Real Life versus Second Life

Ah, wait until I have you in front of my camera again, BB.... then we talk again .

But seriously... someone who demands RL information about me, better find someone else to talk with.
What I give about my RL, I give because I want to.

Morwen.

Lol this is true; a lot of the "No drama" people - thrive on drama.

look forward to it Morwen - your photography is amazing

BB

They sure do


My av is "lucky not to be alive"...he's just a vehicle in my clumsy explorations around SL, and I change him around dramatically whenever I feel like it...

Like my in-world Profile reads; (I love caps)

""HE" IS MY VEHICLE FOR EXPLORATION & INTERACTION WITH THESE "3-D WEBSITES". (SIMS, ETC) & JUST A TOY/ACTION FIGURE" WHEN PLAYTIME COMES "

Either know you can elaps both RL and SL, ultimately RL != SL && Just SL

See thats fine to put, its clear and people know whats up with you-

I wouldnt have a problem being being a friend to someone with similair in their profile.

I would never online date anyone who had a profile that said something like that, of course.

A similar question about RL and SL was asked on a different set of forums. So, I'm reposting my answer here. Reader beware! It is long, boring and suffering from many ills.

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I'm not sure what kind of responses you are looking for, but the realities of SL are the most intriguing aspect for me. It is very real in spite of and because of the artificiality.

Primarily, SL is a communication medium - a glorified chatroom as others have said before. A very large difference is the visual element and the evolution of avatars from static images to something highly personalized. The act of dressing our avatars in skins, shapes, hair and clothing breathes life into it, both from a visual perspective and an emotional perspective. It imbues the avatar with some part of ourselves, conscious or not, and forges a bond between creator and created. Emotionally we become attached the avatar. As long as this isn't taken to extremes, this is not at all bad and can be very healthy and normal.

We find that we take both compliments and insults to our avatars personally, even when we think that it is silly to do so. "Why, I don't have legs this nice in RL, " we think. "It is ridiculous for me to feel to good that someone, some avatar, said that I have nice legs." But our avatars represent quite a bit about us personally. They are a reflection of our taste, our decision making processes, our beliefs about what is and what isn't important, and even wealth and priorities.

It's very similar to RL, really, except that we have stripped away what I like to think of our physical accidents of birth and showcasing our minds. Maybe my genes give me short, stumpy legs, or a scratchy voice, or I have a stutter, or I simply don't like my elbows or ears. Or maybe everytime I hear a New York accent, I think of a jerk lover who left me. Or everytime I see a certain hairstyle I think something stereotypically bad. Or I go weak in the knees when I hear a woman speak with a French accent. The SL interface allows me to interact with people without any of those auditory or visual clues that might make me unconsciously more or less likely to overlook who they really are. True, it also denies me some other signals in speech or appearance that can be useful and reliable indicators of other qualities.

I believe that SL is very real, more real than most people think. But the artificialities can be confusing as well -- and acted upon subconsciously. We may unconsciously note that an avatar runs her hand through her hair in a certain way, and associate it with someone we know in RL, unconsciously attributing some of that person's qualities to this new person. But did they consciously choose that animation? Was it a freebie that they hate and just don't know how to turn off? But these are the same things that can happen in RL.

I have felt some powerful and unexpected emotions myself in SL, and I still wonder about them. On the one hand, I am glad to have experienced them. On the other, I wonder how much was manufactured in my mind and attributed to other people. I doubt that I will ever know the answer to that, but again it is the same as RL. I can make the same false attributions in RL. I can wonder about the source of emotions in RL.

We meet and touch real people here in SL. Just as in RL, they may be dishonest, jerks, manipulators, apathetic, sadistic, sweet, loving, insipid, uninspiring or awesome. And they may be different in SL than they would be in RL. But if so, it's not because that isn't them in RL, it's because they are hiding that aspect of themselves in RL.

Earlier, I talked about mind as if it were separate from body, and we often make that distinction, but they are profoundly connected. The mind is directly influenced by the body and vice versa. By touching someone's mind, by getting to know the mind, we affect the body, we touch the body, we touch real flesh.

I think I've written enough to bore everyone to tears, so I'll stop here. I'm not sure how intelligible that was, and even I don't want to go back and proofread it.

-Jen

First one really needs to define "Real Life"....

-Infrared

When someone I just meet announces that "RL comes first" or "I keep SL separate from RL" - That is a red flag for me. It says that this person can make promises in SL and use the old "RL" excuse to back out of it or just delete the character and start alting.

Most of us do not demand name, rank and serial number of casual acquaintances we meet in RL or SL. That is a given. Someone so guarded about who they really are makes me concerned.

heh

I consider people who place RL before Second Life

and those who keep their second life seperate from their real life -

as grounded. More reasonbly stable. Perhaps come to terms with their escapism diversion.


My red flag is people who think Second Life should be the next Eharmony - Especially those who want to force the participation in the Eharmony stuff on others.

I got the Mixing and Matching my RL and Online socializing out of my system in 1998. I dont need a new Online/Offline drama lesson.

My Married Sister in law however - evidently hasnt learned her lesson yet - and recently went to go meet a man she playes online Card games with IRL.

*Wouldn't it be funny if it turned out to be her brother?*

with my Mother in Law, anything is possible

So having RL in the forefront is troubling to you? What promises are people making and breaking that cause such concern.? Sure setting a date and breaking it is rude, whether it is in SL or RL. But if you are making connections in SL that are that important you may want to rethink things. And there are "Poofers" I guess,but to say soemone who has to leave SL to attend to RL is doing something disingenous is ridiculous. Does it happen/ probably so. Is it the rule rather then the exception? I doubt it. When soemone you are with says they have to leave unexpectedly for "I have to take a call, the doorbell rang, the baby is crying, the dryer just exploded", whatever reason, do you automatically assume they are lying? If so add this one to your Paranoia Handbook: Crashes. Everytime someone disappears due to a crash, better ask them for a copy of their crash report, lest they be putting up another Red Flag.

that's your loss.
i learned it is prudent to keep the two separate. i remember once telling a guy the city i lived in. the odds were long that he would live in my city (remote, time of day) but hey hey he lived nearby. immediately he wanted to meet up, set up webcam, where do i work, etc etc. forgive me for keeping my second life a second life. when verification kicks in you will be able to demand verification provision of all your mates. im sure theyll be happy.

Someone who would claim "SL comes first" is someone I will be very concerned about.

To be honest.... for me? RL comes first. When my RL partner wants my attention (for what ever reason.... and keep your minds out of the gutter ^^) SL will lose big time.

Morwen.

I'm a musician in RL and SL as well as being a dragon in SL and human in RL. As such it's pretty much impossible to put up a barrier. People want to know where they can download tracks, buy CD's and whether I'll be doing any gigs in RL, etc., as well as demanding RL photos of me for promo stuff and such like. My character is pretty much the same in SL as I am in RL. I look different although I'd like to rustle up a few outfits / costumes based on some of my SL avatars to use for my RL gigs... that'd be great fun! I never even heard of role-playing until I landed in SL 2 years ago... make what you will of that.

Nina I'm sure a lot of us can attest to similar stories, some even worse, from either first or close second hand experience. My first day in world I met a person who would not stop questioning me, trying to pinpoint where I lived. Country became Area which become State, which became County, and still he wasn't satisfied. I live in a small town, so I used the bigger one nearby as"I live near Metropolis". He STILL was trying tio pin it down. One person I know from here was born literally down the street from me and turned out was actually at a relatives house less than a mile away one day as we were chatting. You never know, and you can't be too careful.

That's funny. One of my SL friends has several recordings out and I asked where I could get one. He too is one if those "Despicable" types who choose not to cross the streams. When he I asked, he uhmmmed a bit and sid shyly "Well the recording is in my name so......" it took a second for me to get it, but then I chuckled and dropped it. While acknowledging SL could be a great place to promote his work, right now maintaing his annonymity is more important, for whatever reason. i understand and respect that.

SL is a place that come to socialize and for entertainment and I give it the same importance that would any activity in real life that I do to socialize or have fun. Family and work come first, but after that SL commitments are on par with RL commitments.

As for mixing RL and SL, my personality is basically the same in SL as it is in RL. I just happen to look a lot different and have a different name as well. I don't hide information about my real life, though I likely will only give specifics if I really know you or if they are necessary.

I'm sorry, but I take REAL resentment to people who think I should have to divulge RL details in order to justify a friendship... at any time. It says in my profile I'm NOT interested in any RL interaction, and I mean it. I was stalked, beaten up, and nearly raped by someone who I met online, and who had LESS INFORMATION about my RL than what you friggin people are crying about not being given out freely here in SL. After thousands of dollars, years of grief, and a 1300 mile relocation I think I've earned my right to keep my RL out of this place, k thx. My trusted friends inevitably learn stuff about me, and i dont mind that...WHEN that info is volunteered by me. Im a very nice and caring person, but all that changes when someone without respect for my privacy wishes tries playing 20 questions with me. I would suggest to those who are soooo consumed by learning/verifying details about the people behind the avitars just eliminate SL as the middleman and try a damn dating service.

LOL!...EXACTLY...

Until I made my av ugly & changed my profile from friendly to cold/inaccessible, he got "hit on" all the time, & I got sick of explaining why "cyber-sex" does nothin for me.

Plus my RL Grrl is in SL, why would I need a million other "GF's"? She said she doesn't care if I have grrls "on the side" in SL, which I didn't expect, and I thought it would be funny to put in my Profile. It worked like MAGIC...nobody hits on my av, LOL. (well usually)

Some folks like "cyber" & that's cool...& I "flirt" w/ a few good "old" friends in SL...but there's enough porn & ladies ta go around in Chicago, even if I *was* single

Do you also feel that way about someone who has been consistently playing teh same avatar longer than you have yet maintains that rl/sl distinction?

If you do, then your attitude sets warning bells for me, as a potential stalker.

The RL/SL distinction is a curious one for me, because of the circumstances that got me into the game and have kept me there.

As I've mentioned, I'm part of the Duranie Influx of August 2006. This means that when I arrived in SL, I already 'knew' people there from other contexts--the whole message board network of Duran Duran fandom. Though it's a bit odd considering them RL friends, since I don't think I've actually met any of these people in the flesh!

Then I met and become involved with someone who also plays SL. As our RL relationship blossomed, our SL interactions became more frequent to the point that I finally got my own computer so I could play SL more than once a week.

This person is an avibender--her appearance in SL has certain distinct differences from RL. But there are also many similarities, particularly in personality. Because she is more open with some people than others about RL, I tend to be hedgy about divulging RL details about her.

As a consequence, I've become a bit hedgy about my own RL details, because our lives--First and Second--are so entangled.

I also feel it sort of breaks the fourth wall, almost, to address RL details in SL. I'll mention minor things, like the fact that I'm drinking wine, doing laundry, or dear-ghod-it's-3-AM-I-need-to-go-to-bed. But there's so much to see and talk about WITHIN Second Life it seems almost a waste to ignore it and go on about dreary reality.

me too!

I have to say that I completely respect people who wish to keep SL and RL separate, if that's what they choose. I play on SL with my RL husband and we agreed when I joined (he had already been a member for about 3 months before I joined), that we wouldn't divulge too many RL details and wouldn't start any SL relationship, so we are partnered in SL, as well. We reveal things when we're in our favorite club...maybe the state we're in, our ages, that we have children, but only in the context of the conversation. Those are the only things that anyone in SL knows about me, though. I know people who are married in RL, and to someone else in SL, and that's fine for them. My husband and I, however, choose to make SL an extension of RL in that we spend most of our time together. Hey, maybe we can't get a babysitter in RL, so we have a couple of drinks after the kids go to bed and party on SL! And can do it in our pj's. If someone is looking for a hook-up to carry into RL, then they should make that clear. I met my husband on Yahoo Chat, and never would have if it wasn't for that considering that he was in England and I was on the East Coast of the US. So, carrying virtual relationships to RL can work. But it can also be dangerous, which is why it took a loooooong time for me to reveal personal details to him on Yahoo. The same exists in SL. I have kids, and you never really know who the person is behind the avatar in SL. Maybe revealing that I have children, and my exact location/phone number, etc, would lead to dangerous or deadly consequences in RL. My avatar doesn't look like my RL self, but her personality is the same, so that is interchangeable with RL. I'm not a good enough actress to be someone else totally....LOL