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Ari Acropolis

Registered User

Join date: 16 Aug 2006

Posts: 10

06-01-2007 21:05

From: Maggie McArdle

i agree totally with you on the first part of your post. it is offensive. yet i am hearing fewer and fewer reports in reagrd to this, due to the part that i personally do not participate and or hang around those who do participate in that particular bit of "play". yet sad as it is i knwo they are out there. like i said its a choice. many here do things that they would never do in rl. i am in no way condoning it. just saying you cant have your cake and eat it to. You cant have one aspect w/o an opposite, usually an extreme one, on the internet.

keep in mind those that do such things are doin it for the shock value, and to get a reaction. once they dont get the one they expected, they move on.

whats really at stake here is not the right to do as one wishes, but the choice to do so. all it will take is for one to see something they thmeselves find offensive, and the witch hunt begins. right now its the hunt for avas shorter that 5'8, next it will be the furries. whats that poem? that ends with: then they came for me and no one was there to defend me.

Actually, as Sarah Nerd pointed out in another thread, furries are already doomed, or at least they won't be able to have sex in-world anymore.

Livinda Goodliffe

Squeaky Wheel

Join date: 28 Dec 2005

Posts: 215

06-01-2007 21:21

Heey, aren't we all adults here or what?

_____________________

Maggie McArdle

FIOS hates puppies

Join date: 8 May 2006

Posts: 2,855

06-01-2007 22:33

From: Livinda Goodliffe

Heey, aren't we all adults here or what?

not accordign to the LL

_____________________

There's, uh, probably a lot of things you didn't know about lindens. Another, another interesting, uh, lindenism, uh, there are only three jobs available to a linden. The first is making shoes at night while, you know, while the old cobbler sleeps.You can bake cookies in a tree. But the third job, some call it, uh, "the show" or "the big dance," it's the profession that every linden aspires to.

Kidd Krasner

Registered User

Join date: 1 Jan 2007

Posts: 1,938

06-01-2007 23:51

From: Ciaran Laval

Sexual ageplay very much has something to do with BDSM. It's a control issue. Get your facts right.

I agree for the adult/child forms, but not, for example, for the pair of high school students forms.

The whole subject is far more complicated than people are willing to deal with.

Tegg Bode

FrootLoop Roo Overlord

Join date: 12 Jan 2007

Posts: 5,707

06-02-2007 00:23

From: Maggie McArdle

not accordign to the LL

Who can't seem to work out how they got in during the 6month long "create multiple unverified chars free" promotion.

_____________________

Level 38 Builder [Roo Clan]

Free Waterside & Roadside Vehicle Rez Platform, Desire (88, 17, 107)

Avatars & Roadside Seaview shops and vendorspace for rent, $2.00/prim/week, Desire (175,48,107)

Maggie McArdle

FIOS hates puppies

Join date: 8 May 2006

Posts: 2,855

06-02-2007 00:34

From: Tegg Bode

Who can't seem to work out how they got in during "create multiple unverified chars free" promotion.

_____________________

There's, uh, probably a lot of things you didn't know about lindens. Another, another interesting, uh, lindenism, uh, there are only three jobs available to a linden. The first is making shoes at night while, you know, while the old cobbler sleeps.You can bake cookies in a tree. But the third job, some call it, uh, "the show" or "the big dance," it's the profession that every linden aspires to.

Suzy Hazlehurst

Offensive Broad

Join date: 14 Oct 2006

Posts: 323

06-02-2007 02:20

From: Ciaran Laval

I find nothing wrong with the policy. If someone passes me RL paedophile or rape pictures I will not hesitate to AR them.

Of course that is only *part* of what the blog is talking about. What would you do if you were walking around a place called 'sex alley', got handed a warning about forced fantasy play going on there, and then saw a female avatar 'pushed' up against the wall by a male avatar, and 'assaulted' while emoting fear?

That is *not* real rape, *nor* do people who engage in this kind of activity condone real rape, you were warned that that was the kind of roleplay the sim was about so you could have stayed out if it offends you. Reason to AR? In my opinion that would be ridiculous, there is no crime there. Yet LL's latest policy blog lumps this together with things as heinous as RL child rape and asks us to snitch on those consenting adults roleplaying a fantasy.

I am broadly offended by the lumping together of virtual fantasy violence and RL violence. I have been in such an alley in that position up against the wall. The male in question was a furrie, which no doubt adds another AR-able offence under these new rules. Not really my thing, but it was fun to try it once. Now I have to learn that as far as LL are concerned my behaviour at that moment was as 'broadly offensive' as the behaviour of a *RL child rapist*?

They need to change their tune quickly, and they owe me and a *lot* of other Residents a *big* apology.

Rascal Ratelle

Registered User

Join date: 28 Jul 2006

Posts: 62

06-02-2007 03:16

Please state the rule that says just wearing a furry av is now an AR'able offence.
How is a furry have an AR'able offence?
and please do NOT say beastiality because furry does NOT = beastiality.
I have YET tosee ANY fur engage in what is beastiality.
Beastiality mEANS human having sex with an animal.
A fur having sex with a fur is NOT beastiality.
SO AGAIN, how is just wearing a furry av an AR'able offence and underwhat rules?

Broken Xeno

~Fething Alt~

Join date: 9 Mar 2007

Posts: 632

06-02-2007 03:39

I don't think anyone said being a furry is an ARable offense.

_____________________

Leanne Karas

Registered User

Join date: 22 Feb 2007

Posts: 126

06-02-2007 04:57

From: Suzy Hazlehurst

I am broadly offended by the lumping together of virtual fantasy violence and RL violence. I have been in such an alley in that position up against the wall. The male in question was a furrie, which no doubt adds another AR-able offence under these new rules. Not really my thing, but it was fun to try it once. Now I have to learn that as far as LL are concerned my behaviour at that moment was as 'broadly offensive' as the behaviour of a *RL child rapist*?

They need to change their tune quickly, and they owe me and a *lot* of other Residents a *big* apology.

Hear Hear!

Ciaran Laval

Mostly Harmless

Join date: 11 Mar 2007

Posts: 7,951

06-02-2007 05:03

From: Suzy Hazlehurst

Of course that is only *part* of what the blog is talking about. What would you do if you were walking around a place called 'sex alley', got handed a warning about forced fantasy play going on there, and then saw a female avatar 'pushed' up against the wall by a male avatar, and 'assaulted' while emoting fear?

Suzy my issue is with RL photos, if I'm walking around sex alley and I saw a scene like you described then that would be my fault for ignoring the warnings. Nothing to report there.

However if sex alley had a wall with a texture of a RL rape scene...then yes that's something to AR.

Suzy Hazlehurst

Offensive Broad

Join date: 14 Oct 2006

Posts: 323

06-02-2007 07:04

From: Ciaran Laval

Suzy my issue is with RL photos, if I'm walking around sex alley and I saw a scene like you described then that would be my fault for ignoring the warnings. Nothing to report there.

That is just the point. You said you saw 'nothing wrong' with Linden policy. Part of that policy is that they are now asking us to report just the kind of scene I described. To quote the blog post in question (my emphasis):

From: someone

Real-life images, *avatar portrayals*, and other depiction of sexual or lewd acts involving or appearing to involve children or minors; real-life images, *avatar portrayals*, and other depictions of sexual violence including rape, real-life images, *avatar portrayals*, and other depictions of extreme or graphic violence, and other broadly offensive content are never allowed or tolerated within Second Life.

The sex alley scene I described is a form of 'avatar portrayal' of sexual violence, and apparently to the Lindens it is as 'broadly offensive' as raping a living breathing child in real life and spreading pictures of that child-rape. I am deeply offended by this.

VooDoo Bamboo

www.voodoodesignsllc.com

Join date: 4 Oct 2006

Posts: 911

06-02-2007 07:09

Great job Lindens.... Alot of us support you! Keep up the great work.

Rascal Ratelle

Registered User

Join date: 28 Jul 2006

Posts: 62

06-02-2007 17:47

From: Ari Acropolis

Actually, as Sarah Nerd pointed out in another thread, furries are already doomed, or at least they won't be able to have sex in-world anymore.

What thread is this?
SEx between two furry avs is NO diffrent then sex between to human av's , from what I have seen, the act of sex between two furry av's is exactly the same as sex between two human av's
From what I ubderstand furries are not doomed
LL will NOT ban account based ONLY on the typ of av they wear. they will base this off of actions.

Plus according to the current AR system, don't you have to proove you accusations?
Usualy when LL bans some one or shuts down a sim it's becuase they have found proof to back up the AR they are investegating. And no, LL is not obligated to release that info to the public.

Ciaran Laval

Mostly Harmless

Join date: 11 Mar 2007

Posts: 7,951

06-02-2007 17:54

From: Suzy Hazlehurst

The sex alley scene I described is a form of 'avatar portrayal' of sexual violence, and apparently to the Lindens it is as 'broadly offensive' as raping a living breathing child in real life and spreading pictures of that child-rape. I am deeply offended by this.

Indeed, read it wrong. If they're going after avatar's engaging in that sort of action and the avatar's are adults then I agree that that is a bridge too far.

John Toonie

Registered User

Join date: 3 Jul 2005

Posts: 58

06-02-2007 18:10

Quite honestly, LL needs to get age verification working however they plan to do it, either through parental controls, or their whole personal info mess and just adopt a behind closed doors policy. If your going to do ADULT anything, do it in a mature sim, behind 6 closed prims, and let that be the end of it. any PUBLIC sex areas, must have the adult content tag.

Simply boil the situation down to, if your going to partake in non pg material, it must be in a mature sim behind closed doors, or in an adult content tagged area. Then the only way anyone can be offended is A: they don't read the parcels information. B: they're a peeping tom and have no business looking anyways.

I think LL is forgetting, this is supposed to be an adult only grid, just because they opened the flood gates to minors, doesn't mean the rest of us can be denied our rights as property owners to use our property as we see fit.

Anyone banned from SL because of this announcement could infact sue LL for termination of their property lease (yes, under legal terms when you buy property, you are leasing the server usage from LL) And possibly be awarded the value of said property in terms of how much they paid for it when they recieved the lot, and the monthly fee they had to pay for said property. But that is also a case by case thing, and in some states, wouldn't hold water.

Honestly I think LL needs to hire a webhost/isp attorney to help them sort out their TOS. So they aren't using a TOS, but instead a monthly renewed bandwidth lease contract.
Which you would have to agree to monthly by typing your initials or something like that. It would stop them from making crazy rules that legally can't hold up, and cover them. Minors can't legally sign contracts of any sort, so IF there were any minors on the main grid, LL could remove them immediately and not have to return their money, because they were in void of the contract.

Attention Lindens:
Ari Acropolis Registered User Join date: 16 Aug 2006 Posts: 10	06-01-2007 21:05 From: Maggie McArdle i agree totally with you on the first part of your post. it is offensive. yet i am hearing fewer and fewer reports in reagrd to this, due to the part that i personally do not participate and or hang around those who do participate in that particular bit of "play". yet sad as it is i knwo they are out there. like i said its a choice. many here do things that they would never do in rl. i am in no way condoning it. just saying you cant have your cake and eat it to. You cant have one aspect w/o an opposite, usually an extreme one, on the internet. keep in mind those that do such things are doin it for the shock value, and to get a reaction. once they dont get the one they expected, they move on. whats really at stake here is not the right to do as one wishes, but the choice to do so. all it will take is for one to see something they thmeselves find offensive, and the witch hunt begins. right now its the hunt for avas shorter that 5'8, next it will be the furries. whats that poem? that ends with: then they came for me and no one was there to defend me. Actually, as Sarah Nerd pointed out in another thread, furries are already doomed, or at least they won't be able to have sex in-world anymore.
Livinda Goodliffe Squeaky Wheel Join date: 28 Dec 2005 Posts: 215	06-01-2007 21:21 Heey, aren't we all adults here or what? _____________________
Maggie McArdle FIOS hates puppies Join date: 8 May 2006 Posts: 2,855	06-01-2007 22:33 From: Livinda Goodliffe Heey, aren't we all adults here or what? not accordign to the LL _____________________ There's, uh, probably a lot of things you didn't know about lindens. Another, another interesting, uh, lindenism, uh, there are only three jobs available to a linden. The first is making shoes at night while, you know, while the old cobbler sleeps.You can bake cookies in a tree. But the third job, some call it, uh, "the show" or "the big dance," it's the profession that every linden aspires to.
Kidd Krasner Registered User Join date: 1 Jan 2007 Posts: 1,938	06-01-2007 23:51 From: Ciaran Laval Sexual ageplay very much has something to do with BDSM. It's a control issue. Get your facts right. I agree for the adult/child forms, but not, for example, for the pair of high school students forms. The whole subject is far more complicated than people are willing to deal with.
Tegg Bode FrootLoop Roo Overlord Join date: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 5,707	06-02-2007 00:23 From: Maggie McArdle not accordign to the LL Who can't seem to work out how they got in during the 6month long "create multiple unverified chars free" promotion. _____________________ Level 38 Builder [Roo Clan] Free Waterside & Roadside Vehicle Rez Platform, Desire (88, 17, 107) Avatars & Roadside Seaview shops and vendorspace for rent, $2.00/prim/week, Desire (175,48,107)
Maggie McArdle FIOS hates puppies Join date: 8 May 2006 Posts: 2,855	06-02-2007 00:34 From: Tegg Bode Who can't seem to work out how they got in during "create multiple unverified chars free" promotion. _____________________ There's, uh, probably a lot of things you didn't know about lindens. Another, another interesting, uh, lindenism, uh, there are only three jobs available to a linden. The first is making shoes at night while, you know, while the old cobbler sleeps.You can bake cookies in a tree. But the third job, some call it, uh, "the show" or "the big dance," it's the profession that every linden aspires to.
Suzy Hazlehurst Offensive Broad Join date: 14 Oct 2006 Posts: 323	06-02-2007 02:20 From: Ciaran Laval I find nothing wrong with the policy. If someone passes me RL paedophile or rape pictures I will not hesitate to AR them. Of course that is only part of what the blog is talking about. What would you do if you were walking around a place called 'sex alley', got handed a warning about forced fantasy play going on there, and then saw a female avatar 'pushed' up against the wall by a male avatar, and 'assaulted' while emoting fear? That is not real rape, nor do people who engage in this kind of activity condone real rape, you were warned that that was the kind of roleplay the sim was about so you could have stayed out if it offends you. Reason to AR? In my opinion that would be ridiculous, there is no crime there. Yet LL's latest policy blog lumps this together with things as heinous as RL child rape and asks us to snitch on those consenting adults roleplaying a fantasy. I am broadly offended by the lumping together of virtual fantasy violence and RL violence. I have been in such an alley in that position up against the wall. The male in question was a furrie, which no doubt adds another AR-able offence under these new rules. Not really my thing, but it was fun to try it once. Now I have to learn that as far as LL are concerned my behaviour at that moment was as 'broadly offensive' as the behaviour of a RL child rapist? They need to change their tune quickly, and they owe me and a lot of other Residents a big apology.
Rascal Ratelle Registered User Join date: 28 Jul 2006 Posts: 62	06-02-2007 03:16 Please state the rule that says just wearing a furry av is now an AR'able offence. How is a furry have an AR'able offence? and please do NOT say beastiality because furry does NOT = beastiality. I have YET tosee ANY fur engage in what is beastiality. Beastiality mEANS human having sex with an animal. A fur having sex with a fur is NOT beastiality. SO AGAIN, how is just wearing a furry av an AR'able offence and underwhat rules?
Broken Xeno ~Fething Alt~ Join date: 9 Mar 2007 Posts: 632	06-02-2007 03:39 I don't think anyone said being a furry is an ARable offense. _____________________
Leanne Karas Registered User Join date: 22 Feb 2007 Posts: 126	06-02-2007 04:57 From: Suzy Hazlehurst I am broadly offended by the lumping together of virtual fantasy violence and RL violence. I have been in such an alley in that position up against the wall. The male in question was a furrie, which no doubt adds another AR-able offence under these new rules. Not really my thing, but it was fun to try it once. Now I have to learn that as far as LL are concerned my behaviour at that moment was as 'broadly offensive' as the behaviour of a RL child rapist? They need to change their tune quickly, and they owe me and a lot of other Residents a big apology. Hear Hear!
Ciaran Laval Mostly Harmless Join date: 11 Mar 2007 Posts: 7,951	06-02-2007 05:03 From: Suzy Hazlehurst Of course that is only part of what the blog is talking about. What would you do if you were walking around a place called 'sex alley', got handed a warning about forced fantasy play going on there, and then saw a female avatar 'pushed' up against the wall by a male avatar, and 'assaulted' while emoting fear? Suzy my issue is with RL photos, if I'm walking around sex alley and I saw a scene like you described then that would be my fault for ignoring the warnings. Nothing to report there. However if sex alley had a wall with a texture of a RL rape scene...then yes that's something to AR.
Suzy Hazlehurst Offensive Broad Join date: 14 Oct 2006 Posts: 323	06-02-2007 07:04 From: Ciaran Laval Suzy my issue is with RL photos, if I'm walking around sex alley and I saw a scene like you described then that would be my fault for ignoring the warnings. Nothing to report there. That is just the point. You said you saw 'nothing wrong' with Linden policy. Part of that policy is that they are now asking us to report just the kind of scene I described. To quote the blog post in question (my emphasis): From: someone Real-life images, avatar portrayals, and other depiction of sexual or lewd acts involving or appearing to involve children or minors; real-life images, avatar portrayals, and other depictions of sexual violence including rape, real-life images, avatar portrayals, and other depictions of extreme or graphic violence, and other broadly offensive content are never allowed or tolerated within Second Life. The sex alley scene I described is a form of 'avatar portrayal' of sexual violence, and apparently to the Lindens it is as 'broadly offensive' as raping a living breathing child in real life and spreading pictures of that child-rape. I am deeply offended by this.
VooDoo Bamboo www.voodoodesignsllc.com Join date: 4 Oct 2006 Posts: 911	06-02-2007 07:09 Great job Lindens.... Alot of us support you! Keep up the great work.
Rascal Ratelle Registered User Join date: 28 Jul 2006 Posts: 62	06-02-2007 17:47 From: Ari Acropolis Actually, as Sarah Nerd pointed out in another thread, furries are already doomed, or at least they won't be able to have sex in-world anymore. What thread is this? SEx between two furry avs is NO diffrent then sex between to human av's , from what I have seen, the act of sex between two furry av's is exactly the same as sex between two human av's From what I ubderstand furries are not doomed LL will NOT ban account based ONLY on the typ of av they wear. they will base this off of actions. Plus according to the current AR system, don't you have to proove you accusations? Usualy when LL bans some one or shuts down a sim it's becuase they have found proof to back up the AR they are investegating. And no, LL is not obligated to release that info to the public.
Ciaran Laval Mostly Harmless Join date: 11 Mar 2007 Posts: 7,951	06-02-2007 17:54 From: Suzy Hazlehurst The sex alley scene I described is a form of 'avatar portrayal' of sexual violence, and apparently to the Lindens it is as 'broadly offensive' as raping a living breathing child in real life and spreading pictures of that child-rape. I am deeply offended by this. Indeed, read it wrong. If they're going after avatar's engaging in that sort of action and the avatar's are adults then I agree that that is a bridge too far.
John Toonie Registered User Join date: 3 Jul 2005 Posts: 58	06-02-2007 18:10 Quite honestly, LL needs to get age verification working however they plan to do it, either through parental controls, or their whole personal info mess and just adopt a behind closed doors policy. If your going to do ADULT anything, do it in a mature sim, behind 6 closed prims, and let that be the end of it. any PUBLIC sex areas, must have the adult content tag. Simply boil the situation down to, if your going to partake in non pg material, it must be in a mature sim behind closed doors, or in an adult content tagged area. Then the only way anyone can be offended is A: they don't read the parcels information. B: they're a peeping tom and have no business looking anyways. I think LL is forgetting, this is supposed to be an adult only grid, just because they opened the flood gates to minors, doesn't mean the rest of us can be denied our rights as property owners to use our property as we see fit. Anyone banned from SL because of this announcement could infact sue LL for termination of their property lease (yes, under legal terms when you buy property, you are leasing the server usage from LL) And possibly be awarded the value of said property in terms of how much they paid for it when they recieved the lot, and the monthly fee they had to pay for said property. But that is also a case by case thing, and in some states, wouldn't hold water. Honestly I think LL needs to hire a webhost/isp attorney to help them sort out their TOS. So they aren't using a TOS, but instead a monthly renewed bandwidth lease contract. Which you would have to agree to monthly by typing your initials or something like that. It would stop them from making crazy rules that legally can't hold up, and cover them. Minors can't legally sign contracts of any sort, so IF there were any minors on the main grid, LL could remove them immediately and not have to return their money, because they were in void of the contract.

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