Have you been to the Blog lately?

No that is not what I want really, really, really... I just don't want it to dominate center stage as SL's raison d'etre (it's reason for being) and I don't want it to be the central issue in regards to personal freedom and it had risen from its nice warm comfy place in the dark warm depths to coat the perception of SL like a oil slick. I actually am in favour of a red light district and have always been a fan of the Sacred Prostitute (who uses sexual magic to heal people). Also I draw a strong line between SL sex and porn. SL sex to me is as valid as RL sex. I think people mix it up. We all know how strong the feelings can be in SL and how real; if people find someone here (or someones..lol) and they get that spark, more power to them. Life is too short not to relate if its on the level.

I'm just not likeing the path the Lindens are treading.. Sure, I can understand their point of view. I can understand why they ban this stuff due to bad press and such.. What I can't believe though, is that if they start down this path whats next? Gor? Furs? Anything which the media can get their mits on and start tearing apart will suddenly become outlawed. And what possibly irks me the most is that these people were CONFIRMED to be of age. I know its all been said before, but people holding their torches high saying that it should of been done should stop and think about what they're doing. Though.. on second thought SL could become a better place without sex and gambleing.. But if that happens, what will be the difference between the teen and adult grids?

Just as Ageplay was a hard to define term until today , Porn is also a subjective term. To some it's any sexually depicted material, to others it is reserved for what they would consider obscene(a subjective term in and of itself). Sex is a big part of human existence, so it will be a part of SL. While maybe not the driving factor, but bigger than some will admit. There's nothing wrong with that. But the fact that it has seemed to become the big draw to some portion of the general populace is unfortunate. Everyone knows shopping is the allure of SL..

I was simply responding to your post:

As LL has provided both corporate and in-world assistance to pornographic sites in the past it's unlikely that the product can "rise from the ashes as a creative platform."

The present debate over "ageplay" and the recent incident of SL life being used as a file sharing system to distribute child pornography is that the Lindens are, once again, engaged in activities that will allow them to look like they're doing something. Sadly, blog posts and things like fluttering about SL heaving ageplay-related notecards at people seems to have been rather ineffectual.

My point is that if LL tried to appease every country's moral laws where SL is used, it would be so overwhelming that it would destroy the freedom of expression that makes SL matter.

One interesting point this all raises are philosophical. I have occasionally shopped at xcite. I do not consider their goods pornographic, but rather as tools for human (and Furry) sexuality--and I do find major difference between them.

If me and another person share a poseball, is it simple pornographic sex or two people who may enjoy each others company sharing a special moment of mutual indulgence?

I think one of SL's greatest strengths is that it allows people to be open about usually hidden or idealized sides of themselves. It doesn't matter on SL if one is gay, bi, or straight, human or furry, male or female, "PG" or "Mature". Some may find Furries off-putting or Goreans distasteful. However I am glad they both have a place on SL. And hope that does not change.

Gor and furries aren't anything introduced by SL. They both were around A LONG TIME before SL and had a decent presence on the internet for a long time with a certain level of visibility. The media has already had a chance to look at both of those. I think there was some big to do in the UK over some RL gorean guy that kept some girl in his basement for an extended period of time. That came and went and the Goreans are still here.

This isn't a new fight, guys.

I wonder how long this investigation was going on? All we have heard over the last week or so now is become age verified by SS number etc, but yet in this case they were able to pinpoint the perpetrators, right down to where they lived AND their ages - 54 and 27, and ban them immediately. Did these people supply payment info on file, were they AR'd? How did LL get all this info on these people?

Curious,
Xaria

I actually Agree with you Cobaltblue ...

My issues are not with Gor's or furries or the sexual behavour of adults. In fact I think there HAS to be somethings in life that are a DEFINATE no no .. becasue it is an international thing .....

You cant appease all nations and thier moral beliefs due to the vast multicultural society we live in in this day and age.

Theres such thing as tolerence ...... acceptence .... belonging.....

*pouts*

Virtual images of ageplay, sexual ageplay werent introduced by SL either. They existed on the Internet before Second Life. Was one of the issues with AOL and Yahoo chatrooms.

And Cartoon Underaged sexual images have long been associated with some Hentai/Anime stuff.

I guess becuase that Material comes out of Japan it isnt such a outrage to the media.

This is the first time I've seen over 40K+ online in a month. On a Thursday afternoon, no less. I guess there's no such thing as bad publicity...

They're all FBI agents, Ray.

edit: and press people, all asking each other if they'd like to ageplay.

was 42,000 a couple times last week.

That explains why my avatar froze and turned black as my inventory deleted itself.

If it is true that there was trafficking in real child porn, then that is a radically different occurance than consensual age play between adults. This is information that should be shared, and should have been responsibly reported.

Frankly SL is a california based virtual world and by contract subject to california law. What really frightens me is the thought that other countries standards of privacy might be applied in SL. I would hate to think if suddenly all of SL was subjected to Chinese Law. If it comes down to a choice between tolerating ageplay, or making myself subject to foreign law, then I would tolerate ageplay. If, by using SL we are subject to international law, then we should be so notified in the TOS. LL's understanding of the US laws on child Porn seems to be somewhat flawed. I can appreciate the business rationale behing this, but I think they need to work on thier disclosure about whose laws we may be subject too. I do not want to go to jail for my reproduction WWII german tanker uniform, simply because its display is illegal in germany.

What disturbs me is how little was said regarding the circumstances: I mean did this reporter go into somebodies bedroom to obtain these images, and is LL banning members for private consensual activity.

Mostly I am disappointed in LL for thier constantly shifting policy, which utterly justifies the slippery slope arguments made by most of us free speech types. First Age play was okay, members privacy rights were protected. Then depiction of sexual ageplay was banned, and now sexual ageplay has been banned entirely. Next public advertisment of sex clubs will be banned, and then any depiction of sexual activity will be banned.

then they will bann my uniform as being hate speech, and finally my communist clothing because its communist.

LL needs to not only advise us when they change the rules, but when these rules changes will stop? When can I count of having privacy to act as an adult. this whole thing arose from an activity between to consensual adults.

My prediction: in one year, at most two. SL will be PG and noone will use it. Just like yahoo chat.

No, it was a sex club designed for such activities. And the two people banned were identified as trading RL child porn. According to what I saw in the report, that is.



When SL libertarian attitudes collide with RL paranoia... news at 11.

is this supposed to be clever? you failed.

Did the alleged trading occur in world? If not, then by identifying and banning the individuals, Linden did what it should have, and have no further responsibility.

If you look at the threads, they have links to the German documentary. The film clearly shows a child brothel set up for this. Though only two have been banned, there were more avs in the building, and engaging in sex, mostly child avs.

Fat chance of that. We are about to get sculpties, which leads to 1 prim flexidongs and bouncy breasts...Pr0n in SL is entering a whole new glorious era

Neither Gor no Furries is something new to the internet or hell even the media.. But honestly, how many people have even HEARD of Gor before SL? I don't know about you, but for me a huge part of my exposure to it was through SL. As for Furries well.. they seem to be universally hated wherever they go, which is why I brought them up as well. To me, it seems that eventually Lindens will clamp down upon these and numerous other things because of bad press, or because a few dozen people who feel the need for everything to fit THEIR views feel the need to yell at lindens until they do something. I'm not saying this is the end of times, not saying that this will even be immediate.. But it feels as though sometime in the future free expression will be killed off bit by bit because people can't leave well enough alone. Its been said before, its a slippery slope, and we're already slideing down.

Actually, I was agreeing with you 100% about what you were saying. I was being sarcastic about the "news at 11" line. Sorry about the confusion. Sarcasm doesn't always translate well in forums.

It's not 100% clear from the report on YouTube and I don't speak German. Basically, in one shot it looks like somebody is sending the user pics of RL child porn in SL. The pics were rezzing on the screen in an SL-framed image box (like when you send someone any image in SL) in front of a child avatar.

I've seen the peak above 40k every day this month Things become unbareble around 35k, though, and annoying at around 30k

Probably true.
So asuming they were both verified is the lesson here that verified people can be dumb enough to get caught easily or unverifieds are too much trouble to catch easy so hunt for verifieds? Be interesting to see the cut footage on how many other AV's were seen at this club but not actioned on immediately.
Then again it's so easy for any opposition out there to be tarbrushing SL with setups like this because LL basically ignores the risks, waiting for the media before acting.