Upsetting the Jones's

A few days ago, I noticed 2 of my 3 campers were wearing Sandwich boards. So I went over to see what it was about.
They said " click me " So I did and went to some promotinal office where there were lots of Avs all clambering to grab one of these sandwich boards and signs saying " MAKE MONEY" It was pretty obvious what was happening and I was really impressed with the idea.
Its like camping but the AV is mobile.
Now... I paid for 2 weeks of 100 hours a day with this advertising Co at 50K ( not cheap for 2 weeks) And I said to the owner I wouldnt want my store with people stood there advertising my direct competition and added I wish I could get them to goto sand boxes as thats the market type for the store anyway. He mentioned he could mass IM them and send them where he wanted...I found that a tad like a military operation but wasnt my company and they seemed profesional enough...made my a new sign , were punctual and polite etc

I saw one hanging about my store later that day. I must say I didnt think it looked too classy. Bit like I campers...they always give a store the a tacky desperate look ' we cant get customers by reputation alone so we buy our false traffic ' kind of thing. * But I have 3 so thats another story altogether*

Anyway after my night sleep, I wake up to find 2 IMs from the owners of Dazzle ( Bedazzle?) making threats of reporting me/them for soliciting and how upset they were that they paid a lot of money for advertising and how they didnt appreciate my spamming techniques.

I dont know how many of these 'carriers' were stood in their store. My honest feeling is as long as its not hoards of them and theyre not advertising your direct competition it wouldnt bother me.
I have no control over them and certainly WOULDNT advise them to go standing in high traffic areas. My own store has 14K a day traffic and at its busiest the last thing you need is some 'dead wood' adding to the AV lag. So I do appreciate the problem.


I believe the promotional company have a sign that tells these carriers not to camp on their land for people who dont want them there and I had ssumed these carriers would be camping and doubling up on their money as thats how I found them at my place

But the promo Co that controls them said they have had to put a stop to it as land owners dont like them advertising competitors stores whilst camping on their land,

So thats the story.


If it was my Co I would just tell them to do what they do normally...go shopping or socialising but no dont stand around in stores camping without the camp chairs!

Interesting to me though. Im pretty relaxed about advertsing infact having these people on my land is what made me to and pay 50K to the owners of the Co.
It depends how you look at it. Do you see an original idea of paying AVs another way to get more customers to your store apart from the camping or do you see it as a threat or spamming.

Im a little hazy on spamming. Doesnt that mean your advertising uninvited?
So if a woman walks about a store in a T shirt with the name of another store on the front...is that spamming?

I willl have to talk to these people who own these carriers and pay their wages. It seems like a good idea but needs to be properly organised regards the Dos and Donts

I tried to reply to the 2 people from Dazzle but got no replies...I 'think' they have muted me befire I had time to respond.

The last thing I wanted was a negative feedback from this but Ive paid a LOT of money and I cant just ask for it back..they wont give.

So the best I can do is try and advise them

Is there something in the TOS that would cover this? The co 'do' take seriously if ppl are upset but how much control does a person have over what other ppl wear and where they go in SL?

Seems Ive upset the Jones's with paying for what I believed was an original and very clever marketing idea.

LB

hehe i saw those billboards actualy and was wondering about it myself

I think they probably should not stand in some other guys dress store and advertise your dress store and use some judgement though but uh yeah i was wondering about them too

is it working? can you tell?

i'm curious honestly and I dont possibly see how some guy walking around with a billboard will be against tos but they should probably like move around at least once an hour that is my gut feeling about it really

I'm sorry to hear about your problems and rather fascinated. Never thought of walking billboards (WB). What a concept. Well a land owner can set rules and ban anyone they don't like but I can't imagine it being harassment unless the WB didn't go away. Could be a problem if the billboard was Mature in a PG sim. The TOS and CS weren't written with bots in mind. They would have to keep the number of bots in a single location low. No more then 3 or 4 as it might be considered malicious loitering (think w-hat welcome area sit in). Now if you could teach then tringo it would be gold. Or get them to interact with the world; pretend to shop and it would be almost flawless. I don't think it could hurt to call LL or email them and ask.

I don't think you have anything to worry about, conspiracy to loiter or loitery for higher don't sound like TOS offenses.

I would have Extreme reservations about this advertising technique Knowing i had No control over the conduct of these "Walking Billboards", Knowing thier every word, or action reflected upon My Business.
You have No idea who will be wearing your ad, or How they will behave if confronted by someone who objects to them being in, or near thier place of Business.
It wouldn't be my irst choice for advertising.

Angel.

Well its too soon to say if its working. It worked for them in the sence I clicked one TP to their store and handed over 50K so if it worked for them it should work for anyone.

Anyone in SL that has a unique and original idea ALWAYS gets my praise and respect. Even if it doesnt effect me directly I usually IM them and say how much I am impressed with their idea and believe they will succeed

I have a very nice looking well built and designed No Ad Strictly Prohibited sign the Co gave me and I wanted to pass them to the ppl in question but as I say I think they have muted me! lol

Why question some one and then mute them w/o hearing their reply?

Ive been in my store this morning and 2 of the carriers have TP in flew around and looked about...they werent hanging around like a bad smell in the doorways but I dont know exactly whats happened at Dazzle as I cannot get a reply.

If I knew more about it I of course will be talking to the promo Co and get them to organise their people better.

As I say if it was me..I would simply tell them to go about their SL as normal...tringo...clubs lol what ever and where ever.

Would I want someone in my store advertising my competition? Hell no!
But thats not the case here and I did say not to have them doing that. No visits to other texture stores

It must be hard though to completly control where these ppl go.

Its a new concept and a briliant one in my opinion but it needs some teething problems tweaking and from what I can gather they are responsible enough to change things as and when they become a problem.

At the end of the day they want their business to succeed too so its in their interest to get it right in the end.

Ill keep you posted.

And thanks for the feedback

I wouldn’t have a problem if someone walked into my store with a billboard advertising my competitor’s products. At the end of the day, customers only need to search the classifieds or 'places' to find my main competitors and if they cannot be easily found using search then they are not worth worrying about. If you are capable of paying 50K on an advertising campaign, chances are you pay allot for a classified ad or you have very high traffic and easily found in 'places'. So I think these billboard spammer are harmless enough...assuming they do not verbally abuse my customers or disrupt business etc.

I am not sure I would embark on this kind of advertising campaign though. The people being employed to wear these billboards are probably being paid a pittance and they are walking around with your company logo (and image) for everyone to see. Any offensive, abusive, derogatory comment they make whilst out on their spamming mission will be associated with your company. Before this thread I'd never heard of these billboarder's so if someone walked into my store with TRU stamped on their chest and called me a wanker I would blame you. So a good possibility of generating negative publicity here.

Yeh I see your point. Most people looking at these people will assume they are hired by ME and not simply paid to wear it.
Maybe if it had a rotating advert system ppl would realise.
But then thats likely to be laggy.

Wanker? Brit huh?

Its BE Dazzle not dazzle ( that explains a lot to me but lets not get too ugly)
This person/s have campers on their land.
These campers have apparently also got the ad board worn as they camp on his land ( exactly how I found them on mine)
Hes pissed because 'they are' making money on his land advertsing my store.

I TRIED to explain it wasnt my company..I didnt pay them directly and didnt send them there and had assumed and hoped the Ad co would of advised them not to do this already as they have made a sign for land owners who have camping to display saying campers or indeed anyone are not allowed displaying the Ad boards.
I TRIED to send him the sign and promised him I would be in touch with the marketing agency about their land but he kinda ignored me and went on to say " theyre you employees you tell them!"
I had to really break it down that theyre NOT my employees I am their client and one of many..if its not my logo on the boards it will be another and as such he needed to conact the agency themselves.

He said ' " you wouldnt like it if we had signs all over your land advertising our store!" I said " actually I wouldnt mind Im a big believer in cross promotion" ( which is true)
As long as its not the same field of product or content ie: your direct competition.

This is doing his business no harm what so ever. Its not loosing him customers or business. And if he wanted to take up the same deal those very same ppl can come and advertise on my land I dont display the sign.

Its a classic case of "get a life"

Im sorry I tried to be understanding and patient but getting at me like its all my fault doesnt seem fair.

All I can do is talk to the agency when hes back online and Im sure he will ensure they dont go there again...ranting at me about something I have no control over is pointless

He obviously thought I personally had sent a load of Bots ( hes used that term) there with my advert on and had them camping in masses!

Whether people likes these or not I suspect theyre going to be VERY popular.

Lb

Funny.

Yet I will add to my sim rules that this kind of advertisement isn't allowed

Traffic on my lands isn't so high that I would be bothered by random adverts on my land this way (though I'd love that to change). But if I saw one carrying an advert for my direct competition, that avatar would probably get banned very fast.

I am sorry that happen I don't know anything about the billboards.
Bdazzle has been one of the better places to hang, play games, camp out.
I appreciate them so much that they I rented some display shop space for letting me camp.

Unfortunately, this is one of the major problems with this kind of advertising technique. Say - for example - in RL you pay somebody a bunch of money to go around town pasting flyposters for your product. If those posters get placed irresponsibly, it's your brand and reputation that'll end up taking the flak from owners of property where the posters are placed. Nobody care's who the middleman was

B Dazzled has NOT muted anyone on this subject and we have responded to the appropriate parties. We do take full responsibility for our actions and stand firm to our beliefs. We do not appreciate billboard av's camping at our store without prior permission. We work very hard for our money and choose to help out newbies and our customers with a place to shop, have fun and make some lindens. We have a very busy sim. It hurts our business and our customers to have bot avs clogging up the camping spots that are intended for our paying customers. It causes lag, it fills up the sim so shoppers cannot get in and they are taking OUR money while advertising someone elses products. I find this a poor business practice and stand firm by our decision that they are not allowed in our stores. I ejected 5 of these bot avs in about 10 minutes. Before doing so I Imed them to let them know they were not welcome in our store. Not one of them responded or left willingly. As soon as I ejected and banned them I could see them trying to get back into our store. When I pay for advertising I am personally responsible for the content that is being advertised and how it is being presented. So to say they are not your employees and you have no control over them is just insane. If you pay a company to do a job then they are your responsibility. Now im told to keep them from coming to my property I have to place out an eye sore sign and use my prims that we pay for to place their sign. If a store owner is contacted prior and there are arrangements made and both parties agree to this type of advertising then so be it. We were not asked nor did we give anyone permission to advertise on our land.

Heh

The first thing I ever made in SL was a billboard I thought I'd wear to earn money. I stopped because at that time I was far from being able to network anything properly - and also I figured people would think I was being a pain in the ass. Seems I was right

It is also annoying to get bombarded with flyers, landmarks from strangers when I am hanging out with friends too.
If it wasn't for Ric's Place I wouldn't have ever made in friends in sl or wouldn't have much fun things to do.
I was bit confused by the OP's post myself I wasn't sure if they were saying someone was coming to their land,etc.
Bdazzle get swamped with people advertising, spamming its really gets bit too much sometimes.
I appreciate Ric for providing spot for people to go who are new to play scramble, dance and shop.
It one of best places in second life in my opinion.

I think they're an eyesore and would probably think worse of any retailer who used them.

I think I'd chock up the 50k as a mistake and ask them to discontinue it before it hurts you more. But that's just me.

Being a long time friend of Ric and Shannel, I've seen how hard they've worked to create their products. The time and effort put forth is amazing. I don't blame them at all for being upset at other encroaching on their land. If you spent hundreds of hours creating items would you want others taking business from you? Common respect people, you want to advertise do so the right way, don't take from others their time and hard earned money to better yourself.

What is 'camping'?

Thanks

H.

Uhmmm...yeah, Angel makes an excellent point.

Lillybeth:

I was at an infohub yesterday, and there was an avatar wearing a signboard advertising your texture store (I just looked at your profile, to see if it was you. Small world, eh?). The avatar was also chat-spamming (repeatedly typing the same thing over and over) for about 1/2 an hour. I simply muted, but many of the other residents didn't understand that they could do this, and, eventually a group of people joined together to push the avatar out of the infohub and into the next sim. All the while this avatar was annoying the hell out of everyone, your company name was proudly displayed.

Hm, I never thought about that. I have no intention of using these walking billboards, but I do offer free branded t-shirts in my store. I put that up after one customer asked for a branded t-shirt, but it never occurred to me that it could reflect on me badly if someone wearing a shirt with my logo on it started violating CS.

i have few campers on my shop i have 3 shops but i posted rules up inside for them
an i have it closely watched i will eject any one who does ads for other places i im them an they dont reply its soo tacky to have that .... gosh how eject button is so fun lol

My real life town has a bunch of restrictions on signs and billboards. As a result, businesses often take two appoaches.

Pay live people to hold signs, wear sandwich boards, and stand on the side of the street waving at people.

Buy a large vehicle (usually a junky van) and paint a sign on it. Park on the side of the road in front of the store.

As a result, it is much uglier that it would hav been without the restrictions.

My neice has a advertising HUD in the corner of her screen. She clicks on it every few minutes and she gets credited $1L. The ads cycle through on her screen. She can also click on the ads and getnotecards and landmarks. This sytem seems a bit more community-minded than the sandwhich boards.

Yep its a momumental error of drastic proportions!

The biggest waste of 50K I have EVER spent and the worst thing is it IS tarnishing my store with it all.

These 'carriers' stick a board on and then click it and TP to my store! So Ive had tons and tons of ppl hanging about the store advertising to people already there LOL
Not only that but they drag with them tons of 'wanna be' carriers all bugging my staff my customers asking where they can get a board from as they assume its us that pays them to wear them.
I hate to say it but the type of ppl makiing money like this are just horrible!

Its like the equivlant of uneducated teenagers hanging round the streets bullying and vandalising because their bored AND getting paid to do it!

At least with the camping chairs they have to stay in one spot so they get bored an go AFK

This is just Hell...Ive had to eject and ban 'carriers' and 'wanna be' noobs for hanging about with guns and vehicles...just causing LAG and trouble and Im so sorry for the upset this has caused anyone

Whilst its not my fault technically...I still feel responsible

I told the marketing owner I wanted my ad removing NOW but he said he was going to change this and make the rules more clearer..but you cant control these ppl they will do what ever they want and as long as they wear the board theyre getting paid.

Ive been told by one of the carriers hes been banned from 5 places in one day and the only ppl clicking the signs were other ppl wanting to make money then THEY come to my store looking for a board...

In theory it sounded a good idea but it practise...its a logistical nightmare

I will be damanding he removes my ad next time I log on. I he can keep the L$ I just want this to end.

LB

LillyBeth, you have my sympathies. I've reread your post a few times just to get it to sink in... I agree with you that it sounded like a good idea at first, but... the phrase that keeps coming into my mind is that the lowest common denominator, keeps on getting lower.

It's like they've never seen a sandwich-board before and don't understand how it's supposed to work. We have a few of them around my RL town. I'm always amazed they can find a single person willing to stand on the edge of a busy street in sub-zero temperatures. My mind boggles at the thought that in SL there's a growing mob of avatars wanting that 'work'.. and that a bunch of them would be so thick as to then stand around inside the place they are supposed to be advertising...

I can think of some ways that the idea could be better-implemented. For one thing, I would cut out the middleman. Everyone is going to assume that the 'carriers' are in your employ anyhow, so they may as well be. Second, I would alter the script somehow so that the employer could recall, cancel, or otherwise delete the boards either individually or en mass... the boards have to check in to a server anyways so it should be simple to implement such a function. And finaly, I wouldn't hand the boards out by the dozen to just anyone, but would actually 'hire' carriers, so as to ensure that those representing the business understood what was and was not acceptable. Maybe even have a 'click to complain' on the back-side of the board or something, a la 'how's my driving?' on trucks.

The sandwich board is kind of a more in-your-face or spammy extension of the 'profile picks'... how about store owners paying avatars a certain number of L$ per week, just for having your store listed in their picks? Keep a list of hires, check their profile picks at a random time/day each week, and as long as your pick is listed and they're still active, they get a few L$. (This idea is TM Atashi hahaha!)

Anyhow, that's my 2 L$... Good luck and I hope you reach an amicable resolution with the advertisment business.

-Atashi

A suggestion. Next time, try Aryn Lassard's AdHUD (SLNN.com AdHUD Article) system. It costs less per impression and delivers your message straight to a HUD worn by a player. I'm not an investor or owner, just a satisfied advertiser. Aryn has reinvented the camping chair in a manner that works for both advertisers, users, and is friendly to neighbors on your sim.