New Residents Being Scammed?

Here's something to consider...

I know players who would not ever consider owning anything BUT PG simm land.

"One mans trash is another mans Gold" as the saying goes.

Racer P.

When I started with Marlin Engineering, I made the mistake of buying 1024 in a mature sim, and set up my headquarters there.

Its a mistake because when I go into "Find", and type in "vehicle", you get a ton of crap if you have the mature button clicked. Casinos, clubs, whatever, and since the list is sorted by traffic, they are all much higher that any legitimate vehicle builder gets.

Fortunately for me, the sim next door was PG, and the lot next door (I had the corner lot) went up for sale, and I bought it and moved everything over (literally - I dragged it over).

The other big reason I would never set up my shop in a mature sim is I do my development there, and I like to test there. Most mature sims on the mainland are lagged to death by malls, clubs, and casinos, and flying vehicles in those sims is chancey at best.

PG all the way

- Jon

Today, I get an IM from a person I met in the WA. She is somewhat downhearted because she realized she was ripped off royally.

I asked her to show me the land, and sure enough it's SL Loonie. Apparently, this person sent her an IM offering to buy the land at 2x value. Before jumping to conclusions, I asked her for some details as to what was said. She mentioned to SL Loonie, that she had 1600 Lindens on her, and with the sale of the land, would she have enough money to buy a bigger plot in Mature after the sale (which would total around 2600L). SL Loonie replied, no problem. Well, she sold the land and went shopping, and imagine her suprise when she looked at mature plots.

Offering to buy land at 2/sq m is not a violation of anything, BUT misrepresenting something to make a sale is. It's a scam and it's goes way beyond a simple offer to buy.

I advised her to file an abuse report and send LL an email outlining the particulars of the sales tactic.

Oh..the land was re-marked for sale for $10,240 Lindens. This is pure scam based on fraud and little else. SL Loonie...your days are numbered.

I'm not wanting to pick on her, nor am trying, but you might want to advise her that asking a question of whether it's a good idea to do business with the person she's doing business with at the time MAY be a bad idea in most cases.

My. That was a sentence and a half.

Anyway, I'm sorry about it happening, and hope those effecting such nastyness are dealt with quickly and ruthlessly. This kind of thing is just bad manners...

Oh yes it does. This is a predatory tactic. Not everyone is savvy when they join SL, I see it everyday in the WA. To imply they should "know better" is hiding behind the facts.

Targeting newbies is shameful and disgusting.

This is all fair and reasonable. I think that, bottom line, what is needed is a massive consumer education campaign. The problem is how to get the word out with the limited ability that SL offers to advertise anything at all. This doesn't excuse an outright automated first land scam though. There also needs to be some accountability for people rezing automated "double your money" cubes on unclaimed first land.

The purpose of this automated cube can be viewed as nothing other than a clear attempt to TARGET uneducated consumers and lure them in with a promise of something that sounds GREAT, quickly enough that they will snap it up BEFORE educating themselves. From this fact we can conclude that they KNOW what they are doing is WRONG. There may be no "law" covering it per se, but it is morally INEXCUSABLE and there definately SHOULD be.

I also don't think the comparisons between real life and SL first land are fair. Comparing that to the SL free market is fine, but not first land. It's very very VERY hard to come across an RL equivelent of SL's first land, and ESPECIALLY for a first time real estate purchaser. When you're selling your house IRL you already know that it has significant value, so I think this point is moot.

Additionally IRL there are brokers/agents/title companies/LAWS/etc which all serve a role in providing consumers with various protections. Perhaps it would be prudent for someone to set up large-scale agencies similar to these in SL.

Shaun, I stumbled on this thread in the archives. It looks like you reported it to Linden, but I couldn't find anything more about their reaction. Did they consider it new-resident-scam abuse or fair play in a free market?

Pietro

PS - When I bought my first land, someone offered me the double-your-money scam, but I had been playing long enough not to take the "deal".

Well, if the newbie knows about the find button, and how to look at land for sale, I don't think it is a scam to them. The problem is I seem to doubt a newbie will have already figured all this out.

If you are new, and you read this, click the find button. There is a pull down menu in the upper left hand corner that has options like Auction and For Sale. You want the For Sale option. The cheapest land right now available for sale is $L2.5/meter2. Look for yourself, because this will be different when you try it. If you actually do want a QUICK payout, put the land up for sale at the same or slightly higher price as the cheapest land available. If you want to make what the land is worth, look around your sim for land that looks like yours. There is an option under view that says land owners, if you click this, the land NOT for sale will be highlighted in red. Most land for sale will be highlighted in orange. If you click on the map, there is also a tab called land for sale that can let you see what land near you is for sale. Set the price to the same price as the NON-first land you think is similar to yours. Then lower the price in small increments over the next few days if the land isn't selling as fast as you like.

Hope that helps if you are new, and have no clue.

I THINK that when they were rezing their scam cubes on unclaimed first land it was considered "bad". Last I checked they'd adjusted their scheme so they now buy one first land, set it for sale for L$10,240 and set their scam cubes on that for the rest of the sim to find. Last I checked this adjustment seemed to make it ok.

I'm not sure if I disagree with that either. If someone is stupid enough to click a sign on land for sale for L$10,240 that's offering to buy the same amount of land from you in the same place for L$1,024, and actually takes that deal, then they probably have it coming.

The problem with this is that those ugly black and yellow spinning cubes sit in the sim as an eyesore apparently forever. Nobody with any sense would pay $10,024 for 512m or even 1024m in a PG sim like I live in, but there's been one of those things hanging there almost since I've been in the world.

The practice of scamming newbies, as described the the original poster, is certainly not illegal. Not any more than selling a $3 piece of plastic on TV for $19.95 + S&H.

However, it most certainly is unethical.

I've only been in SL for about six weeks, but in that time I've noted that it contains a representative cross section of our society. Not purely representative, as I'm sure the lower class is not represented substantially.

However, from a good vs. bad, ethical vs. non-ethical perspective, there's bound to be people here that prey on others and take advantage of the innocent. Perhaps, in some cases, even more so since they can hide behind the anonymity of their virtual toon.

Since it's not illegal, I don't expect LL to do anything about it. In reality, I don't really believe they should.

However, there's nothing stopping us from doing a little bit of self-regulating in whatever manner is permissible to us within the constraints of the SL system.

Perhaps the creation of a "Wall of Shame" is in order. This could be setup as a centralized list and then broadcast to various repeaters setup and hosted in high traffic areas. Kind of like some of the centralized advertising systems some businesses provide.

Along with the list of names, a vendor type prim could be established listing the culprits horrendous act along with a picture, if applicable, of their newbie bait. (i.e. one of the spinning cubes offering to buy land at $2/M)

Thanks for your follow-up Shaun. From this thread, it seems this practice is common, and Linden is aware of it. Since we have not received a clear answer, it would be reasonable to assume it is allowed... probably unethical but allowed.

You have hit the nail on the head, as land sale prices are decided by residents and not LL.

This is a good example of what NOT to do, and by extension what is "wrong" with SL "justice" in my opinion. Although the scammer has the right to perpetrate their scam while being almost totally immune to any negative concequences, if YOU actively fight back in this manner, you will discover that YOU are in the wrong. In fact, YOU will likely be banned when the scammer files an abuse report against YOU for spreading nasty rumors about them.

Essentially, the scammer will be protected and sheltered by the system, while those who try to expose the scammer and protect unknowing victims from being taken in will be shunned by the system. I'd be tempted to call what we have for "law" and "justice" total anarchy, but as you can see there is actually an established system which works FOR the scammers by shrouding them in a veil of secrecy. When I origionally started this thread, I couldn't even tell you who I was talking about. I had to send you to the OBJECT to look at yourself.

Vigilante Justice! Lets pelt them with scripted tomatoes!

Make sure you're in a combat sim!