Free Expression and Moderation Reform
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
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06-26-2005 09:50
I should like to say that I stand fully behind my request to send a message to the moderators concerning Cocoanut Koala's use of this thread to discuss off-topic grievances (often resorting to trolling and flaming). It's exactly what Prokofy used to do that harmed so many productive threads and it should be watched closely by the moderators. Here's what I submitted and suggested others submit, if they agreed: Coco is interjecting commentary into an otherwise productive thread, hijacking it to air grievances about perceived persecution and mistreatment. We feel a separate thread would be a better place for this discussion. While no single post violates the rules individually, could you look at them in context and issue an informal warning, if you feel it's justified?
Remember, moderation is currently focused on single-post violations of the Forum Guidelines. When a single post does not violate the Guidelines, yet the greater work of the individual taken in context does, I feel that a report is justified. Remember, this thread is about moderation reform.  Is it justified? The grounds for this complaint are from the Forum Guidelines themselves: Flaming, Spamming, Trolling – Flaming (posting a message that is intended to incite anger or directly attack a person or persons), Spamming (multiple posts of the same topic or discussion), and Trolling (a post with an intentionally contrary opinion written with the intent of inciting or getting argumentative opinions) are strongly discouraged. If you think your post might be over-reactive, or that it might fall into one of these definitions, please reconsider posting.
Further, we have been given the right to report posts without restriction, where their merit will be judged by the moderators themselves: Report posts – If you see a post that you think violates the Community Standards, is posted in the wrong forum, or in some way requires review, please report it. We’ll take a look at it and will take any action necessary. Further, it is my belief that no form of expression should be censored or no poster persecuted for their opinions unless that expression interferes with the freedom of another person. In this case Cocoanut is the second biggest poster in this thread (45/400) behind myself, yet not a single post has been on topic. Instead almost every post is a eulogy for Prokofy or a call to see others suffer like Prokofy did. ~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
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06-26-2005 09:55
From: Kevn Klein I don't think anyone needs to be told to report another. If it appears someone is disruptive, those who feel the urge to AR a forum poster will do it without a call for a group attack. Worse yet, the suggestion even includes exact wording to use in a complaint. As if the others in a forum are too dumb to know when and how to report a disrupting poster. It seems to me that most if not all of the dire and alarmist characterizations of the new forum rules and use of the abuse report button assume that our fellow posters and especially our moderators are mindless drones that have no ability to think for themselves. I tend to agree that Ulrika's suggestion to AR someone in this thread was silly, but I also think that any belief that doing so would sway a moderator to see the posts in question in anything but an objective way is even sillier.
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Jonquille Noir
Lemon Fresh
Join date: 17 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,025
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06-26-2005 10:12
I suspected you would stand behind it, but that doesn't make it anything more or less than schoolyard bullying and an obvious attempt at intimidation. From: Ulrika Zugzwang I should like to say that I stand fully behind my request to send a message to the moderators concerning Cocoanut Koala's use of this thread to discuss off-topic grievances (often resorting to trolling and flaming). It's exactly what Prokofy used to do that harmed so many productive threads and it should be watched closely by the moderators. Here's what I submitted and suggested others submit, if they agreed: Coco is interjecting commentary into an otherwise productive thread, hijacking it to air grievances about perceived persecution and mistreatment. We feel a separate thread would be a better place for this discussion. While no single post violates the rules individually, could you look at them in context and issue an informal warning, if you feel it's justified?
Remember, moderation is currently focused on single-post violations of the Forum Guidelines. When a single post does not violate the Guidelines, yet the greater work of the individual taken in context does, I feel that a report is justified. Remember, this thread is about moderation reform. Is it justified? The grounds for this complaint are from the Forum Guidelines themselves: Flaming, Spamming, Trolling – Flaming (posting a message that is intended to incite anger or directly attack a person or persons), Spamming (multiple posts of the same topic or discussion), and Trolling (a post with an intentionally contrary opinion written with the intent of inciting or getting argumentative opinions) are strongly discouraged. If you think your post might be over-reactive, or that it might fall into one of these definitions, please reconsider posting.
Further, we have been given the right to report posts without restriction, where their merit will be judged by the moderators themselves: Report posts – If you see a post that you think violates the Community Standards, is posted in the wrong forum, or in some way requires review, please report it. We’ll take a look at it and will take any action necessary. Further, it is my belief that no form of expression should be censored or no poster persecuted for their opinions unless that expression interferes with the freedom of another person. In this case Cocoanut is the second biggest poster in this thread (45/400) behind myself, yet not a single post has been on topic. Instead almost every post is a eulogy for Prokofy or a call to see others suffer like Prokofy did. ~Ulrika~
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Kevn Klein
God is Love!
Join date: 5 Nov 2004
Posts: 3,422
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06-26-2005 10:31
From: Chip Midnight It seems to me that most if not all of the dire and alarmist characterizations of the new forum rules and use of the abuse report button assume that our fellow posters and especially our moderators are mindless drones that have no ability to think for themselves. I tend to agree that Ulrika's suggestion to AR someone in this thread was silly, but I also think that any belief that doing so would sway a moderator to see the posts in question in anything but an objective way is even sillier. I agree with you completely. I would go one further and suggest a mountain of copied complaints would be viewed as a single complaint. I know if I were a moderator I wouldn't change my judgement based on the number of complaints. I felt marginalized and thought others might have felt that way as well, under the circumstances. Upon reflection, I probably should not have written that post. Being human is no excuse for being rude. It had nothing to do with ideas we are discussing. |
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
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06-26-2005 10:35
From: Jonquille Noir I suspected you would stand behind it, but that doesn't make it anything more or less than schoolyard bullying and an obvious attempt at intimidation. I strongly disagree with your overly critical and hostile view of my polite request for moderator review. Further, since this qualifies as schoolyard bullying and obvious attempt at intimidation what would you call actual schoolyard bullying and an obvious attempt at intimidation? It's not that I don't appreciate reactionary hyperbole, it's just that labeling humble requests for moderation as second degree murder really doesn't give you much room to grow in the event of a real transgression.  ~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
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Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
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06-26-2005 10:39
From: Jonquille Noir Whether others agreed with Ulrika or not is beside the point. She still did it, and it was still a shitty thing to do. You sort of just further proved my point to Coco, Jonquille.
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Jonquille Noir
Lemon Fresh
Join date: 17 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,025
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06-26-2005 10:57
It wasn't a "humble request for moderation", it was a suggestion that others gang up on one poster by all reporting her. A humble request for moderation would have been a message sent to the forum moderators, humbly requesting they look at the thread/posts in question, and moderate. It wasn't labelled as second degree murder, it was labelled as schoolyard bullying and obvious intimidation tactics. Nice hyperbole yourself there. If you see calling a spade a spade as "overly critical and hostile" there's not much I can do to help you out there. Perhaps starting a campaign to get me censored might help? Strongly disagree with my views or not, nothing you've said has given me cause to reconsider them. From: Ulrika Zugzwang I strongly disagree with your overly critical and hostile view of my polite request for moderator review. Further, since this qualifies as schoolyard bullying and obvious attempt at intimidation what would you call actual schoolyard bullying and an obvious attempt at intimidation? It's not that I don't appreciate reactionary hyperbole, it's just that labeling humble requests for moderation as second degree murder really doesn't give you much room to grow in the event of a real transgression. ~Ulrika~
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
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06-26-2005 11:06
From: Jonquille Noir Strongly disagree with my views or not, nothing you've said has given me cause to reconsider them. That's so strange! Usually you're quite agreeable, kind, and willing to reconsider ideas when presented with facts to the contrary. Since you still disagree with how I have characterized my own feelings, thoughts, and actions, I must be the one who is incorrect. I guess I am a using transparent schoolyard bullying and obvious attempts at intimidation. Hmm, I wonder what a humble request for moderation would look like anyway.  ~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
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Kim Anubis
The Magician
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 921
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06-26-2005 11:14
Way cool, how this AR campaign makes posted concerns about individual persecution by a group of posters retroactively on topic. And now that they're on topic, there's no need to AR them for being off topic. Woohoo, how elegantly Ouroboros!
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Jonquille Noir
Lemon Fresh
Join date: 17 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,025
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06-26-2005 11:17
From: Ulrika Zugzwang That's so strange! Usually you're quite agreeable, kind, and willing to reconsider ideas when presented with facts to the contrary. Since you still disagree with how I have characterized my own feelings, thoughts, and actions, I must be the one who is incorrect. I guess I am a using transparent schoolyard bullying and obvious attempts at intimidation. Hmm, I wonder what a humble request for moderation would look like anyway. ~Ulrika~ A denial isn't a fact, it's just a denial. Prokofy often denied it's motives were to stir up shit and insult everyone it was envious of; did that make it true in your eyes? A humble request for moderation wouldn't have looked like anything to the forum, because it would have been sent in private, to someone capable of making the moderations you sought.
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
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06-26-2005 11:18
From: Kim Anubis Woohoo, how elegantly Ouroboros! ! ~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
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Jonquille Noir
Lemon Fresh
Join date: 17 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,025
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06-26-2005 11:24
From: Ulrika Zugzwang ! ~Ulrika~ Puppy! Oh, sorry.. Got distracted.
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Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
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06-26-2005 11:55
From: Ulrika Zugzwang That's so strange! Usually you're quite agreeable, kind, and willing to reconsider ideas when presented with facts to the contrary. Since you still disagree with how I have characterized my own feelings, thoughts, and actions, I must be the one who is incorrect. I guess I am a using transparent schoolyard bullying and obvious attempts at intimidation. Hmm, I wonder what a humble request for moderation would look like anyway. ~Ulrika~ Ulrika, Humility has never been your strong suit, and you know it. It does seem from this vantage point that you just wanted to stir the pot against Coco. Granted, she does a fine job of that unassisted. I don't think you did it to intimidate her though, I think you did it just to provoke a reaction about arbitrary and inconsistent moderation and she was a fun target for you. Plus, I think the real motivation is you are mad with power! PS - answer your damn email already.
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
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06-26-2005 13:42
From: Cristiano Midnight Plus, I think the real motivation is you are mad with power! Well, I wrote that post to make a point about multipost contextual harassment and to give an example of how the button can be used to politely ask for moderators to review of a person's overall affect on a thread. I wasn't upset and it's nothing personal towards Coco. She just happened to be the one who made the mistake of carrying on a parasitic off-topic thread in a larger thread in which I had interest. From: someone PS - answer your damn email already. I did reply to the first email with the secret FIC information. I haven't yet replied to the Snapzilla one but I will. ~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
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Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
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06-26-2005 13:46
From: Ulrika Zugzwang I did reply to the first email with the secret FIC information. I haven't yet replied to the Snapzilla one but I will. ~Ulrika~ I'll be damned, you did - Outlook decided you are spam. I guess Microsoft knows all about you
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Cristiano ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less. ~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more.
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
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06-26-2005 13:47
From: Cristiano Midnight I'll be damned, you did - Outlook decided you are spam. I guess Microsoft knows all about you Ha ha! Don't get me started on Outlook.  ~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
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reddish Tigereye
antisocial recluse
Join date: 12 Nov 2003
Posts: 151
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huh?
07-01-2005 14:36
From: Cocoanut Koala Reddish is female.
coco did i miss something? 
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antisocial recluse
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Zapoteth Zaius
Is back
Join date: 14 Feb 2004
Posts: 5,634
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12-15-2005 15:27
From: reddish Tigereye did i miss something? Did you? Bumped for further discussion (dared by Kris Ritter, its her fault, I swear)
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I have the right to remain silent. Anything I say will be misquoted and used against me.--------------- Zapoteth Designs, Temotu (100,50)--------------- 
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Hank Ramos
Lifetime Scripter
Join date: 15 Nov 2003
Posts: 2,328
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12-15-2005 15:35
If people don't agree with you, they will do everything they can to undermine, ban, and pummel you into the ground. Sounds like fun, huh?  |
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Margaret Mfume
I.C.
Join date: 30 Dec 2004
Posts: 2,492
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12-15-2005 15:40
Oh, wow, I remember this one! I got reported for talking about the pink pony around page 23 or so. Apparently it was considered off topic banter, hehe. Yea, it was pretty funny; as if that train hadn't derailed and set off on a new route at least a hundred posts before then.  I didn't know we rerun the classics during the holidays, what fun!
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hush 
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Zapoteth Zaius
Is back
Join date: 14 Feb 2004
Posts: 5,634
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12-15-2005 15:41
I swear this is the best responce to a necropost ever..
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I have the right to remain silent. Anything I say will be misquoted and used against me.--------------- Zapoteth Designs, Temotu (100,50)---------------
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Cocoanut Koala
Coco's Cottages
Join date: 7 Feb 2005
Posts: 7,903
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12-15-2005 16:06
From: Margaret Mfume Oh, wow, I remember this one! I got reported for talking about the pink pony around page 23 or so. Apparently it was considered off topic banter, hehe. Yea, it was pretty funny; as if that train hadn't derailed and set off on a new route at least a hundred posts before then. I didn't know we rerun the classics during the holidays, what fun! Haha, I remember you getting reported for that! Yes, everybody rerun the classics: "An SL Story," "It's a Wonderful SL," etc. (Somebody else feel free to reword such titles into something more edgy.) coco |
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DogSpot Boxer
vortex thruster
Join date: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 671
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12-15-2005 17:00
From: Zapoteth Zaius Did you?
Bumped for further discussion
(dared by Kris Ritter, its her fault, I swear) Thanks, Pal. I read about 10 pages of this thread before I realized it was a necropost. 
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Dogspot Boxer
Charter Member Of The Socially Inept Club
Our Motto:
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Zapoteth Zaius
Is back
Join date: 14 Feb 2004
Posts: 5,634
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12-15-2005 17:07
From: DogSpot Boxer Thanks, Pal. I read about 10 pages of this thread before I realized it was a necropost. Uhm, sowwy.. Its Kritters fault I swear it! Good to read up in SListory tho..
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I have the right to remain silent. Anything I say will be misquoted and used against me.--------------- Zapoteth Designs, Temotu (100,50)---------------
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Margaret Mfume
I.C.
Join date: 30 Dec 2004
Posts: 2,492
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12-15-2005 17:09
From: Cocoanut Koala Haha, I remember you getting reported for that!
Yes, everybody rerun the classics: "An SL Story," "It's a Wonderful SL," etc. (Somebody else feel free to reword such titles into something more edgy.)
coco Yes! And you didn't! hehe I remember checking with you to see if you had. I just couldn't believe that for all the mean, nasty shit that went down in this thread, I got reported for talking about the pink pony. And the best part was that I got told on Wednesday to "stop" talking to Loki when we had posted on Saturday. Whoa, way to stay on top of forum moderation. In their defense, I figured that I hadn't actually been brought to their attention until after I had made some not well received comments (no surprise there, eh?) a few days later. Best they could come up with off topic banter, phfft. All we need now is a sound clip of Bob Hope singing "Thanks for the memories."
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hush
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