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Run on the banks

Madison Foyston
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Join date: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 4
08-23-2006 13:53
What if all the players decide to withdraw all of there lidens and exchange it for dollars all with in a short period of time.
Adriana Caligari
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Join date: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 458
08-23-2006 14:05
Within about 20 minutes you'd be able to buy a million linden for a dollar on the Lindex, then wait till everybody comes back and starts buying linden again to continue playing and you'd make a killing.

Wouldnt effect LL or SL at all - LL would continue "printing" linden$ and people would continue playing SL.

Would kill content creators for a few days/weeks until the Linden regained its value.

All of the "banks" in SL would mysteriously encounter network problems and people wouldnt be able to contact them.

Standard week I'd say :-)
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Svar Beckersted
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Posts: 783
08-23-2006 14:05
The value of the L$ falls.
Gordon Wendt
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08-23-2006 14:08
That brings up an interesting point though, is it possible for someone with sufficent capital to manipulate the entire lindex by buying and/or selling massive amounts of lindens at once.
Svar Beckersted
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08-23-2006 14:09
From: Gordon Wendt
That brings up an interesting point though, is it possible for someone with sufficent capital to manipulate the entire lindex by buying and/or selling massive amounts of lindens at once.


No.
Adriana Caligari
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Join date: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 458
08-23-2006 14:13
It was happening a short time ago - yes it is possible.

As long as people are willing to sell "at market prices" all it takes are a bunch of 10,000 L$ entries ( if that ) selling at x,x+1,x+2,x+3, etc etc etc and you can push the lindex down as far as you want.

When you have the price you want you wait for enough people to sell "at market" then cancel all of your orders.

( I know it more complex than that - that is the simple view of it - IMO )
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milady Guillaume
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Join date: 28 Dec 2003
Posts: 696
08-23-2006 14:14
From: Gordon Wendt
That brings up an interesting point though, is it possible for someone with sufficent capital to manipulate the entire lindex by buying and/or selling massive amounts of lindens at once.



Yes.
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ReserveBank Division
Senior Member
Join date: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 1,408
08-23-2006 14:15
From: Madison Foyston
What if all the players decide to withdraw all of there lidens and exchange it for dollars all with in a short period of time.




I will laugh as the Linden Dollar turns into toilet paper.
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Dnel DaSilva
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Join date: 22 May 2005
Posts: 781
08-23-2006 14:15
From: Madison Foyston
What if all the players decide to withdraw all of there lidens and exchange it for dollars all with in a short period of time.


If ALL the players decided to sell ALL thier L$, who would be left to buy them?

I think the OP, being new, is not aware that LindeX is just a trding floor, LL doesn't actually buy the L$. Of course I could be wrong.
kerunix Flan
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Join date: 3 Sep 2005
Posts: 393
08-23-2006 14:16
A feature shutdown the lindex selling option if the value drop to quickly. (never used yet)
Gordon Wendt
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08-23-2006 14:39
From: kerunix Flan
A feature shutdown the lindex selling option if the value drop to quickly. (never used yet)


I knew they had the feature but I think it would be pretty chilling to the market if they ever had to do it, not to mention probably causing a market crash after it re-opened.
Lee Dimsum
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Join date: 22 Feb 2006
Posts: 118
08-23-2006 14:42
From: Adriana Caligari
It was happening a short time ago - yes it is possible.

As long as people are willing to sell "at market prices" all it takes are a bunch of 10,000 L$ entries ( if that ) selling at x,x+1,x+2,x+3, etc etc etc and you can push the lindex down as far as you want.

When you have the price you want you wait for enough people to sell "at market" then cancel all of your orders.

( I know it more complex than that - that is the simple view of it - IMO )

You couldn't, because market orders are executed instantly.
Jon Rolland
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Join date: 3 Oct 2005
Posts: 705
08-23-2006 17:13
From: kerunix Flan
A feature shutdown the lindex selling option if the value drop to quickly. (never used yet)


I wonder if that feature is gonna kick in soon the L is moving very fast for a wed. Couple large piles clear and we could see a fast gain in value.
ReserveBank Division
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Join date: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 1,408
08-23-2006 18:58
From: Jon Rolland
I wonder if that feature is gonna kick in soon the L is moving very fast for a wed. Couple large piles clear and we could see a fast gain in value.



In your dreams... They L$ has flat lined. There isn't enough inflow of willing US$ buyers to push up the valuation of this currency.
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mcgeeb Gupte
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Join date: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,152
08-23-2006 19:03
From: ReserveBank Division
In your dreams... They L$ has flat lined. There isn't enough inflow of willing US$ buyers to push up the valuation of this currency.


LOL!!

I supposed this is just another dead cat bounce.
Zany Golem
Purple Freak
Join date: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 113
08-23-2006 19:07
From: mcgeeb Gupte
LOL!!

I supposed this is just another dead cat bounce.


hehe i knew if i refreshed someone would've beaten me to this
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-Zany
ReserveBank Division
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Join date: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 1,408
08-23-2006 19:57
From: Zany Golem
hehe i knew if i refreshed someone would've beaten me to this




Remember to send me that IM so we can hook up later.
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Jon Rolland
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Join date: 3 Oct 2005
Posts: 705
08-23-2006 21:10
From: mcgeeb Gupte
LOL!!

I supposed this is just another dead cat bounce.


If that cat is actually dead the same must be true of the law of gravity. lol
Freyr Elvehjem
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Join date: 13 May 2006
Posts: 133
08-24-2006 02:57
From: ReserveBank Division
In your dreams... They L$ has flat lined. There isn't enough inflow of willing US$ buyers to push up the valuation of this currency.

Well, look who is back. Flat-lined you say? But...that would be contrary to what you were screaming, oh, going on TWO months ago. According to your predictions, the L$ should be around 400:1 right now. I guess if I squint just right that L$292 kinda looks like 400...not.
Adriana Caligari
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Join date: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 458
08-24-2006 03:28
From: Lee Dimsum
You couldn't, because market orders are executed instantly.


Nice theory - but I believe wrong - instant doesn't count for anything.

At the moment the sell rate is 292 and the buy rate 305.

Placing enough blocks of currency on the sell to cover all points up to 304 means that you now get your currency at 304/305 when someone sells at market rates.

When that happens my guess is that all of the buy orders between 305 and 310 will disappear and relocate to 310-315.

You can now continue your push of sell up to 309.

This causes panic and soon the 310 buys are relocating as well and the selling is starting to increase - rapidly.
( People want there money now - as has been seen - they are not prepared to wait out a small storm )

Pretty soon you are in the same position we were all in two months ago where the Linden is falling like a stone.

All because someone with a very small amount of change ( less than US$5000 ) decided to play the market.

Yes there is a Linden throttle on the system, but nobody ( except linden ) knows when it will be kicked in , and as mentioned above the market would probably panic crash of its own accord straight after it was removed.

So I stand by my statement that it is entirely possible that a single person with some loose change can influence the market in fairly drastic ways.
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John Horner
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Join date: 27 Jun 2006
Posts: 626
08-24-2006 03:47
Like any other order driven system the Linden could be impacted by smart buying and selling, the same applies (in theory) to any such system. I suggest people who are interested further take a look at the London Stock Exchange and review how the Sets system works for share sales and purchases.

However.....because the Linden dollar is exchangeable for US dollars, anyone trying to do such a trick "could" be potentially sued for fraud if detected. The issue is not with the Linden dollar (which is totally controlled by Linden Labs) but the end product, the US dollar.

And to short circuit anyone who posts the usual about Lindens having no value I would refer you to the legal concept of "fungible value
Adriana Caligari
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Join date: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 458
08-24-2006 04:11
I agree - that is why the various world markets are policed very heavily to stop any one individual or corporation from attempting to influence them.

As L$ are exchangeable for US$ ( and therefore any currency ) the same should apply - If someone tried it they "could" end up in court.

However because the amounts are so ridiculously small when compared to real markets the only way any such person is liable to end up in court is if they did significant damage to the platform as a whole - or any large business within SL.

And then it would be a ground breaking case ( I don't believe I have read of any similar cases for any other similar environment ) and muck would start flying in all directions when it was shown that there was no policing and no sufficient controls in place to stop such an event happening.

Just my take.
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Tomaster Fudo
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Join date: 15 Aug 2006
Posts: 1
08-25-2006 17:45
my head hurts
Barbara Bayliss
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Join date: 17 May 2006
Posts: 3
08-25-2006 18:39
Damn... you guys have WAY to much time on your hands...
Sandy Barnett
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Join date: 19 May 2006
Posts: 65
Whoa Doggy !!!
08-25-2006 19:57
Hold on to your hats, fella's ! Here comes 280 ! ! !


Stable dollar is good, you say, RBD, but when it is stable and maintains at 300....then you call it "stagnant", and continue to say that collapse is just a breath away...ever since May. (and probably before) But You were really going wild at 330...about how it was going to 400....and since then....well....it has GAINED 50 points ! <scratching head>

I think maybe someone is really involved in a world better called '3rd Life" because it is not the real world, and it is not THIS one, either !
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