Land-Do you really own or just renting

Im relatively new to SL, and have discovered to my dismay, that I am hooked!! I have decided to buy land and build a home. My questions is: What is the advantage of owning land over renting it?
Maybe Im a little dense, but after reading about land it looks like with tier fees you really are a renter. So If you shell out a load of upfront money to buy the land and then have to pay a monthly fee to someone, why not rent and pay only that without added tier fees?
Maybe Im not understanding the rules quite right, can someone explain to me. I have been reading thread after thread, and can't seem to find one that helps. And if this is the wrong place to post this question, I am sorry.

Really what you are doing is leasing.

You pay for access to space on a server "Land" , then you pay additional montly fees to maintain that access.

The Access (land) you "OWN" you can resell, depending on the going rate for a loss or a profit.


Edit -
(i was speaking of land you "buy" from Linden Lab - such and mainland or your own Island)

A lot of people rent quite happily from reputable landlords. There are a few unethical ones out there, too, I hear. It's important to know who you are dealing with if you decide to rent.

Renting adds another layer to the equation, so you pay X and X pays LL - which is usually fine but if X runs off, gets banned, takes back the land, or what have you, there is no recourse for a renter. Most landlords are well known by their good or bad reputation.

Ask around, look at your options. It's nice that we have many choices. It requires us to think and research, though.

Advantages of "buying" land from Linden Labs:

1--Yes, it's a lease, but unless the business tanks...you're not likely to lose it. Renting from private island owners or condo owners leaves you subject to their whims. Generally, most of these people are very good...but are, by definition, less stable than LL (as they are, in fact, leasing the land you rent from LL).

2--You have no 'restrictions' on what you do with your land. Many landlords impose special rules on renters. These rules are generally like Housing Association rules where everyone is required to build or design a certain way in order to make the neighborhood beautiful. Some like those restrictions and the resulting 'beauty'...others hate having someone else tell them what to do on land they pay for.

3--If you buy large enough parcels, your tier fee is actually LESS than it would be if renting from someone. Remember...they are still paying tier to LL...so they have to charge you at least the minimum that they are paying...and generally add a little more. If you would otherwise buy, say, a 1024 sq. m. plot...you're in good. If, however, you are looking to own 16,000 meters...it's cheaper to buy.

As mentioned, it is leasing. When you "buy" land on a private estate or rent, you have to deal with a middleman, who needs to at least cover expenses and then make some profit. I use the best of both worlds, renting tier from a land baron which he has donated to a group, and use that for my mainland plot I'm surprised we don't see more of bulk renting of tier and tier alone; it would make a great business model. The only problem is one must be educated in land matters enough to know about groups using land, tier donations, etc.

If you rent on one of my private island sims there are NO monthly fees. Weekly rent, pure and simple. No risk of huge losses as others have complained of here. No fear of landbots, no fear of honest mistakes turning into costly errors. And with so many terrain styles to choose from, and so many home types to choose from, do you REALLY need to terraform and build your own house, with all the cost and risk that goes with it? (Read the thread about the girl who bought a beautiful sea-front lot, then after purchase found her surrounding plots suddenlty sprouting ugly rotating porno ad-boards).

Eight of my tenants have left in the past to buy their own land and do their own thing. Five have returned, all with bitter stories. Don't know what happened to the other three.

It's a personal choice in the end, but beware of the risks. The forums are littered with stories of huge losses, fraud, and other horror stories. You will be hard pushed to find many stories of renting that has gone wrong (and the maximum risk anyway is usually just 1 week's rent).

Yay! The first of many ads to come on this thread! *Groans at commercialism*

You are never really buying land in the sense that you do in RL. Well, actually, in RL "ownership" is a legal fiction anyway, but let's not get into that.

What someone is doing when they "rent out" land in SL is subletting. There are no regulations as to how they sublet; the landlord (LL) doesn't care, so they can kick you out at a moment's notice because they don't like the colour of your hair, or they get bored, if they want to. Now, if they are decent landlords they won't, and they will respond to land disputes far, far faster. But you are always, by definition, taking more of a risk by taking a sublet than leasing directly yourself, as there are two sets of people who can throw you out rather than one, and LL themselves are very unlikely to unless you're trying to set up a Nazi child porn establishment.

Don't forget, private continents might also have some *very* eccentric people with estate manager powers too! Who might be into guns and things, or god forbid, be closet Socialists... *gasp!*

grins

I look at tier as property taxes.

There are some very odd definitions of buying land in SL. Generally all of it is leased, this is where tier fees come in. However I've seen land for sale that cannot be subdivided, joined or resold. I personally wouldn't consider that as buying land.

I am a land owner, the advantage I see is that if I'm here for the long term then buying land on the mainland will be cheaper for me. If I was unsure how long I'd be staying, I'd rent. However as someone above pointed out, the more land you own, the better the value of your tier fees (mainland I'm talking).

Ditto. To compare SL land to real world land:

Buying Mainland (or buying an entire island from Linden Lab):
You have mainland which you can buy, and pay monthly "taxes" to Linden Lab. The only risk you have is if the "government" (LL) decides to reclaim your land, or if the government is ousted and your rights to the land are lost.

Buying Estate Land:
You 'buy' land from the landowner (who has already bought it from LL). And you pay "taxes" to the landowner (who then passes it on to LL after taking a cut for profit). The risks are that the person may fail to pay "taxes" to LL, and the land will be reclaimed despite the fact that you've fully paid your taxes. The estate sim could be sold out from under you, by the landowner. Less likely, the landowner may decide to kick you out for no reason. You have less recourse with a potentially anonymous landowner than you do with Linden Lab. The benefit is that you have all the priveledges of land ownership (setting media streams, and various other land options).

Renting:
You don't have to pay an upfront fee to 'buy' the land. You simply pay a rental fee to the landowner, who then takes a cut and passes the rest to LL to cover 'taxes'. You typically have to join a group, and set all of your objects to that group so they won't auto-return. And you have to go through group methods to deal with media streams and other land options.

It is quite true, one wouldn't want to risk that sort of thing. Why, they might appropriate your land for the people, wipe all your poseballs and set up a firing range, and you would have no choice in the matter!

I rent a house on an island and I absolutely love it. You have to weigh how much you're willing to invest and how much commitment you want to make. Renting, you don't usually have to come up with a large chunk of money upfront. I just pay the rent box out front. There was no downpayment . If the surrounding area goes downhill you can just move. When I lived on the mainland, I returned home one day to find my new neighbors had erected a massive granite plateau next door, causing my ocean view on that side to become a view of a rock wall looming over me. If I had owned that land I would have been really upset. If you do buy on the mainland, bear in mind that your neighbors can terraform in ways that affect your view, erect obnoxious rotating signs and do all manner of annoying crap. If you can afford to buy enough land so they're out of your view that won't be so much of an issue. If you're looking for a small starter plot, I would recommend renting first--it's a good way to learn what you want out of a land purchase, and what you can/can't tolerate.

Second Life mirrors First Life in this respect. Only a raving lunatic thinks they can own a piece of the Earth in First Life let alone Second Life.

Putting aside the semantics the key difference between owning "mainland" land versus "covenant" land/renting is that with convenant land/renting you're adding a third-party (another resident) to the transaction. You're engaging in a "trust exercise." By owning "mainland" land (a parcel in which you pay tier fees directly to Linden Lab) you avoid the "trust exercise" and reduce your risk.

If you've ever read a thread in the forums along the lines of "I purchased land on a private island and the landlord kicked me off and didn't give me my money back and they're a bad bad person and I need to let everyone know what a bad bad person they are and how this should've never happened to me because I'm made from unicorn dust and candy rainbows" then you're reading a thread by a person that decided to engage in the "trust exercise" and lost their covenant/rental land as they failed to reduce their risk.

This is a totally offbeat answer, but the reason to be in any one particular place is... other people.

A lot of private sims are community places. That's why people like to be there; their friends frequent those areas and there's a high degree of commonality - the sort of person you would *want* to talk to. Furnation, Gor sims, Elven lands, Caledon &c &c.

It's quite a difference for instance, 'owning' a bit of mainland only to have a hentai store and a camping pad establishment spring up on both sides of you, say, compared to an address on Penny Lane in Caledon.

Then again, if you want to open a hentai store or have a dozen dancepads running 24/7, then a private sim isn't likely for you...

Mainland forms community too; what I really miss are the first land noob ghetto sims. Ugly, but delerious fun when you are new! Everyone's new, everyone's learning, everyone's excited. Or at least before the automated land speculation modified all that. Ah well. Good memories.

I rent from Rock, see above, I can honestly say I love his Sims they're so beautiful & for me buying isn't an option, I wouldn't want to still be paying monthly after 'buying' .. plus like people say if I didn't like the new neighbours/buildings/porn ads I could easily move on .. not that that'd be a problem where I am =) Definitely renting for me

I think there is one element that is missing here...
I bought land - a lovely piece of hillside, no one around and views forever out over the ocean.
Within a few days all the land around me had been taken up and all kinds of rubbish thrown up around me. On one side an estate had erected a massive wall up agains my back fence.

No more view, and surrounded by ugliness. This is the risk when buying land.

A friend suffered the same fate at another mainland piece of land. So she lifted her house up in the sky to enjoy the veiws again. The next day when she looked out her windows she was greeted by stupid red no entry tape in every direction, so her view was again destroyed.

A few days ago I rented an apartment. Very modern, and established and no one is stuffing up the view. If they do I can move to another apartment.

I also believe that the economics of buying versus renting leans towards renting - its cheaper and you dont need a premium account.

just my few cents worth,


Space

It's true though, what happened to Space. I bought a nice little piece in Highflyer, no one was around us, low-lag, great view. Next thing I know, surrounded on all sides by a massive hideous casino. So you really do have to be careful about where you buy.

It is cheaper to rent, yes, but... I don't know. I've been burned in the past with renting. Rented an entire island once, was supposed to be for the entire month, and then with the option of continuing to rent, got one one day, and I had a message from the owner informing me that he had decided to use the island for something else. I did not get my money back.

Hello Melah! *wave*

Owning gives a level of control over the parcel that you don't get with renting. By owning, I mean going premium and buying mainland from LL on one of the major continents and their nearby islands (Governor Linden is the estate owner). If you purchase estate land on a private island, you are typically subjected to someone else's rules. Both sides come with pros and cons; mainland is typically anarchic and you cannot predict what your neighbors will do to your view, but estate land is fraught with higher risk of losing your investment. You can ask me in-world about it and we can discuss it at length.

My first home on SL was a tiny rented cottage in a small group of 4. quiet, good landlady, just a place to call home, no longer changing clothes behind a bush in NCI, and a place to rezz all my nice freebie furniture and bits and pieces. Good memories of that home.

Then i got a place on Caledon with Desmond (see above post). I rent that land from him, he pays the tier, and sure, he takes a cut for his profit but he gives you security (completely trustworthy) and a fantastic artistic and social environment. I paid an upfront fee and weekly rent there, until someone close by wanted more prims and bought my parcel from me at a very good price, and i moved to another piece of Caledon land.

I also rent a parcel on a beach, from a reputable landlady who doesnt believe in 'Cookie Cutter' land (this is where you get a piece with a two meter strip of water around it and they call it 'waterfront'. Her Sims are properly landscaped and the covenant protects you from ugly constructions springing up overnight. Worth every penny i pay for it.

Another thing to consider before you rent, these days, is if the landlord or landlady intends to mark the land as adult when verification comes in. If you verify, this wont matter, if you dont, it will. Since the landowner is being held responsible for activity on their land, the owner has to protect themselves, as they see fit, so it might be worth asking. I have asked both my land owners if they will flag the land as adult. one will, one wont... I will lose one when verification comes in, if it comes as LL are planning, as i will then be banned from my own land.

Good luck with whatever you choose

regards, Imogen

Subject to 'acts beyond the control of LL' or other unforeseen circumstances, if you own land it's yours to do what you like with. I'd recommend owning your own land. The only disadvantage is that your neighbours can also do what they like with their land and, as you can find on these message boards, not all neighbours are good. I've never had any neighbour problems but perhaps I'm lucky.

Yeah, no plans on flagging sims adult here.

I've talked to many residents who might have more risque stuff out but none (so far) have interest in assigning adult status for their own sake. One is likely to easily pass off a Statue of David's prim wee wee as art...

Though as I understand it, the 'adult' flag will work on a parcel level and not a sim level.

Amazingly, one can show a bit of ankle in Caledon and the modern world doesn't seem to be shocked by this...

Buying on the mainland means you have complete controll of your land and most importantly no-one can take it away from you (except linden labs if they permanently expell you from second life).
I consider this closer to RL buying and paying property tax than it is leasing (except for the fact that the tax is much higher in SL)

Buying on a private island is leasing.
There have been many threads where a bad landlord stole land from someone they "sold" land to.
The accused has never been one of the major landlords to my knowledge (they are trustworthy)
However even for the most trustworthy landlord relying on a 3rd party means you are at risk if they die or go broke or simply leave SL. No-one lives forever.

Renting on private islands is a good idea for people who want to be away from all the mess of the mainland but dont want to deal with the risk of "buying" on a private island

Which you choose depends on your mindset
-Mainland buying for those who like complete controll of their own destinys.
-Private island renters/leasers for those who want to be away from all the griefers, clubs, casinos and ugly billboards of the mainland.

My favorate is well chosen mainland on a quiet sim with each landowner owning a large proportion of the sim and your land surrounded by protected land.