Acceptance In SL

I am really questioning SL, right now.

I am a big/fat lady in RL. When I came into SL, I wanted to be me... not some Barbie Doll/Super model image (apologies to all who might be offended by that coment!). I am not ashamed of who I am in RL, and simply had no desire to change my shape, in this weird and wonderful Virtual world.

Roll on a few months, and I wanted to try combat. On approaching several 'organizations' I was turned away...and I simply couldn't work out why. It wasn't until my best friend on SL, told me, that as a big lady, I am an easier target, as the 'hit areas' are the torso, therefore he wasn't surprised... so if I wanted to take part, I was essentially given no option, but to adopt a slim person's shape...if slightly disproportionate...it was a shape someone had given me, as I didn't really want to adjust my AV, and it just goes against the grain to be something I simply am not. As soon as the job is done, I go back to being me, so the slim shape is more like a uniform.

So, having developed some skills in the various things, I decided to branch out and see what else is out there. I found another roleplay SIM, where again I find that there are no bigger, ie fatter, AV's accepted. Again there is the combat target issue, but on the whole, it is expected that AV's are 'good-looking' and are slim...and while people have been polite to me on the whole, many have made comments.

I won't deny in Real life, I would love to be slimmer, but it isn't a be all and end all. In SL, as a big lady, I come across the occasional Grieffer - possibly more than most, and in addition I do get questioned every week randomly by people asking "why are you fat?" or "Don't you want to lose weight?" but with calm answers and explanations, that I'm cool with who I am, they go away or become friends.

Throughout my experiences on SL, I must admit - I have rarely seen a 'real' representation of anyone bigger than a hollywood model, or muscle-bound hunk. Jobs such as dancers and hosts, are in my experience, open only to the slimmer AV - I have been told this on several approaches to various places, and role play SIMs definately have restrictions. In addition to that, just like RL, clothes are limited because they aren't styled for the larger AV...possibly unlike RL, because there simply isn't much market for it.

Also, I have seen limited 'darker' skin tones on AV's, and people with disabilities are virtually non-exsistant. Now, this could be because I have not been to the so-called 'right places', but it seems that there is some kind of global social conditioning at play here...unless a majority of residents are so unhappy with who they are, they want to be something different?

So, I am curious....Are there any SL residents, that in RL society, feel they are rejected for whatever reason, and have therefore changed themselves radically in SL, for escapism? Did you feel other residents wouldn't accept you, if you went around as you are in real life?

I am interested to hear people's opinion on this whole subject of acceptance, good or bad...let me know.

Many thanks for reading this long post!!!
Jinnywitha
(Proud to be a resident!)

I don't wear super sexy, normal looking avatars myself. I was talking to my real life partner about what he make if he could anything, then we started to talk about how people bring certain prejudices or ideals with them even in world where they can be anything.
Have you ever noticed there are very few really darked skin avatars or even green one's here?
I think people bring in there prejudices where ever they go even in VR.
Lot of people and even business are geared towards making avatars super sexy women, with some muscle bound guys with idealized bodies.
There may be others who are large in real life but I think there just this fantasy of what you want others to see perhaps.
It was interesting my partner made avatar, in real life he is quiet large but in SL he made the guy quite trim.
Not sure why he did that because he told me repeatively he isn't attracted to skinny looking people.
Either way you can have good time regardless of what others are doing.
I believe you can do your own thing and still have fun, right people for you will eventually find you likeable and want to be friends regardless of what your avatar looks like,etc.

A certain man-of-the-moment isn't particularly well-toned

My av actually looks quite like me, ok he's taller - like most avs in SL for some reason - and he has a nice year-round tan

But on the other hand, if it's ok for people to be furries, dragons or Transformers, why isn't it ok for them to be idealized humans? You say yourself that you'd like to be slimmier in RL, so why would you want to choose a shape in SL that you admit you don't want in RL?

Its sad to hear that because you chose to represent yourself as who you really are, that others in SL are'nt accepting. I have tried the combat thing also as a minotaur and a human ( not to good in either skin ). As the minotaur I'm huge, an easy target, but havent had many fights. Anyway, In SL i have seen quite a few different av's and yes, most are tall slim and pretty. There are the occasional short or disfigured ones but not enough. In this world it is possible to actually get to know someone without the first impression of looks, if you get past the av. Its unfortunate that people are still discriminating because your av is big. I for one would welcome a chance to fight, no matter how big or small and would invite to if i saw you in one of the combat sims.

Funny you should bring this topic up, because I was thinking along similar lines this morning.

I'm a gay woman with a personal aesthetic that is very different from the one dominating the accessories for female AVs in SL. I don't like slut-wear or even "proper" feminine clothing. I can't find a prim hair style that appeals to me either since I want close cropped hair, and all the skins come with too much makeup.

In other words, it's hard being me inworld, but I do persist. I usually end up shopping for men's clothes, I'm using textured Linden hair to get the hairstyle approaching what I want, and I've chosen a skin as close to what I would like as possible.

The answer, though, is to MAKE what you can't find. So, when I've mastered a few more SL skills, I fully intend to make my own prim hair and even give skin a try. There's always the off chance that I won't be the only one to want these items, in which case I can go into business!

"But on the other hand, if it's ok for people to be furries, dragons or Transformers, why isn't it ok for them to be idealized humans? You say yourself that you'd like to be slimmier in RL, so why would you want to choose a shape in SL that you admit you don't want in RL?" - Stephen Zenith

Interesting question, thank you very much for posting that....
I don't have any objections to what AV shapes people choose. It is fascinating at the vast array of things people have come up with. But of the comment that you say 'why shouldn't it be ok for them to be that super model, or muscle-bound hunk'...it is... I just can't work out, why so many have conformed to those images, so much so, it actually affects jobs, and activities, and things, just as in RL.

As for my own shape...yes in real life I would like to be slimmer - lets face it, it would be healthier, but its not like I really actively do anything about it, as I simply am comfortable with who I am, and happy within myself...if weight loss happens, it happens, if not, it's no biggie... I am who and what I am, and I had no need or desire to be anything else in SL.


Thank you to all that have replied thus far

When I first entered SL, I noticed that everyone had a Barbie / Ken avatar. In all my time here I have found very few people wearing more realistic avatars...

At first, I wanted to create a pretty avatar. Why? I certainly didn't want to create an avatar that looked like myself, since I don't see any fun on that. So the only option seemed to be creating another nondescript Ken...

When I was fighting with the sliders, another idea creeped into my mind: Hey, what if I actually try to make my avatar ugly? Not inhumanly ugly, which can be easilly done by placing all sliders to 0 or 100 arbitrarily, but ugly in a mundane, natural way.

So my avatar is ugly. It is funny, because I *think* he is ugly. He has a big nose, small chin, ample forehead... However, some people (both SL and RL) have told me that they find the avatar handsome. Like many things in life, attraction is 100% subjective.

Dun Dun Duuuunnnnnn: Moral of my story, if people don't like your avatar, they are the ones losing.

I don't have problem with anyone being whatever they want idealized or not personally.
I do think though here we have this world where literally we can create almost anything, be anything yet how come everyone looking pretty much the same and trying to do the same things? Even content often seems to be same thing over and over again.
Sadly its interesting lot of people just aren't interested in being creative and that okay but in long run if everyone doing same thing, looking and creating same thing then personally I find it limiting.
.I am curious about that since I joined but perhaps I am new and haven't noticed.
I can understand why people in 1st life try to appear this idealize version of normal and I guess that idealized normal, don't do, create or be different has followed lot of people Secondlife too.

SL is the place where you can be what you want... super-model, sports-person, furry, monster, fantasy-race or everything anyone wants to be ... and yes, yourself too. Sad that this not acceptable for all as it seems.

Myself? I am a bruynette RL and not blond as in SL. Why I am blond? It was the first hair given to me... and liked it over then and I still do.

In SL my breasts are more well formed as in RL. Why? It is one of the few things I don't really like about my RL body. Note well, it is not like that I would consider surgery or something. Not a single hair on my head even thinking about that.
Anyway, I corrected that a bit in SL. Why? Because I can .

Morwen.

I really am a 8 ft tall demon in RL

honest

Well, my avatar is based on the "real me". Let's say it's 60/65% "me" and what's left it's all about surgery

So far I got lots of positive comments about my avatar and I don't mind them, anyway I tried to look pretty and to avoid the "superbimbosexyvixengoddessèlaymatewhatever" look.

I could have done without that 35/40% improvements? Maybe. Some people like they avatar to be a carbon copy of the real themselves, but I do already see myself in the mirror every day, I don't need to see myself even on my monitor!

Anyway, no matter what I look like, I accept other people as they are.

Hi Jinny,

I think most people view SL as just that...a second life. A way for them to do things they normally wouldn't do.
I myself , have several Avi shapes that I wear from time to time...and alien, a neko, Batman, a small pumpkin (hehe), and I'm considering getting a werewolf avi also.....while working on a something on my own. ~grins~

I can understand the "logic" behind the groups turning you away because of your avi's size. They may have been thinking more about you "being a larger target" for your own benefit and wanted to spare you from getting shot alot....or they could have been prejudice to your size...I don't know...but I doubt it.
Did they use uniforms? and would the uniforms have fit your large sized avi?
That could have been a factor in thier decision to turn you away also.

As far as your other SL experiences, the ones that might have made fun of you were most likely juveniles...and not necessarily "juvenile" in the literal sense.

Be who you want and do what you want....if you can't find what you're looking for, I'm sure there are plenty of builders/scripters who would love to help you out.

Most importantly, enjoy yourself!

My AV isn't really musclebound, but it's a lot trimmer than the real me.

When I was first in, I tried making an av that was heavier, but I had trouble getting a slidermade heavy avatar that wasn't misshapen. (There's a difference between being heavy and being misshapen!)

As such, I eventually gave up, and settled for having a beard and bald spot that matched my RL beard and bald spot... I even found a skin that I bought that had a great beard on it (although I really don't like the over-defined torso, but that's OK if I keep my shirt on).

-Rob

When I joined SL, I wanted to make my AV as much like me as possible. I shared my RL pictures with a friend and they helped design me in pixelated form. Yes, I really am too thin (and not necessarily always attractive to people who prefer more T&A ) Yes, I have freckles on my cheeks and nose. Yes, long dark hair. Yes, light blue eyes. I sometimes play around with other AV shapes/sizes for fun but mostly, what you see is what I am in RL...only I will admit to some enhancement of my chest area

When I started out in SL.. I spent a great many hours trying to replicate my body in RL, into SL.. I spent many hours of effort trying to get the face right... and in the end.. while it wasn't perfect, it was close.

The primary problem I had was just that clothes for that avatar were impossible to find (ironic, because that;s kind of how things are for me in real life). Not being the cute little lither femmy thing... means too often "jeans and t-shirts".

Yet, I continued with my avatar.

Anyways.. I was new, and one greifer came along.. some jerk teenager.. who shouldn't have been in the game to begin with. He insulted me, and began shooting me simply because I was "fat".

You know.. as a builder.. that became a liability. Alone in the sandbox... with no money for defensive systems.. not realizing the value of a good chair.. I slowly started to realize that I needed to present less of a target. So, I worked on a new avatar. Not very good, but I tried. And soon thereafter, I gave up on being human. I made a small alien, and then my first furry. From there, I got my first gig as a dancer. So.. I had to have the "dancer look". and fron there, I went sort of "neko/ sprite."

http://temp.zebragrrl.com/secondlife/blogpics/sl-0020.jpg
http://temp.zebragrrl.com/secondlife/blogpics/sl-0021.jpg

There were a lot of avatars along the way.. even these two images don't cover ALL of them.. just the ones I can easily find in my inventory. Ones that still exist.. that I wore for more than a few days. There were other furries.. one I made, one I bought... there were wind-up dolls, robots, and all sorts of things in-between.

From avatar to avatar, I have tried to carry something forward.. from design to design. Many times I purchased clothes, or skins, or made my own parts. But the one thing that always remained, was the person behind the keyboard.. trying to fit in, trying to have fun.. trying.. just trying to get by from day to day.

Did I *sell out*? I don't think so.. but I did give up on trying to replicate my 1st life form. The novelty wore off I guess.

But ever since.. I have never left my avatar alone for more than a week or two.

The one constant for me.. has been change.

Although my clothing is different from when I started, I still have my original hair, this bizarre bright green aerodynamic plumage. I also tinted my skin light blue, and describe myself as looking like a Star Trek villain. My avatar is more normal looking now, but only because I wear a skin I made using photos of myself; I refer to this skin as "my human disguise," and my profile pic is still a picture of me with the blue skin.

I guess I'm just saying that I am not particularly interested in making my av look handsome or something. I go for a look that amuses me. That said, I was a little disappointed by one friend who started out with a fairly short, stout, and balding av designed to look like he really does, and now he looks like the typical idealized Ken doll. *sigh*

I'm 5' 7" and have under 50 on the chest slider.. lots of us here.

I've seen this happen as well. It seems that most users in SL believe that basically, unless you're obviously a new resident, then whatever you have is what you want - possibly within SL, or possibly in RL too. If your AV is fat, that must be because you want to be fat, and wanting to be fat is considered quite a taboo thing in the world now, especially in SL where you don't get the enjoyment of eating food to balance it out. (It doesn't help that several griefers have used fat or grotesque avatars.)

It happens in other contexts as well. I've had strange reactions when asked why I don't have a house, and I reply that I originally wanted one but decided to do without one because I'm not so good at design and didn't like the idea of a prefab. Apparantly admitting this greatly offends some people. Possibly because it's a factor that they might wish wasn't part of SL, but that is?

Oh yeah, I get that sometimes too. I (well, my group) owns the half-sim my store is on, but I don't have a house. Don't want to bother with one, but occasionally people ask me incredulously why I don't build a house when I have so much land.

Going along that vein of thought, I've never really understood why people have houses that have kitchens, bathrooms, diningrooms.....do they ever really get used? or are they there because those poeple need to have their SL mirror their RL?


I have a house, but all I have in it is lounging furniture for when friends come over and ...umm....some special furniture.

The women's discussion group on monday nights at Verum's Place actually talked about body image and SL at our first meeting. And weight and race have been two of the things we've talked about. It's a great group, you should stop in. (Meets 7pm eastern at Verum's on monday evenings.)

I'm 5'7" in game terms (real one for that matter). I haven't brought my RL weight into SL. I haven't had any problem with acceptance I don't think, but I've been mistaken for an SL kid a few times.

Like Regan, I'm a lesbian and have a different aesthetic. (Funny though that all these "SL-lesbians" seem to prefer the same aesthetic as straight males do. *cough*) I'm more "andro" than butch and the shorter women's styles are fine for me. Clothing though is pretty hard. I found some simpler things at HCT, including a longer hippie-ish thing that gives me kind of a L-Word Tina look (sans acnebackboy thank you). If you are more butch, just try the men's styles for hair. They will fit. We just went shopping with a friend and found something really good in Gurl 6's male store. You really have to just start trying the styles though because they look incredibly different on female avies. A few of them actually looked too femmy for my friend's taste. She looks hot and she doesn't look at all like it's a guys style.

One thing about heavier avies is that griefers seem to prefer to create fat avatars. If I see someone heavier, my first thought is that they're a griefer.

One of the few disappoinments I have in SL is the rarity of diverse aesthetics, especially in the area of gender, but I'm hoping that will change as more and more people come inworld and bring some slightly different "ideals" with them.

I'm very project-oriented in my enjoyment of SL, so I have a list a mile long of skills I need to make the inworld items I want. For the moment, my focus has been on very traditional forms (like pre-fab housing) as I master the first steps in a steep learning curve. But my ultimate goal is to start pushing boundaries, especially ones I haven't even recognized yet.

SL is a wide open dreamscape and there are so many more interesting dreams than Barbie & Ken go shopping at the local mall.

This is a topic I feel very strongly about for several reasons. When I came to SL a few months ago I thought to myself that my RL body was going through some big changes (I had my stomach banded)and I needed to mentaly prepare for them. So when I started making my avvie I wanted to to signify a goal of my RL body, now anyone who had seen me either RL or SL knows I will never be 7 foot tall but it has always be a dream of mine to be better then average height as in RL I am only 5 foot but it seems in SL to be "tall" being 7 feet is the only way to achieve that as there are so many oversized avs. With her body I made her in proportion to what I would like to be someday I gave her all the T&A that I always wanted but only got half of;0 and gave myself the freedom to make her into what I wanted to be not what I was and as an experiment I have to say it was the best thearapy on the planet. Since I made her I got a swish in my hips and an attitude to match I no longer feel like the "fat" girl cause nobody in all of SL could call me that and you would be surprized how few RL people think so these days! She has given me so much in the way of confidnece and self love as well as making it possible for me to find my RL true love, who I am happy to say will be moving to my town and soon after we will be married! With making an avvie that looks like you if you happen to be one of the many of us without a perfect body you also make your avvie with the same problems that your RL body has, so I say why not be all you ever dreamed of and reap the rewards of feeling the way you might never have otherwise?

Some people have different dreams.

Some people don't have the skill to make exactly what they want.

Some people won't feel different because they look different, especially not in SL.

There's always some people different.

I chose to be my real height - 5 feet 7 inches - since I could not see allure of standing 8 feet tall. But trust me, SL avatars who are "well-endowed" or just plain skinny are a race of giants compared to me. It seems most people want height as a pre-requisite to an SL life.