About our RP communities, Friendships, Economy, and Voice. Expectations, Concerns?

With the advent of voice but a mere week away ... a few questions.

Will the Gorean and Furry communities survive voice integration into their communities.

How about our Goth, or Vampire and other RP communities?

Will you still be as loyal to your Master or Mistress when you first hear them talk and they sound like a "goofball" or anything other than that mysterious omnipresence you imagined them to be in your mind?

Will the Furry, Goth or Vampire communities survive the sudden general everyday common chatter that will overwhelm their attempts at immersion once voice integration takes hold of their communities.

Will the SL economy survive voice?

For the most part, it is largely known that men do not love shopping as much as women. And no one can deny that women's fashions, along with land, are the largest sectors contributing to, and driving the SL economy. With voice integration, and the accompanying reduced use of their female alts by many males due to voice, is it reasonable to predict a gradual but marked decline to the SL economy?

Have any content creators experienced a steady and noticeable decline in income since the advent of the voice intergration announcement in SL?

With the introduction of voice integration just a mere week away, what impact to these areas do you foresee in SL.

Will friends begin dissapearing?

Will relationships beging dissolving?

Do you feel a sense of betrayal?

Will SL continue to flourish despite voice integration?

So many questions, so many unknowns.

What are your concerns? What do you foresee in our SL future?

RP and furry sims will probably be mostly unaffected, since they know that no-one is really a vampire or an anthro fox or anything similar.

Sexual roleplays, such as Goreans and BDSM, will likely be gutted - but, not directly by voice. The argument that many of the women are played by men, who will refuse to voice because it would give them away, is well known - but also many of the actual women will refuse to voice too because they are older than their avs, or because they don't want to become a phone sex worker, or because they don't want to potentially be heard by the hubby and/or kids (or worst of all recognised by the other player).

However.. we already know that Playboy are coming to SL. Voice gives RL porn businesses a clear opportunity to defeat their competition on SL, and they do have phone sex workers.

not worried about voice myself I would not use it unless its to teach or something I dont see the point in daily SL stuff (too much noise ). If someone doesn't want to socialize because I dont want to have a mic stuck to my head when I play a game oh well such is life I suppose but i know a great many people wont be using voice for the same reasons as myself noisy & dont want all that chatter and kinda ruins the ambience of a game especially if you have a picture in your mind of what someone sounds like due to their avatar type etc

I suppose some people might not want to socialze with me because I dont want to use a mic all the time and such is life.

Only places I would use it in or even consider enabling the sound for it would be in a learning situation or a presentation or something like that

If i can disable in on my parcel I certainly wil be doing so

Absolute agreement here .. plus .. I strongly think that many of us accept typing a fantasy conversation while our minds are rustling up the next line or idea but actually speaking it .. into thin air .. sitting alone ... just doesn't bear thinking about!

I go inworld with my long distance fiancee. We tested Skype a while back. It worked ok but if we want to speak, we use the phone. I can't see me using voice in SL at all.

Voice is voluntary.

You don't HAVE to use it.

It won't destroy anything...only add to the experience of those who choose to use it.

Voice won't gut roleplaying.

People who came to Second Life to roleplay after roleplaying on MUSHes (or MUDs, or MUCKs, or MOOs) are still going to prefer to use text. Very few online roleplayers are skilled voice actors, but many thrive on the written word.

Other graphical online roleplaying games can have voice supplement. But in those cases, voice is not used for roleplaying purposes as much as it is used to strategically coordinate combat.

(And sometimes when I do table-top roleplaying in real life, I wish I could be roleplaying in text rather than doing different voices and struggling with voice acting. Ugh.)

Presumably, if you are socializing online rather than in the real world, there must be something about the online socialization that appeals to you over real world socialization. Not necessarily exclusively; you might have both in healthy doses. But to the extent that you would choose one over the other, there must be a difference. I think to a lot of people, being online frees them from physical constraints so that they can interact with others on the basis of their personalities. Those people are going to reject voice, and it's going to be a lot of people.

Of course, I'm also the kind of person who would rather trade e-mails with a friend than talk to them on the phone. Reading and editing what I say before I say it is a huge plus. Being able to refer back to exactly what someone has said to me is a huge plus.

Personally, I have a great speaking voice. Problem is, I sometimes talk faster than I think.

If everyone were using voice, then Second Life becomes an expensive and time-consuming chat line. If you want to chat in voice with people over a distance, use a chat line. That's what they are there for.

The ability to use voice in Second Life is, I think, a good addition. I'm going to venture a guess that voice is going to be more of the exception than the rule. People in Second Life to generally socialize probably aren't going to use it. Voice is more likely to be used in special events, possibilty in education scenarios, and with SL couples who like spending time one-on-one anyway.

I have absolutely no concerns over voice implementation, or of being affected negatively by not using it. I am using SL in a way that suits me, and don't see any hinderance of it. If SL stops provding with an acceptable level of entertainment and enjoyment, I will simply move on.Whether you choose to use it or not isn't important. just do so because it's what you want to do, not because you are being pressured or shamed into it.

First of all, given that the word "destroy" was nowhere in the OP, the fact that you use it says a lot about how you really feel.

The question is what impact will voice have in SL?

This is a common response of many pro-voice advocates in their effort to lull the SL community into believing that voice will be a "no biggie."

The fact remains that anyone looking at this subject objectively and from an unbiased point of view knows that voice will arguably have THE largest impact in SL of any changes made by LL to date. To assume that voice is voluntary and you don't have to use it so therefore it will have minimal impact is dismissing the fact that as long as voice is but a click away, most people will be expected to use it. To refuse to use it with a friend, a potential friend and/or a relationship will place and obvious adverse and ongoing strain on that friendship or relationship. Those relationships simply will not survive.

It's self-serving to say otherwise.

"Ooh .. oh .. oww! .. sorry, this pose ball is killing my back!"

Apologies then for using the word 'destroy'. I should have used 'hurt' or 'adversely affect' or any number of other words.

Voice WILL have a significant effect on SL. It will dramatically increase the usefulness of web-conferencing and other business activities. It will help those who DO wish to speak to eachother via voice (I have a weekly PnP game I run in SL...we run a Ventrilo server underneath SL and are very much looking forward to voice integration so that we can get rid of the Vent Server...I also speak in voice with people on SL through Skype and YIM).

For those who do not wish to speak to each other via voice, they don't have to. To say that the OPTION to do something makes it virtually REQUIRED is equally close-minded as saying that voice will have no effect (which, btw, I didn't say...I said it will not 'destroy' (see above for terms alternate to the word 'destroy') anything).

If you are a man hiding as a woman and are afraid that your partner will find out your real gender--well, you've been living an insanely immoral and repugnant SL anyway then.

If you are a person who is shy and not wanting to engage in voice, then don't. If your friends leave you because you won't use it--they're not friends.

I don't plan on using voice in SL Role-play communities. Could you imagine the chatter among a full sim anyway? I plan to use text in those communities and am willing to bet that most others are going to use text as well.

Voice has its place. Its place will be found as the community adapts the new tool. It is an amazing BENEFIT to us all...and NOT REQUIRED. If YOU feel that YOU will be required to use voice--then sit back and ask yourself why...and why would you put yourself in such a situation? Might even be better to ask...if you're 'required'...why not? The only real reason 'why not' is if you are deaf, mute, or hard-of-hearing. If so, I don't think anyone will complain when you tell them such in text.

Oh...and if someone wants you to 'phone sex' them...and threatens to leave if you don't...then...just don't and let them leave. Like you'd want to keep someone like that around you anyway?

I understand the concerns that many people have and think they are completely valid but I can't see voice making too large an impact on my second life. I have a small circle of SL friends, none of whom were chomping at the bit for voice capabilities to be put in. My in world communication with them will be pretty much unchanged. I RP sometimes but again I doubt voice will affect my experiece, the less "shooty" RPs will make little or no use of it in my opinion as it would just detract from the environment.

There will be personal relationships ending because one or other won't use voice I'm sure. Its not a nice thought, but then there's also the question of whether any relationship with someone who would demand you use voice is worth it in the first place?

I won't be using voice for several reasons: at different times I need to keep the noise down, I feel silly talking toa computer, I prefer to speak face to face, if I RP I'd still need to describe actions and moods (something which would sound ludicrous if spoken). But I appreciate that for others this is a beneficial addition (though I doubt essential).

If anything there are so many people saying they don't want or won't use voice that I doubt anyone's experience is going to be spoiled by not using it unless they are unlucky enough for everyone they interact with to be selfish enough to demand that they use voice.

So, I need to be deaf in order for you to feel I am justified in not using voice?

How about just, "I don't like it?"

I've seen the SL Voice YouTube videos. They were quite hideous. Teleconferencing at its worst, avatars shambling about with aimless chatter as a background voiceover. From everything I've heard, the voice sessions on the beta grid are an awful, chattering, annoying mess.

And yes, as a woman (RL and SL) I don't relish using my real voice online for anonymity reasons. Nor do I relish having myself subject to the vocal slings and arrows of every 14 year old griefer who stole his mother's driver's license number. Frankly, I could go on interminably, so I shan't.

The one thing that gives me hope is the number of people who seem to realize that willy nilly using voice is a horrid idea. Certainly, it might work well for businesses, and perhaps some classes (though personally, I prefer the ease of a chat log in classes). But once people realize its limited utility, I sincerely hope that it becomes nothing more than yet another silly tech gadget gathering dust on the back shelf.

The problem is that the argument that "anyone who stops being your friend because you won't voice isn't really your friend" is far too familiar.. it's what your mother told you when you said that the prettier girls got all the attention, and when you went back they still did, and you started to wonder why your mum told you that instead of helping you be prettier, and then you realise why, and then you cry a lot.

The same applies here - inevitably there will be a small number whose voice is perfect for the role they are playing and who have no qualms about using voice, and they may well wind up getting all the attention because of the extra experience they can offer. Moreover, there is always the possibilty of corporations bussing such people in (as with Playboy).

We don't want to have a situation where the few people who do happen to have the perfect voices for their roles in SL wind up dominating role-playing in the same way that the few people who have exactly the right combination of talents and ideas wind up dominating content creation. For content creation this is inevitable and OK because it benefits everyone in the end (everyone can use the created content), but for RP it doesn't spread the benefit so much, since people's motivations for RP as entertainment tend by and large to be a lot more selfish (ie, the fact that someone else can get a lot of attention doesn't improve your own RP that much).

This is a real hot-button issue for some residents, and I can see why.

Basically the *point* of having a second life is to make it different than your first!

* * * * *

Here is what the future holds.

1) Voice will take over as the 'norm' in large part, over 12 to 18 months or even faster.

Why? Just because it's possible. Video killed the radio star, and all that. Proof: The There.com experience. It's similar enough to be highly, highly relevant.



2) There will always be text users, even exclusively text users. But they are going to be marginalised badly, left out, run off in large number, and their golden age is over.

Do I personally want this? NO! I'm happy typing, myself. Is it going to happen? Yeah, I'm afraid it will. So I'll end up listening 100% of the time, speaking maybe 5 or 10% of the time as appropriate to the person I'm talking to.



3) The demographic will change dramatically. This is mainstreaming, folks. The masses getting what they want. The artiste technorati with their creativity, their kinks and their furryness soon to be utterly overwhelmed by Family-in-Vegas-Drawn-by-Sin-but-really-Seeking-Disney-Experience.

The Company is correct: voice is a key element to the platform. Why? Because if the Second Life grid doesn't have it, the eventual competition will. It's not a choice for them, as much as it will be the end of a wonderful era for many of us.



4) Don't *even* get me started on pricing. Current thinking, last I heard, was to leave all 195 USD/mo private regions without voice unless another 1200 USD/yr for each region is paid. This won't fly overall; it will fractionate the daylights out of the grid, create ghettos and divisions, and disrupt some of the best areas in SL.

Once the mainstream culture switches to voice, the last thing SL needs is 1000 crushed dreams as the mainstream population ditches the voiceless lands.

I'm praying they choose voice as a premium feature, not tied to land.

If you already have a 195 USD/mo region, do you want to pay another 100 USD monthly just so unpaid members worldwide can have free phonecalls in your sim? Ouch.

Many private islands seem to either be residential areas, large stores, or RP themed areas. Residential areas will probably need to upgrade (which makes me wonder about the lack of protest regarding this from certain quarters). Stores probably won't, because nobody would refuse to buy a product because they couldn't voice in the shop. RP themed areas are the difficult ones..

I'm premium on my 'main' account. I'm just praying there is an off button so I don't have to hear it.

You left something out. If they choose not to use it, and turn it off in preferences, how do they now follow the conversation that is mainly in voice?

After spending all weekend using voice chat with the occasional trip to the main grid to complete some building I was working on, I can say that voice chat will only enhance SL.

Any RP/sex land owner in their right mind will disable v-chat to keep the aesthetic that RP must have. Be it sexual or non, it will ruin it if the voice doesn't match the av. Think South Park's Warcraft episode. I think those industries will be unaffected if the people running things pay attention to what's going on.

Other than that I think it'll only make businesses better. It'll also add a new dynamic to the social aspect of SL. I can tell you that I made more friends in 3 days of v-chat than I did in 3 months in regular SL! It's because some of us don't do too well with the "crowded chatroom" style of conversation. Also I can actually build or pilot a vehicle with a passenger and be able to talk whereas before I had to a) pay attention to multiple parts of the screen at once and/or (b) stop what I was doing to talk to someone.

There's also the teaching aspect that will be the first thing to actually have RL relevance in SL. I plan on taking advantage of the language learning opportunities that will automatically come up. You'll also see building/scripting classes get MUCH better because you can communicate so much more in a shorter period of time. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw an overall improvement in the quality of builds in the year after v-chat starts!

Overall I think v-chat is going to save SL from itself. A lot more people will feel more comfortable in SL and friendships will be all the better for it. Those two things are the most important aspects of SL in my opinion.

I have quite a lot of real-life teaching experience, and certainly I will not be teaching any classes in SL using voice nor advising others to do so.

When using voice IRL teachers have to speak more slowly than normal, and often use visual aids or distribute notes at the same time, to deal with students missing or misunderstanding critical parts of what's being said. The fact that in SL students in a text-based lesson can scroll back and re-read what you've said in the past - and can do so without "missing" what you're saying right now, because it'll wait at the end of the buffer - is a huge bonus, certainly not a loss.

The issue of the fact that in SL the students could be from a huge number of different countries, and use of voice brings in the issue of having to speak at the right speed for people whose first language might not be English or for people who might not be used to your accent, also..

Desmond, I appreciate your post because it gives the impression of being unbiased ... until we get to point 4. Ie., land ownership, your business, your point of interest, and then there is suddenly a "bad idea" connotation.

Why is the reasoning that "because the competition has it"a good one?

As far as I am aware, There has had voice for some time and SL has not. SL is currently worlds more successful than There, is it not?

It can not be considered a good idea unless it's and idea the masses voluntarily want, consent to, and approve as opposed to it being forced unto the masses as SL is in the process of doing with voice. Certainly, of the majority of the blogs, forums, and polls Ive visited and seen, overwhelmingly voice is rejected. Even Philip, in a post he wrote a while back discussing voice, alluded to an article that articulated the pitfalls of voice and that awaiting the implementation and wide use of it would be wise.

In other words, who's to say that There, or any of the other platforms using voice would not have been just as successful, if not more so, without it. SL could have established itself as the sanctuary were we all could come, immersionists and augmentists alike, and enjoyed SL equally. It's not like voice is not already available. Ventrilo, Skype and several other voice programs are already being used widely on the grid.

As far as business conferencing and education goes, voice could have been offered to those entities on a parcel by parcel basis with minimal effect on the rest of the community.

SL's motto is "Your world, Your imagination." It is obvious that wonderful motto no longer fits SL. Perhaps a new motto is in order.

Mr. Shang, I hope you're wrong and am far too afraid that you are right. Suffice to say, yes, it is about mainstreaming. How can I say this nicely? If we are looking at mainstream USA, they aren't the most literate group in the world. They are no doubt drawn to the notion of a loud, mindlessly chattery grid. Lord knows, that's what most popular culture is like.

So, if Linden Labs is in fact hoping to draw that lot in, well, they will do so at the expense of the rest of us. We see this in the Real World, do we not, when formerly artistic areas of town become gentrified and sanitized. The creative leave, with naught but little plaques left behind announcing that Allen Ginsburg slumped into unconciousness here, or that Toulouse Lautrec hung about here, to his family's everlasting shame (in fairness to Montmarte, down the hill is still quite boheme).



But how can they lure Mother and Father Six-Pack into your lands if they ask them for a cover charge? They'll toddle off elsewhere, no doubt.





Well, that's just it, isn't it? They wish to milk the golden goose dry (never was good at my aphorisms). You, sir, are that goose. You're in, and I suspect they think you will remain so. If you don't dig your heels in on this (and I do know you are!), they will steamroll you and all you've built in the name of market share.

Sorry, just a bit tired and cranky this morn. Parts of SL are amazingly creative and wonderful places. I just will hate to see it turn into one large three dimensional E-Bay. But I suspect strongly that is the current business plan.

I, for one, won't be using voice. For me, it's just a teesy, tiny too personal to have my voice out there. Beside, I HAVE ENOUGH BANDWIDTH SUCKING APPLICATIONS RUNNING AS IT IS. SL being one of them, and streaming in SL another, I don't need voice to add to the suck.

Supposedly it won't impact your bandwidth much. The beta grid is somewhat laggy, but that could be the zillions of sculptie prims lying about.

Perhaps one of the problems that voice in Second Life presents is a "good" problem.

I understand why roleplayers will not want to use voice.

But if I were interacting with a roleplayer, I wouldn't expect or ask that person to use voice. I understand what the roleplayer is doing- acting out a fictional persona.

The problem comes in this situation: There is a social interaction in which Person A thinks that he or she is roleplaying, and Person B thinks that Person A is being himself or herself.

Person A is entitled to anonymity. Person B is entitled to know the social rules of the relationship- are they playing a game or having a friendship.

So Person B says, "I'd like to talk to you in voice." Person A responds with, "I don't want to." There's no problem with that exchange. That leaves ambiguity of how much the "character" matches the "player" for Person A. But that's precisely what a roleplayer wants- ambiguity between the "character" and "player." And Person B, if not previously alerted to the fact that Person A is roleplaying, now knows not to necessarily assume that the "character" and "player" are the same.

The problem with voice comes when Person A is roleplaying a character, but wants Person B to think that Person is not roleplaying, but that the "character" and the "player" are the same. That's where Person A feels the pressure to come up with a justification for not using voice, when Persron A has no responsibility to give any justification at all.

But I feel that if Person A is "roleplaying," but wants Person B to think that he or she is not roleplaying, that's just dishonest. And if the introduction of voice makes it harder to perpetuate a dishonestly like that, it's a good thing.

There are some people who won't want to interact with Person A because Person A doesn't use voice. But just as Person A has the right to not use voice, other people have the right to choose their own online friends and social situations. If Person B only wants to socialize with people who aren't roleplaying, that's Person B's right. Person A's dishonesty about whether he or she is roleplaying or not denies Person B's right to choose his or her friends and to consent, or deny consent, to relationships based on his or her preferences.

I'm not familiar with the implementation, since I haven't been to the beta grid (I want to be paid in advance for my services as a beta-tester).

Can someone listen to voice without having to speak into a microphone? I mean, if I have my microphone unplugged, that doesn't disabile me hearing the voice, does it? That would be my assumption, but I don't actually know the technology.