Thank you Prokofy Neva!

The council convenes in September and January never in August.

i want free donuts from timmie's. what's up with those pricks charging me $$$ for fried dough?

Aw, I'm not old enough to be a feted hedonist . I'm working on it. I need to work on my downtalking ability. Anyone giving classes?

I almost did correct feted when I first saw it but being a good little elitist I looked it up first. whew, that was close!

Ooo, can I qualify for that one, Ingrid?

awww.. Ulrika! YOU are NO freak!

But.. haha.. I have an avatar I made that represents Pen when she was 8 years old... we should do a "your av as a child" event sometime.. hehe..

My dearest Prokofy,

There is so much wrong with this - let's see, where to begin:



No, actually you embellished it, twisted it, and bayed on about it like a banshee. If we learned one thing from the most recent presidential election, it is that saying the same garbage over and over again does not make it true. You like to fancy yourself this sort of wry messenger when in fact you are simply a frustrated person who came late to the party and are pissy that you can't be the girl with the most cake.



Ah but you are seeing a different conflict. It's not targetted against this revered Skull & Bones group that you seem to have such disdain for. The "content barons" (my lord, you like to jump on the label bandwagon - "content baron" was a tongue in cheek name) cover the entire spectrum of players, old and new. I know several very successful content creators who are less than 6 months old and make some of the most popular products in SL. The thing is, it's all been done before, in more dramatic ways - the entire economy changed a year ago, this is a minor little bump that has been met with so much hand wringing it nearly blows the mind.

As far as your statement about subsidies, it doesn't even make sense, so can't really reply to it - I'll leave it alone. I assume you think you are onto some profound SL truth yet again, but as usual, 'tis much ado about nada.



What I have been most amused by with the whole "fuck you hedonism" thing is you attribute it to the wrong group AGAIN. The most common occurance of the behavior has been new players coming along, moving into a sim and thinking they can get rich by putting up mediocre club, having many Sexy Escorts In Schoolgirl Uniform contests that are paid for by LL, throw out a few sex balls, stream some bad dance music or Van Halen and destroy the sim for those around them. Established players have been some of the most vocal in wanting to protect sims from this kind of abuse so that everyone in a sim can enjoy it. You want to always attribute behavior to a certain group, this sort of smug myopic bigotry that you have that actually smacks of resetment at not being able to sit at the table where people are taken seriously so you bite at the heels like a rabid dog.



It's interesting that you came in at the end of the Land Baron era, yet seem to know so much about the intricacies of it. The outcry against the massive spike in land prices was pretty universal, and most severely affected new players, not older established players who already owned land and had built up the wealth to absorb the prices. Many people, including myself, were so adamant about the problems and the abuse for precisely the reason that it made it increasingly difficult for new players to enjoy the same benefits we had enjoyed, and were very protective of that. It is interesting how you try to combine the incubator program issues with land barons, but the two had nothing in common, no matter how you try to blur the lines. There was no massive outcry of older players demanding to get land for free. There was an outcry across the board of players not wanting to pay $25/m to Anshe Chung et al for the privilege of having the land bought out from underneath them in auction and resold at a 1000% markup.

You touched on developer incentives - again, that program is completely tied to dwell, and if you look at recent recipients of it, you will realize that again they vary across the entire spectrum of players. Again, some of the loudest outcry for the removal or at least reform of the developer incentive program have been established players, the same ones you claim are taking advantage of it and so fiercely protective of nursing off the Lindens. Event subsidies by and large go to newer players - of all the events I've held, including mentor and instructor events, I think I have submitted payment requests maybe 2-3 times in 2 years. Established players are not the ones howling and screaming now about the removal of those subsidies, yet you are attributing it to us - look inward my friend, it the consumer class you rode the wave in on that feels this sense of entitlement.

The ratings were again abused most often by...wait for it...NEW PLAYERS. You are ttributing all of this stuff to the wrong group of players to try to illustrate some shocking amount of entitlement that older players have enjoyed that caused it to be taken away for everyone, yet it is there is no truth in that whatsoever - we are the first to want it taken away and the last to rely on it. Your entire point about ratings and having items out in the world is so far out in left field that I don't even think GPS will help to find your point. Those who benefit most from ratings are not people who make items - do you know how rarely people actually rate through items themselves? Those who received the most ratings were the most social, the ones having events and rate parties, and again, these tend to be newer players who rely on this technique to up their bonus.



Aww we don't hate you either, Prokofy - just the hot air hyperbole that constantly creates a whole smoke and mirror show where you claim this profound understanding of SL society and its history, but time and again show to have such a distorted understanding that it relegates everything you have said right into the bin marked "delusional". We have sunk or swim this entire time, by building businesses, creating content, establishing relationships, weathering massive changes, and growing and changing. Your disdain is quite obvious, and it seems no doseage of logic or truth is going to change that. You see, that is why I thanked you. Without you, we would still be running around saying "may ghost of my dead uncle hunt you all down and kill you" or some such thing.

However misinformed your rhetoric may be, it is colorful, and we do enjoy the colorful people in SL. For that you are welcome in our councils, though I am sure new players probably won't like you too much when they realize that it's actually them that you bitch about so much in your rally against subsidies and free anything. Massel tov and Godspeed, Prokofy Neva.

Wow, are you having fun yet??? Isn't it great having an arch enemy on the forums?

I'm not at all pissy and coming late to the party, I wander around in wonderment, I challenge things, and I figure the party is just getting started.

"Content barons" seems like an accurate label, and it may or may not intersect with the inner feted elite who represent oldbies and beta-testers who mind-melded with the LL geek culture.



Well, I beg to disagree. I see newbies, taken as a whole, acting very timidly and fearfully. They fear buying land. They fear sticking their necks out. They fear all the hard learning. Way more people than should, given the innovative nature of SL, end up leaving out of frustration or losing interest. I can think of a few cases where really talented and intelligent people almost didn't stay in the game, or left in fact. Sure, newbies destroy sims and leave them as slag heaps. But....it isn't newbies who left so much scraped and burnt land all over SL and that's not what I mean. I mean that sense of eminent domain, that some oldbies have this sense because they've "suffered" from what often amounts to newbies and midbies building bad that they have eminent domain to spread out and have everyone genuflect at their builds. No sale.

Smug myopic bigotry is EXACTLY what characterizes some of these groupings, old or new isn't so important, but sense of entitlement and superiority is operative. Just look at the hours that you have spent trying to "train" me, an upstart newbie in the ways of SL. Just think of language like Ulrika's post "WE thought we BROKE you". It rots.

Geez I don't need to sit at THAT table where self-referential people who think they need to be taken seriously are taking themselves more seriously than they should LOL. And to get a seat at the table, you just have to pay on an auction. Doesn't seem that hard to do, really.

I haven't combined the incubator program with the barons, how could that be, they are obviously separate.



The people howling the most about the land barons are old players who think it all should be just some free wiki. They often advocate flat rates for all land and no auctions. See, now you've gone and revealed your hand there Cristiano, when you say "the consumer class you rode the wave in on" -- see, you view yourself as a fierce protector of the feted inner core of players and you sneer at a "consumer class" coming in like a wave even though this sea of clueless newbies are YOUR customers buying YOUR animations. YOU reveal disdain when you deploy a phrase like "the consumer class you rode the wave on" as if there was something faintly disgusting about "consumers" by contrast with "content creators". Baloney.

I'd like a Linden to answer that question of how many ratings come from rating objects and how many from rating in f2f encounters -- I'm surely not taking your word on that. In the long run now, those with objects out are definitely going to benefit if someone really feels so motivated to rate a creator -- it means paying $25 on top of what they already paid. Ppl are no longer going to be liberally sprinking ratings around.



*Shrugs*. Nobody holds a gun to your head to read anything you deem "smoke and mirrors". I'm taking the time to lay out my case in answer to various fucktards who take over forums and bully everybody and think they are the last word on every subject. I am merely articulating my perceptions about certain groups in SL, and what I find is some for whom the shoe fits are so oversensitive and so shrill about protecting their own that they are utterly devoid of any sense of humour and any self-reflection. I don't know why you get credit for building businesses, creating content blah blah when I myself am doing this too and thousands of other people. *You have company now in your game, Cristiano. Get used to it.* Or did you think you would rule it for ever?

Something might be wrong with my computer, I can make out ascii characters there, but all I read is Blah, blah blah blah blah blah blah

<<<Raises hand timidly

Can I have an invite?

Probably... lol... we're spreading

Awww thnx hun

Figured I missed my invite since I was kinda part of the original thread. LOL

Probably. It's gone beyond that now anyway... I think there are a lot of oldbies wanting to be Feted and/or inner

Yes I bet there are plenty!

Sorry, guess my humor didnt cpme across well. That is the point I was making.

No room for another group anyway, so guess I'm stuck with my own inner-inner core. LOL

P

Nooo, you have to join now... you'll have to quite something irrelavent, like I dunno... Jade Wolf or something... lol

LMAO
Do you accept friendless, homeless and poor Oldbies? Would I still be feted?

Not sure... probably more fetid than feted in that case. Would you be hedonistic though?

Always!

That's ok then. It's in the post.

Sorry Cristinano, but this is simply nonsense to mention my name in relation to the exorbitant margins of those whom I drove out of business.

"Anshe Chung et al" does not stand for the generation of land barons who bought at auctions for 10 L$ and sold for 25 L$. I have been first of new generation of realtors who drastically drove down margin. In July I was buying snow hype land for 12.5$ and selling for 15$ when most land around it was marked up for 20$ by people who used to bid 10$ at auctions. If you look at land market you can notice two developments since July: 1) more and more land sold by Anshe 2) general land prices and margins drop further and further.

Please give me credit for my role in reducing the problem you mention instead of making me part of it.

Yeah, you know Cristiano, the syndrome where some players think they 'are' SL? Or even better, that they alone have 'helped' SL overall? Its like some kind of ego-disease. Next, we'll see posts about how they might leave, and if they do, 'SL will suffer'.

Eh, get over yourselves, I say.

Maxx, I suggest you stop stalking me on these forums like if you were one abandoned lonely dog. There are numerous threads now where you decided make peepee below my posts. I don't have time nor willingness to give you the negative attention you deserve, so please stroll away.

hehe he didnt mention you..

I figured you would not reply to the bulk of what I said, so I will just answer this since you directed a question at me. You are the one bashing older players for having built businesses, creating content, etc. as if there is some shame in having done so and been successful at it. You can't then say "why do only you get credit for it?". You can't have it both ways, but you certainly try to, especially when your own hypocrisy is pointed out. We have had company in SL all along, and that has been the greatest part of it. Unlike you, I don't have a problem with any class of players in SL - new or old. I have friends across the entire spectrum of them,

BTW, referring to the consumer class of SL players is not showing any disdain for them, you seem to be the only one to have disdain for any groups of people. Nice try though to paint me as being against new players when you are the one bitching and moaning about their actions. I recognize the importance of the group of players that is in SL to socialize and enjoy themselves and not take part in the creative aspects of it. I just don't believe it is up to Linden Lab to support them - I believe we as a community have the capabilities to do that all on our own.

Anshe,

During that time, I personally witnessed you selling land for $20/m and higher. You cannot begin to claim you did not take part in the high end of that market for as long as you possibly could. You are synoymous with that time period in SL, and with the controversy surrounding it. Coincidentally, the time period you are referring to when things improved is also the time period where the market dropped from the flood of new land, not by benevelonce on your part. I will certainly give you credit where credit is due - you have built an extremely successful land business, but to deny that you did so on the back of a market that spiked extremely high and that you profitted from greatly (even if you lost out once the land crashed) s not being honest.

Thats right isnt your date the 16th of Jan 2003 initially