Have you closed your store because of CopyBot?

THAT ROCKS!!!! LMFAO!!! Heehee, good solution.

Ignore the poster Seola. She obviously harbors considerable animous against content creators who expect fair compensation for their hard work.

This is not about content creators and what they charge and do not charge. That is taken care of by basic economic principle. If you appreciate the designers work, and find it worthwhile to purchase their merchandise, then you do so. If not, you don't and simply move along to the next merchant.

There is no question that this situation threatens SL as we knew it. So that the issue here is not so much greed or the particular interest of consumers as oposed to content creators. This is more about the health and survival of SL by those of us who enjoy it and would love to see in continue its growing and prospering, and who are concerned that an issue of this magnitude may somehow contribute to its potential demise.

I must have imagined the whole Dazzle mad rush then when they decided to close, or the amount of emails Ginny blogged about receiving asking her to reopen. Yes, the sale had something to do with that but in my case it wouldn't have made any difference what the price was. One of my favourite stores was closing and I wanted to get what I could before it all vanished at what was at the time going to be forever and I know a whole lot of people felt the same way.
Lower prices might have exaggerated the effect, but that's not the one and only reason by far.

The fact that you doubt that we're willing to pay for anything goes back to my statement of inherent distrust that's so widespread.

The poor guy who started thread where he held gun creators responsible for griefing involving weapons got burried by criticism by exactly the same people who are today of the opinion that upon reflection, when it concerns them, they do think the creator of anything should be held responsible. More irony there as well.

Or the fact that the creator of the seller's guild is generously hosting the site for the libsecondlife project if the transcript in one of the other threads is to be believed.

A far more likely reason would be that textures simply have a far lower appeal to the average resident than clothing does.

Agreed, they could do a better job of enforcement.

Well, I do hope that the first public response is not in fact the final response by LL. I am sure that they were just as violently smacked in the face by this news as the rest of the community, and they need to manage expectations and PR in addition to trying to figure out the technical issues.

While their response left a lot to be desired, I am quite certain that it is extremely important (quite likely critical) that they do not promise anything they can't fulfill. It may perhaps be better to get a statement out that is unsatisfactory but immediately responsive and handle the firedrill afterwards, then to give people a reason to think they lied.

That's just my opinion, and I am obviously one of those people who likes to believe the best, ymmv.

"I think the bot is wrong, but it's nice to see the titans tremble, even if it is for a bit "

"And I'm glad you are happy to let every thief content at the risk of everyone to take down those *you* deem to be too expensive. You obviously don't even have a clue what goes into making an outfit, it takes hours of real work for good outfits."

Guess it's hard to tell in text. For future reference, when I use the tongue face (), I'm nore than likely being sarcastic. In regards to the titans tremble quote - I was being sarcastic. I figured trembling titans would be quite obviously a sarcastic note, but... *shrugs*

"If someone is paying that price, that's thier own business. Who are you to dictate what's too expensive? If there's a market... why not?"

The way I see it. If there's a market, why do you have to rip people off? Sure, stick another 100 Lindens on. But to stick X amount on it, that is, as has been said, one of the seven sins - Greed

"P.S. That's not unreasonable if you might look and see what it took to make it. If it comes with all kinds of attachments, varied styles and is highly detailed... that's ALOT of work.

One wedding pack for a highly detailed lace dress came with flexi veil, train, flowers, jewelry, shoes, hair, and a few different styles of the accessories... and it was transfer. Considering how many accessories you get and the time it took to create... easily worth 12kL when you think about how much all that cost separately and doesn't always match"

Okay I'll point you to what I said, then I'll leave a line, if you can't figure out where you're wrong in that line, the answer will be below that blank line, here goes...

"Let's go for examples, LapGirl and UFOnly, those companies I don't consider greedy, they sell their products for next to nothing, while you have other companies (who I won't mention) that sell things much like the above stateds clothing, for a few hundred, or in one case I saw, 12,000 for a gown."

- Here's the line -

Didn't get it? Okay. Do you see the "the sell things much like the above stateds"? That's in reference to the two above companies I stated. Make sense? Now to make things simpler, I'll put it in easier words - The 12k gown was the same standard of work as that of anything at LapGirl or UFOnly. Yes you could argue that LapGirl has some nicely detailed clothing, but it is not the most highly detailed. Thus would you expect to go into LapGirl and say, buy the red silks, not the the three colour bundle, but just the red one, for 12,000? I wouldn't either.

PS: I love your stuff Shep. Was just using LapGirl as an example 'cos it was the first one that came to mind - I spend too much time there

And I find it ironic that you can have such an opinion without ever having created anything. Don't be a hypocrite and tell everyone your opinion is fact. It's not and your opinion at best is skewed. Tell you what, since you are so into the Barbie club... why don't the copybotters come there, copy YOU and dance around as YOU for awhile and sell thier services cheaper than YOU do.

Hey while we are at it, since you like SexGen, why don't we go copy your sexgen items, copy your body and use it next to YOUR stuff.

How about we all copy YOUR look and go work in the 'adult' side of SL and do it for FREE so you can't make any money...

I don't understand... I created it once... I can create it again! I for one, rather do something all over (and much better and faster may I add) than watch some dick scurry along with a weapon/article of clothing/vehicle/building or anything else that took me time to figure out and prepare, now that I have a cookbook of recepies all I have to do is cook another batch up! Mind you, It will take time as it it did previously but not as much, and it will not happen prior to a resolution of this Copybot plauge.

If greed were my motivating factor then I wouldn't be closing up shop! Again it's the principle of the matter, if merchants don't voice and express their opinions, just stand on the sidelines watching Coach Linden run the show, they risk losing the entire game (money/content/reputation) it's a team effort I'm sure everyone will agree, players communicate with coaches to result in a better game, so far all I've seen thus far is players calling FOUL FOUL and coach Linden doing nothing to enforce.

Once these serious issues we are having are rectified, I'll be comfortable knowing I can play a "fair game until then I will sit the remaining games out, I mean whats the point if the rules only apply to some.

Sarcastic or not, your message is still the same. You are happy to see this happen to people who put prices on their work and people pay for. It isn't YOUR business or judgement to deem what should and shouldn't be a fair price for something.

Using a cheap store and thier pricing has NOTHING to do with the way others price things. You said it yourself, that you could argue that it's not highly detailed. Well, some people want the highly detailed stuff and that takes time and time is money.

Don't cop out just because you don't think we are charging what *you* think when there are people out there with established businesses, who have worked their butts off and charge what people will pay.

It's not greed.... it's being business minded.

I for one am motivated by greed, pure and simple. Unfortunately, I'm also stupid, and don't realize I could be making a lot more money faster by taking the subway just a few stops further than I normally do and working for an investment banking firm.

So a silly analogy then really, eh?

Im thinking of logging in and closing now

I mean even if I file a report or even if I own the copyright to my images in RL im just wondering what all LL is going to do

and once one person has my items full perms, its going to spread like wildfire and will be impossible to catch everyone


Or can they run a search on the items uuid # and kill it or something?


whatever, its blatently obvious LL doesnt need/want us here.

Has anyone tried this?

I believe that yes - as a "grey goo" measure, the Lindens do have the power to remove all instances of a given object from the world.

The CopyBot Defeater only tries to stop CopyBot alts from showing up on your land - and it may spam innocent users in the process. But it won't stop portable products being copied, unfortunately.

I picked up a copy of the Simple CopyBot Defeater but haven't tried it yet.

Blegh, well I wouldnt want to take my product from honest ppl who have paid.

I don't sell things I create, no, mostly because I think that what I can create is rather trivial and I wouldn't know how to put a fair price on it or think it would have much value other than the person I made it for.
I also don't see how it's relevant really .

I never once said that copying anything was alright, I have on the other hand consistently pointed out that most people simply do not steal even if the opportunity exists which is simply a matter of fact.
If I find something was sold to me with improper permission (usually turns out to be animations inside of a pose-ball) I'll contact the creator and tell them about it. If they wanted my copy back to replace it with one with the proper permissions set I wouldn't care, but usually it turns out I get a very warm thank you and possibly something free as a show of gratitude.

You on the other make a personal attack that to me at least reads like you're actively wanting people to come and copy me just because I might be stating an opinion you don't agree with. Considering how I bought every single thing that isn't a true freebie, copying me or anything I own only would only result in stealing other creator's content so I'm really quite stunned by your outburst.

As far as dancing goes, that's already free. People tip me because they want to, not because someone is standing behind them holding a gun to their head making them, so all in all the attack makes no sense because I already do what I do for free but still somehow get compensated for it. Funny how that works, isn't it?
Even if noone tipped me, it still wouldn't make any bit of difference to me, because I have no problem paying for premium while I don't own land and I buy more L$ in a month than I ever make in-world.

From what I've heard, the Copybot Defeater has already been rendered obsolete, and all it does now really is spam your guests.

Isn't it futile to close shop now when the items you sold prior to closing can still be copied?

The damage is done. Might as well keep your shops open and continue earning $L for as long as it lasts?

I'm not closing right now. But the profits I make from my stores are what allows me the time to be here in the first place. When things like this cut into those profits significantly, I'll have no choice. It will mean closing down and going back to working more hours in RL. It will mean no longer having all this extra time I've had to spend with my children and with my partner and certainly not having the time to create as I have been.

Right now I'm hoping for the best, but I can see the potential for having no choice but to close.

When news of GLIntercept first broke... it was presumed to be the end of the clothing texture and skin industries.
Now we're months down the road and all those businesses are still thriving...


the reason?


...probably because most people are honest.


I'd suggest that months down the road, this will be forgotten by most, just like GLIntercept

The what? *grins at Lucifer*

I haven't closed my store, because I never opened one after the GLintercept thing came to my attention. As my things are texture based, I didn't want them to be ripped off, so that was the end of my plans to sell in SL. At least on 3d resource sites I have a bit more control over my material.

When these things like copybot and glintercept get publicised, LL should make huge announcements that they do not approve of copying and that they will ban those responsible, if not for any other reason than to just let us know they give a damn. Yes, it will still happen, yes, people can return with alts - that's well known. But it would help instill a bit of confidence in LL if they approached these situations from a bit more of a principled angle.

I really hope you're right Lucifer. Keeping my fingers crossed.

I'm a content creator. I've been creating trivially-copied content in the real world for 30 years, and I've had people rip it off large-scale. I've lost sales to piracy, and I've lost sales to incompetant publishers, and I've lost sales to simply not understanding the market, and I've lost sales to saturating the market, and I've lost sales to people producing better products than me. At least, all these things have led to the sales sooner or later falling off towards zero...

And, basically, the fact is that every product in the real world is either a physical product that gets used up, or it's information which has a sales curve with an early peak and a long slow tail of ever diminishing returns. To keep sales up, you have to keep producing product, whether that's physical product (where it's obvious) or information. There are a few (very few) products where the "long tail" is long enough that it seems infinite, but for most people EVERY product you make will sell well for a while, then eventually you'll need to make another one, and another one...

Because every product in SL is information. When I came to SL over and over again I had people tell me that you can make a product in SL and get returns on it forever. And a few people will see that, because the tail of their product is longer than the life of SL as a product. But in most cases you're going to see a burst of sales and then you'll need to make something else to get the next burst.

Copybot may change the length of the "long tail" for some items. Some items may lose their market much quicker than they would have otherwise. But for most content creators this isn't going to change anything, any more than Gomez' prim mirror or GLintercept did.

I doubt it Lucifer.

Although its noble for you to presume that the texture issue hasnt been impacted as much by the GLI because of the inherent honest nature of most people, another reason might be because it takes a certain amount of knowledge and effort to effect that process.

The copybot is a lot easier to operate than the GLIntercept deal.