FBI 'probes Second Life gambling'

Reports CNET and Reuters today. Big implications around the corner??

http://secondlife.reuters.com/stories/2007/04/03/fbi-probes-second-life-gambling/
http://news.com.com/FBI+checks+out+gambling+in+Second+Life/2100-1043_3-6173057.html

-peekay

Just as I have said a million times on this board. Finally gambling in SL will head the way of the Dodo Bird.

According to the Reuters article LL invited them in to judge for themselves. I think it will be up to the lawmakers to determine where SL gambling falls in the law. They may have to make revisions to it. If however, the laws are changed to include SL then that will have some really big implications for everyone. Not just the casinos so I wouldn't get excited or anything. The economy could go south real fast.

My only comment at this time...

“In the Napster and Grokster cases, the courts … looked at it and said, ‘You set up a platform that has been used for infringing purposes.’” Kane said. “Linden Lab has set up a platform that allows gambling to occur. They’re not doing anything to promote it, but they’re not putting the kibosh on it either.”

I would say in the cases of Napster and Grokster, which by the way had a very well financially equipped complainant by the name of Lars Ulrich of Metallica, those platforms were singularly designed, implemented and serviced for the purpose of illegally exchanging intellectual property. There is little you can do or say to convince me otherwise. They do not compare to Second Life in any way.

In Second Life, yes, the platform can be and is used for at the very least, ATTEMPTS at operating POSSIBLY illegal gambling establishments, but that is a pretty insignificant implementation within the platform as a whole.

I think Linden Lab are on some pretty solid ground here, given the platform is intrinsically open, and not designed to support any particular purpose, inside or outside applicable laws or jurisdiction.

It just is what it is. I also doubt that anyone is converting enough Linden dollars to real dollars for the feds to reach any sensible cost/benefit analysis which would support an enforcement effort on any substantial scale. Casinos in Second Life are most likely at this point akin to, as one article sortof references, a poker game at billy's house after a long day of hard work, or a lottery pool. Technically illegal, but the cost/benefit for enforcement just isn't there.

Well as always nothing will come of it.........If always is comes up then goes away again....Nothing vchanges.....

i checked this "FBI" company, i have to say i am not interested by what they have to offer, its way too expensive.

I don't think we will have to wait for any new laws. As stated in the article, most lawyers agree that gambling in SL is illegal. That combined with all the talk about how LL could possibly be held liable, will more than likely prompt them to add a TOS line stating that gambling in SL is bannable. Why risk being shut down or being prosecuted? The fact that LL is brining the FBI here to check it out makes it obvious that LL is considering such a move and after reading the quotes and the lawyers' findings, I'd say LL will ban gambling sometime soon.

Gambling in SL is only illegal on Americas terms. Get some server farms going elsewhere, and the rest of us will be free to carry on ignoring the rules of the US like we always have done

time to get out of the casino biz

The Department of Commerce doesn't list them. Very suspicious..

I like Ginsu's proactive approach. It makes sense, in terms of not being on the blunt end of a new legal precedent.

In fact, it probably even protects the virtual casino owners. Better to get a slap on the wrist and a warning than... something far worse.

But it does raise the question:

What *other* questionable activities have FBI agents investigated?

Just a thought.


I'm actually very, very impressed. This was a very civilised approach.

Never know..........maybe the monitoring the underage users as well......

Wait and see is about all we can do. If it is said to be illegal, then I don't want to be anywhere near the economy of SL. The land market, the islands, the L$ will all crash very hard as everyone tries to get out at the same time.

The markets will slip a bit at first while the casino owners sell land and cash out and those who are only in SL for gambling cash out, but after that everything should recover as the population continues to grow and people concentrate on markets which are legal, which are plentiful.

So what are the regulations covering SL, what is legal & ok, if you make a sploder ball is it legal to make it only give back as winnings 70% of the money put in, 50% or 10%?
What about poker machines that are rigged to favour the house more than normal?

I even heard that their name is often connected to not "very clear matters"... and that in US itself, but also in other countries. What to think of that?

Morwen.

This case its gambling.....you risk to win... Your right.

I always thought it would be pretty clear that what goes on in SL would be covered by California law, but now there are servers in Texas too.

No doubt someone will open up a gambling server farm hosted in Uzbekistan, Moldavia or the Cayman Islands. I can well imagine A Certain player getting into the 3rd party server farm business soon. Place bets now!

Good idea. Then we can be free of the Adult Ageplay is Kiddie Porn nonsense that comes from across the pond.
*Ducks any objects thrown this way*

As an American, I can say that if there is profit to be made, then our goverment has to have it's sticky little gruby hands all in it. They just can't leave anything alone. They even try to regulate sports here. This kind of thing is just not worth the time or effort. And it pisses me off that this is the kind of thing they want to spend tax payers dollars on

Isn't the core of the excercise to limit the money laundering siuation? Its a thriving industry that uses gambling as one way of passing money through international boundaries, hence why the FBI are interested. It's the same with the taxtation element, whereby they can catch so many criminals on tax evasion charges easier than say actually selling drugs/crime etc.. (Al Capone).

Such activities wouldn't come under scrutiny if crime was attached to it somehow, I'm sure.

Consider the precedent this will set. Slingo, tringo, bingo, poker, lotteries, money balls, money trees and many give-aways will all now be regulated. Basically any event that awards Lindens will be regulated.

Checking my local and state laws I see that almost all of these are illegal or require permits. If Linden Labs has to regulate all this via ToS they may as well close the doors. They will never have the man power to monitor it. Underground Speakeasy type casinos and games will pop up everywhere.

If the FBI enforces the law by prosecuting Linden Labs for processing gambling proceeds via credit cards it is a statement that Lindens$ = US$.

Japan has this same situation in reality with pachinko parlors.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pachinko

What we need is a little tacit toleration. Especially since this is a global community. The US Feds shouldn't be dictating global values.

Nor should the EU, UN or any member thereof that wants to enforce their values on this global community.

The legality of different forms of internet gambling has yet to be determined. Localities that want to completely remove gambling are frustrated that they can't reach businesses outside their jurisdiction. Thus they are trying to come up with creative ways to extend their jurisdiction beyond their borders. Congress is trying to help by federalizing another state matter, despite the fact that regulating gambling doesn't appear to fall within any of Congress's ennumerated powers. The ultimate outcome will most likely be that U.S. interests will be put out of the gambling business, but the offshore gambling businesses will prevail, and take money out of the hands of U.S. gamblers and bring that money into the economies of other countries.

If Linden Labs is cooperating with the FBI, that's a move designed to protect them from liability. That's more than a hand-off policy; that's a forward step to preventing criminal activity from taking place on their service. I think the greater worry for Linden Labs has to be loss of revenue from gambling, rather than criminal liability.