go (though it is definitely the most efficient way to go).

"Shock and awe" is indicative of this same sort of punitive philosophy that goes on so much in something that is supposed to be a source of fun and entertainment. Taking away people's dwell, giving warnings to people like Lias, all this kind of stuff - I just don't think this is going to work well in the long run.

After a bit, people might get tired of paying LL money to be treated like criminals, when such was never their intention, as in the case of Lias. The Lindens might just "shock and awe" their customers right off the platform.

By the same token, not everybody is a masochist, so there will be a threshold as to how much people are willing to part with (dwell, ratings, DI, stipends, you name it) while still paying the same amount to LL every month.

coco

There was a time a few months back, i used to actually read the events list. This was after the last time LL tried to fix it by making things educational. I used to attend scripting and building classes and contests. But after a while people started using 1337 speak to bypass the filters and crap so i assume LL decided to ignore it. So i don't bother reading it now. When i first joined SL the events list was cleaner then now, but was still out of control. I'm glad to see LL has taken action again. I know this method requires each one manually singled out, so they need our help. I'm willing to AR a few if they get in my way.

Actually Bingo, Tringo, Slingo, Pizza, Blood, Greedy and other games out there may not be your cup of tea, but are without a doubt legitimate events. There is a timeframe and a host present.

As are the 'Best in Red', and 'Sexy w/ Wings' and 'Tats and Ass' type contests. I personally rarely attend them, but just because I don't favor them doesn't mean they are crap. And in all honesty a lot of these club events are how SOME noobs first get their feet wet here in SL.

As a side note, this makes me think of all the times I see people post about 'crappy builds' and 'crap events' and crap this and crap that. For a mainly liberal and 'free thinking community' the FORUMS on SL can be filled w/ many judgemental people with a mob mentality at times.

I rarely post on the Forums and rarely complain, but as an active member of the SL population, I have stood in world countless times gnashing my teeth at having to weed through the quagmire on this list. I had faith, sadly misguided, that responsible adults would magically see the light and adhere to guidelines. Pretty sad when you're trying to refer an enthusiastic newcomer to an Event and you can't find an appropriate one yourself within the bloated mess.

Here, here! I heartily applaud Linden Labs for finally taking action.


...from the usually silent Mermaid

With all due respect, what is so hard to understand about the event rules? Why are you unable to take out a classified ad for your gallery like everyone else, and then put in event listings for when you are ACTUALLY having an event. You know, when you are there, and something is going on. I understand that you are frustrated with having received a warning - and I personally think they should have been informal warnings. However, I do agree LL is doing the right thing - if they don't police the event listings, they will lose their usefulness altogether. This is not about not liking certain kind of events. It is about recognizing the time and place for certain things - what you are advocating is a classified ad, not an event.

I would just like to clarify that there is a lot of speculation here which is simply not true, and does not apply to the disciplinary actions taken.

First, to my knowledge, not all postings under the Commercial category got warnings. Not even most of them. There were a lot more on that day than was previously counted in this thread, but they have been removed on the grounds of being spam, commercial ads, and soforth--NON-events.

Second, this has a long and enduring history. Searching through the forum archives will bring up many matches of "WHEN WILL LL DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE EVENTS?" and it certainly isn't just on the forums. I hear it a lot inworld too (maybe because I attend events). This was not done rashly, and is one of the SoreTooth projects. (It's also redundant.)

Also, there were some Resis who posted both actual and NON-events. For example, someone who posted a club night contest and ALSO posted an ad to sell a commercial product. In which case, the latter gets removed, the former obviously does not.

Now, if it's alright with the OP, Lias--and I'd like to make sure it's okay first--I'll post the particular ad that got removed, in the interest of transparency, so perhaps this will shed a little more light into why it was deleted.

In addition, we also do have plans for better searching, filtering, and ways to showcase wonderful content inworld. This is an AND thing, not an OR thing. It may arrive in pieces, and may take time--hence why today, we can't just let the Events calendar rot, but do what we can!--but you can be sure that me, being someone who's attended just about every kind of event there's been (from trivia to BDSM workshops to Tringo to building classes to yard sales), I'll be happy to shout it from the rooftops and help inform the community.

Always nice to ask before assuming things.

Wouldn't it be great if we had a list somewhere for places that have gatherings that don't have a start or end time? Or a place where stores can list themselves?

OH WAIT - WE DO... its called "FIND ---> PLACES."

Wouldn't it be great if we had a list somewhere for commercial entities so that they could advertise? A place separate so the events list could be used for, well, events?

OH WAIT - WE DO... its called "FIND ---> CLASSIFIEDS."

Regards,

-Flip

I love you, Linden Labs. I wanna have your baby.

EDIT: Oops, different "LL."

Flipper, this still doesn't have a place for those things like week-long fairs, etc., where someone might not be there hosting, but someone might want to know about it to go. I'm thinking of the Touchstone Fair, for instance.

Those could go under "cultural," possibly, but they can't go anyplace but in classified under the present rules.

And classified - let's face it - is no place to find anything. Particularly not an event of limited duration.

coco

Why can a week long fair not take out a classified ad? Why can you not search classifieds for fair as easily as you can events?