Someone is using my Store/Club Name ;(

I don't want to send anything saying that I hold copyright over the name or whatever unless I do...I'm not a dishonest person. I assumed/hoped LL had some established thing within SL so that we can hold on to our store/club names. I told the guy that I would check into my rights with the name while I was talking to him, but it really didn't phase him. I wasn't trying to scare him by saying that, I really would like to take action against him if I can.
Looking back now though, I'd have named my brand something much different. In the end, that doesn't change a thing though, and I'm still kinda stuck in this situation. It may be worth it for me to talk to a lawyer over it, but I never wanted any of this to be a huge ordeal. I'm like the least confrontation (spelling?) person you would ever meet, but this has put me in a bad position.

Actually, having since checked the Knowledge base, LL does prefer that trademark violations be filed under the Abuse Reporting system:



However, some companies (but not, apparently, Linden Labs) do use DMCA filing forms for reporting violations. This does not mean that the claim is being filed under DMCA, but that the corporation in question directs DMCA and other intellectual property disputes to the same person/office for resolution. Personally, I'd like to see LL institute something more formal for trademark and patent violations--they deserve consideration beyond the Abuse Team, IMHO.

Kam

You do not hold the copyright on the name. You cannot hold the copyright on a Name, Title or "short phrase." Copyright only applies to complex texts, and the name of a club does not pass the test of complexity. You MIGHT hold the trademark--but only registering the trademark would prove that.

Kam

Unless you have this trade marked in RL theres nothing you can do.


If people are making a nice profitable business here in SL, i highly recomend they look into TMing their sl business name.

I'd extend that advice to people with successful GROUPS in SL as well. Registering a trademark is fairly expensive (around $350, not including search fees,iirc--and can run over a thousand if you have a lawyer do the work for you) compared to the cost of registering a copyright (around $45, at least for literary works), but it can save a lot of hassel when you're up against someone who just doesn't get that calling their business by the same name as your group is a violation of your IPs.

Kam

Good advice. And don't wait around about it because you never know when some new place may open using your name.

I just applied for a business license last week, and in my location it specifically states on the application that other people can use the exact same business name. Apparently, they figure that if you want protection from that, it's your job to register your business name elsewhere (trademark, I assume?).

I thought it was kinda strange, but I'm pretty confident my business name is unique


P.S.: In my area, I also do not have to get a business license if the business name includes my personal name or a "personal name dba business name" kind of name, I only had to obtain an actual business license for compliance with a client's billing processes.

.

We dump enough money into SL. Do you really expect us to copyright and Trademark every little thing we do in SL business wise? Trademarking costs a lot of money.

I work for the court system and let me tell you, taking it to court and going through all the legal procedures takes ages.

LL should have a creation date of the names, look at that, and compare it...then order the person to change the name.

The goal of keeping the business successful, making a satisfying return on investment, is forgotten once one starts thinking of the goal as restraining the behavior of others rather than achieving success for one's self.

Like I said, if your business is PROFITABLE, then IT IS WORTH IT!

My business name happens to be my RL last name so im not concerned.

If it werent, I would have TMd it ages ago.

If youre making crap money off of your products then dont do it.

If you are making a second (or first) income, its a VERY wise idea to get your SL business name TMd.

Lets say my business name was.. hmm "Grass" and i became very popular within SL. then, someone else came and began using the same name as mine and selling the same types of products. If they got theirs TMd, by law, id have to stop using the name thus crushing the business I built up.

Also.. its very possible someone in RL would start using the name..thats another scenario.


I know someone in Rl who has a clothing company called "Truth" and there is a "truth" here in SL. if the RL brand brings their (tmd) presence into Sl (Which is very possible in the future).. the "truth" in SL would have to stop using the name. This would no doubt have an impact on his current business.

It may be SL, but TMs still hold up.

It's questionable whether trademark law even applies to something that exists only in SL.

Agreed. As far as I know you can only trademark something you really own... basically, we don't own the pixels we see when we are in SL... even not when they are the land or objects we call our own.

In the time I played Ultima Online, there was a lawsuit about this (you can own houses there). Result was very clear, you only pay for the service the company gives you. You own nothing.

Morwen.

I would suggest creating an alt with your company name. "RaveNation beelblebrox..." whatever. You may have a case for AR if someone is using your av name as thier business name. The only type of name registration here is user based. It's kind of contrary to normal web hosting standards. It would be nice to see a SL DNS type service would resolve these issues and improve searches within SL.

=(

Negative.

You trademark/servicemark a name. ...not an object

Have you ever filed for one?

They ask for the letters or a jpeg of the WORD(s) you wish to TM.

You also have to tell them what you do...or what you plan on doing with it.

In SLs case i would think you would check 3d art/graphic design/providing services, or what have you. (if you were a content creator)

As far as a club..a virtual club. That does seem like a different story. Theres probably an option for "providing entertainment service in the form of _____________" and youd pick that.

SL is simply a platform.

If "aitui" was not my last name, and someone in RL owned a tattoo business called 'aitui' they could send me a cease and desist notice, regardless of if im operating in SL or not.

Yes, actually I did. Two years I ago did register the name for a dog-kennel I was planning over then.

Apart from other things, they wanted to know the goal where the name would be going to use. A shopname in a virtual world wasn't of the options. As far as I understood, there should be at least very clear RL reference and that only use in a "virtual world" was not allowed.

I will check this one of the coming days.

Morwen.

Companies like IBM are in SL too. I don't think I could open up a store using their name. So basically if I would TM a name in rl, you couldn't use it in SL and RL. Just my thoughts...

*waves at Morwen*

Mandy C

Yes, those names are RL trademarks.... that is the reference to RL. I think (and I will check this), if I would try to register a name for SL only (shop or otherwise) I may fails... but again, it is also possible that rules here differ from country to country.

*waves at Mandy*

The only way to know for sure is to actually try. HAS anyone registered a trademark based on their SL business? My guess is that, based on the application I've read at the USPTO, that you have to provide RL data for your company. (For example, a real world address as opposed to something like Da Boom 183/222/20.) Of course, the USPTO could issue a registration, and the courts could still throw it out when there's a dispute. (A really interesting case would be if an SL business registered before a RL business--who would win? I can actually envision going up before a Luddite judge who awarded trademark rights to the RL business because they perceive SL as "just a game". Just speculating here.) At any rate, so far, there have been no legal tests of contract law IN SL (though some tests of contract law with Linden Lab, e.g. Bragg vs. Whoever's-on-the-list-right-now) and until there is, there's just no telling where things could wind up.

Kam

reminds me, an SL business called International Business Management got their IPO approved by the World Stock Exchange this morning (click)...and their abbreviated symbol is IBM.

On the other hand I knew a Dutch company called C&N (www.cnn.nl) who was tapped on the shoulder by CNN (www.cnn.com).... Don't know who was first actually, but I think this rather small company didn't wanted to face the lawyers of the big CNN.
The small Dutch C&N changed name completely.

Morwen.

Does registering a TM differrentiate SL and RL? I thought the object of the system was to enforce exclusive rights to the originator, period. It surely shouldn't matter whether SL or RL was first, the originator would simply be the first to register.

*waves at Mandy and Morwen*

Well, I just called this afternoon the office that reserved the name I wanted to use for my dog kennel. I asked them to reserve a name in Second Life... I caused panic and I will be called back .

*waves at Bilbo*

Morwen.

Just called my legal dept. They said a TM is a TM, and it makes no difference if it's used in a virtual world or in RL.

*waves at bilbo*

Mandy C

Examine your advertising to be sure that you distinguish your Rave Nation as distinct from anyone else's. That way, when someone sees your ad, the person will not say, "Oh, I've been there before."

Identify your name and product with your store. A Rave Nation clothing shop is different from a Rave Nation camping pad and lag center.

I don't think the law of trademark helps here, precisely because Rave Nation has common prior usage. Someone who has a real life clothing store called Rave Nation might be upset when trying to expand business to SL and seeing someone trading under the name.

Linden Labs, of course, offers you no protection at all.