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The Cure: A New Economic Model |
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mcgeeb Gupte
Jolie Femme @}-,-'-,---
Join date: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,152
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08-25-2006 13:06
All I can say is Wow, 285:1.
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Svar Beckersted
Registered User
Join date: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 783
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08-25-2006 13:13
All I can say is Wow, 285:1. And it is only Friday. The last time this happened the low for the weekend was actually Monday after a 29 L$ correction. That was from L$325/1 down to L$296/1. |
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Jon Rolland
Registered User
Join date: 3 Oct 2005
Posts: 705
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08-25-2006 13:30
Ok, I admit, right up front, I am NOT an economist. That said, I do not understand this so called inflation problem or situation, but one thing is blatently obvious to me regarding the Linden $, and real life $, that IS inflationary. If, I as a player wish to buy $L5,000, and I get 300 lindens for each dollar, my credit card is charged $16.67. If, I as a player wish to buy $L5,000, and I get 290 lindens for each dollar, my credit card is charged $17.24 Inflation is measured in the local currency. If starts costing more local currency(L$) to buy goods that local currency is inflating. If it costs less local currency that currency is deflating. You are looking at the exchange rate as a tourist and seeing that as the local currency in the country you wish to visit(L$/SL) strengthens against your local currency in your country(USD/USA) it costs you more to tour SL. You are right that as the local currency strengthens it "can" impact the spending habits of tourists. But that is not inflation. I, as a player, find that playing SL, is inflationary, as the Linden rate drops, which is what it seems all you posters want. I am unclear how a lower linden, is ANTI-inflationary, except for all you speculators, trying to rip off the average player's credit cards!!! The local economy in SL requires massive amounts of imported time and talent which people want paid for in their local currency.(mine is USD) To over simplify the SL economy If you want a boot and I make it. Making that boot costs imported time. Lets say I want $0.965USD for the time I spent making that boot. If the linden is at $300 I have to charge $300L for the boot. If the Linden moves to $310 I have to charge $310L for the boot. When the price of the boot moves from $300L to $310L that is inflation. If the Linden moves to $290 I only have to charge to $290L. If the price of the boot moves from $300L to $290L that is deflation. As the linden weakens against the USD(goes from 300/310) those of us inputting our time and effort into the economy and looking for compensation in our local currency either have to accept less for our efforts or raise our prices(inflation). As the Linden strengthens against the USD we get more for our efforts without changing our prices. Or can lower our prices(deflation). Keep in mind about a year ago the Linden was running 250-270. So now, in order to generate enough income from sales or rentals to pay my tiers, I have to charge MORE for my goods or land in SL to pay in RL dollars. Again, this is INflationary to the user/player. The whole argument of making the Linden dollar fall more and more, only creates INflation in SL, defeating every argument you exploiters appear to be providing. This is simply incorrect or you are being lied to and scammed by your landlord. Tier has a cost that is fixed in USD. If you are paying tier directly to LL if your tier is $15/mo the L moving from $300->$290 changes the amount of L$'s you need to earn to pay tier from $4664L to $4508. So you either have an extra $156L profit in your pocket or you can LOWER your prices by that much. The same example roughly applies if you are paying a rental fee to a landlord that is paid in L and converts to a fixed USD value. If you are paying a fixed in L$ rental fee to a landlord then the USD cost of the rental is going up. But it doesn't increase the L$'s it takes to pay your rent. And if your profiting your profit is worth more in USD also so you make more or can LOWER your prices. The only way you would have to raise your prices to cover tier as the L$ strengthens is if you have a rent paid in L$ that is supposedly pegged to a USD value but your landlord is scamming you and raising that cost when he should be lowering it. So, why not just peg the Linden at $300/dollar, and be done with all of the exploit being commited by the Linden seller speculators, and let users play the damn game, at a fixed price? Then every player of Second Life knows what to charge for goods, to achieve the income to pay for their tiers. Take the Linden dollar exploit OUT of the game, and let the players... play, and the Linden speculators, go play in the real stock market. Because it is neither neccesary nor smart to attempt to manipulate the economy to such an extent. |
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Metaforest Cheetah
Registered User
Join date: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 82
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08-25-2006 13:56
Ok, I admit, right up front, I am NOT an economist. That said, I do not understand this so called inflation problem or situation, but one thing is blatently obvious to me regarding the Linden $, and real life $, that IS inflationary. If, I as a player wish to buy $L5,000, and I get 300 lindens for each dollar, my credit card is charged $16.67. If, I as a player wish to buy $L5,000, and I get 290 lindens for each dollar, my credit card is charged $17.24 I, as a player, find that playing SL, is inflationary, as the Linden rate drops, which is what it seems all you posters want. I am unclear how a lower linden, is ANTI-inflationary, except for all you speculators, trying to rip off the average player's credit cards!!! So now, in order to generate enough income from sales or rentals to pay my tiers, I have to charge MORE for my goods or land in SL to pay in RL dollars. Again, this is INflationary to the user/player. The whole argument of making the Linden dollar fall more and more, only creates INflation in SL, defeating every argument you exploiters appear to be providing. So, why not just peg the Linden at $300/dollar, and be done with all of the exploit being commited by the Linden seller speculators, and let users play the damn game, at a fixed price? Then every player of Second Life knows what to charge for goods, to achieve the income to pay for their tiers. Take the Linden dollar exploit OUT of the game, and let the players... play, and the Linden speculators, go play in the real stock market. Remember..... the MORE it costs to play SL (in RL dollars) .... the fewer the number of paying customers.. or buying customers. Pegging the linden would be no fun!!! Then there would be no speculation, and we wouldn't have this fun little experiental currency market sandbox to play in.... Obviously there are some Avi's around here holding some large piles of Lindens and want to see the L$ rise on the doller a bit more before they take some profit.... The noise here on the forum is commonly referred to as "Pump & dump" According to the SEC it's an illegal practice, but since this is a "toy" currency the SEC rules do not apply... So these amatures are trying to dare eachother into a sell-off knowing that if they can get enough people to go for it, the L$ will take a dive against the USD$, and then they can sink some money back into the linden again for another round... Tier limits, and the small economy make it possible for a rally that might only need a few hundred participants to turn the L$ around.... Catch is that if they provoke a stampede the value will drop too fast, and the "circuit-breaker" will kick in, and a lot of playas will lose their ass because they waited too long to jump on the sell, or they got in too late to make any money and want the L$ to rise in value a bit more before the sell... Kinda reminds me of watchin a group of teens daring each other to jump off the local cliffs into the lake. "If you go I'll go!!" None of them had the yables to do it... Personally I find all this chatter very amusing.... But it's better to let the ticker and the other economic data tell the story... =B-) |
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Jon Rolland
Registered User
Join date: 3 Oct 2005
Posts: 705
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08-25-2006 14:09
Catch is that if they provoke a stampede the value will drop too fast, and the "circuit-breaker" will kick in, and a lot of playas will lose their ass because they waited too long to jump on the sell, or they got in too late to make any money and want the L$ to rise in value a bit more before the sell... Can you imagine the price on SLEX if the circuit breaker kicked in and locked down Lindex on a wkend? lol |
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mcgeeb Gupte
Jolie Femme @}-,-'-,---
Join date: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,152
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08-25-2006 14:13
Pegging the linden would be no fun!!! Then there would be no speculation, and we wouldn't have this fun little experiental currency market sandbox to play in.... Obviously there are some Avi's around here holding some large piles of Lindens and want to see the L$ rise on the doller a bit more before they take some profit.... The noise here on the forum is commonly referred to as "Pump & dump" According to the SEC it's an illegal practice, but since this is a "toy" currency the SEC rules do not apply... So these amatures are trying to dare eachother into a sell-off knowing that if they can get enough people to go for it, the L$ will take a dive against the USD$, and then they can sink some money back into the linden again for another round... Tier limits, and the small economy make it possible for a rally that might only need a few hundred participants to turn the L$ around.... Catch is that if they provoke a stampede the value will drop too fast, and the "circuit-breaker" will kick in, and a lot of playas will lose their ass because they waited too long to jump on the sell, or they got in too late to make any money and want the L$ to rise in value a bit more before the sell... Kinda reminds me of watchin a group of teens daring each other to jump off the local cliffs into the lake. "If you go I'll go!!" None of them had the yables to do it... Personally I find all this chatter very amusing.... But it's better to let the ticker and the other economic data tell the story... =B-) Are you serious? |
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Metaforest Cheetah
Registered User
Join date: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 82
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08-25-2006 19:19
Are you serious? It's a mixed bag... Which part(s) are you referring to? =B-)  |
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Jon Rolland
Registered User
Join date: 3 Oct 2005
Posts: 705
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08-25-2006 21:57
Right here: https://secondlife.com/currency/market.php Stuck in a trading range at L$300 for weeks.. Hit me up when you see it rally to L$290.. I'll call the farm and tell them release the Pigs to begin flying.. I hope you bought alot of flying pigs lol Daily Summary Last Close Date 2006-08-24 Best buying rate: L$280 / US$1.00 Best selling rate: L$296 / US$1.00 Last trade: L$280 / US$1.00 Last close: L$291 / US$1.00 Change: -L$11 / US$1.00 Today's volume: L$15,095,339 Today's open: L$291 / US$1.00 Today's high: L$303 / US$1.00 Today's low: L$280 / US$1.00 Today's average: L$288.7149 / US$1.00 |
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mcgeeb Gupte
Jolie Femme @}-,-'-,---
Join date: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,152
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08-25-2006 22:44
He who does not want to be named right now is in hiding waiting to jump out when the next fall begins. I've never seen a person be so wrong and then still try to come out and say he was right still.
I wonder how this is going to effect the economy? I hope it doesn't cut into sales too much. I hope it all evens out as the same dollar value. I wonder how many are holding back waiting to see at what point it stops gaining strength at. There is no rate over 1 million Lindens. Usually there is somewhere. I think this is difficult to predict now. |
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CJ Carnot
Registered User
Join date: 23 Oct 2005
Posts: 433
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08-25-2006 23:58
There is no rate over 1 million Lindens. Usually there is somewhere. I think this is difficult to predict now. Wow. Is Anshe on holiday or something ? |
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Metaforest Cheetah
Registered User
Join date: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 82
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08-26-2006 01:30
He who does not want to be named right now is in hiding waiting to jump out when the next fall begins. I've never seen a person be so wrong and then still try to come out and say he was right still. I wonder how this is going to effect the economy? I hope it doesn't cut into sales too much. I hope it all evens out as the same dollar value. I wonder how many are holding back waiting to see at what point it stops gaining strength at. There is no rate over 1 million Lindens. Usually there is somewhere. I think this is difficult to predict now. If the large influx nOObs are trading $USD for $L then they are the likely cause of the rise in value... When the value rises enough experienced large holders of $L are going to start dumping L$ to take profit... this is a basic rule. I say this because the $L is the only officially trackable "Stock" on the market. The big gamble now is when the first big block is going to get dumped.... When I signed on the $L was at 324. It's gained 11% in less than two weeks.... Where is the sell off will it make it to 13.5% (clearing 10% for the seller) or is there more discipline in the school of "big fish?" Someone, or a group of entities, are going to get hungry and stall this, but the question is when? I have not been here long enough to know what to expect, but it will be interesting to see what happens....  =B-) |
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mcgeeb Gupte
Jolie Femme @}-,-'-,---
Join date: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,152
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08-26-2006 01:39
The big gamble now is when the first big block is going to get dumped.... Someone is going to get hungry and stall this, but the question is when? I have not been here long enough to know what to expect, but it will be interesting to see what happens.... =B-) I know when  It's possible they may be thinking if they wait a little longer, they'll make more dollars. Yet if they don't they may lose out when it goes back up?? |
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Eloise Pasteur
Curious Individual
Join date: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,952
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08-26-2006 01:57
When? Sunday evening probably.
I wonder how RDB is doing licking his wounds? _____________________
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Metaforest Cheetah
Registered User
Join date: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 82
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08-26-2006 02:02
I know when It's possible they may be thinking if they wait a little longer, they'll make more dollars. Yet if they don't they may lose out when it goes back up?? No shit.... And yes the ones who wait too long will get poor returns, or get cut off if trading is halted. It's a big game of "chicken" right now... There is one other obvious factor... the market may stall on it's own before anyone sees their trigger.... If the purchase of $L evens out or stalls due to other factors, then the "big fish" may not bite at all. =B-) |
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Metaforest Cheetah
Registered User
Join date: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 82
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08-26-2006 02:07
When? Sunday evening probably. I wonder how RDB is doing licking his wounds? Oh him? I think he knows how to play this..... My read on him is that he's not an idiot.... he's an a****le.... =B-) edit: Question for the experiened: Are there any published stats on how many new users with billing info have signed up over any useful (recent) interval of time? |
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Zulqadi Saarinen
Registered User
Join date: 30 Jan 2006
Posts: 47
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08-26-2006 02:26
No offense, but if these guys were really professional traders, they wouldnt have sold their skill for so little returns as L$ can give. In my opinion they are just a bunch of wanna be's.
Quite a few weeks back I predicted a sharp rally in L$ valuation, you can access my old posts, and that was because I could see the technical formations in the chart, and these guys were shouting Bear, and everybody seemed convinced by them. Those who really have skills at trading stocks, they do respect themselves and their skills, and don't shout in forums like these guys do... thats more like a con job and not trading. I wonder why people listen to them: they are so obvious! _____________________
THE CONCEPTS
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Zonax Delorean
Registered User
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 767
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08-26-2006 02:39
It's now around L$ 280/USD!
"Dear Zonax, Thank you for using LindeX. Your sell order #210XXX for L$XX00 at L$280/US$1.00 has been filled for a net income of US$XX.XX." In a way, I AM beginning to get worried.. maybe Lindens should/will intervene by selling L$'s? If I remember right, this is a possibility since a month or two. |
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Jon Rolland
Registered User
Join date: 3 Oct 2005
Posts: 705
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08-26-2006 02:50
It's now around L$ 280/USD! "Dear Zonax, Thank you for using LindeX. Your sell order #210XXX for L$XX00 at L$280/US$1.00 has been filled for a net income of US$XX.XX." In a way, I AM beginning to get worried.. maybe Lindens should/will intervene by selling L$'s? If I remember right, this is a possibility since a month or two. Why are you worried? The L was worth more than this a year ago. |
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mcgeeb Gupte
Jolie Femme @}-,-'-,---
Join date: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,152
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08-26-2006 03:08
When? Sunday evening probably. Shhhhh! Don't tell everyone the big secret  |
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Eloise Pasteur
Curious Individual
Join date: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,952
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08-26-2006 05:54
I wonder why people listen to them: they are so obvious! Most of us listen to them just enough to point the fallacies in their arguments, their atrocious track record etc. just in case they catch some poor unsuspecting newcomer who actually thinks they know what they're talking about. _____________________
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Pie Psaltery
runs w/scissors
Join date: 13 Jan 2004
Posts: 987
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08-26-2006 07:24
Shoot, I thought this was a post about the band The Cure coming to Second Life. I was looking forward to seeing an AV of Robert Smith. Darn. ME TOO!!! But I stayed for the sheer comedic value of the economy forum. Gosh I'm gonna miss it. _____________________
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Lee Dimsum
Registered User
Join date: 22 Feb 2006
Posts: 118
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08-26-2006 07:29
About RBD credibility..he is one of those "no payment/billing info" users
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Zonax Delorean
Registered User
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 767
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08-26-2006 07:41
He who does not want to be named right now is in hiding waiting to jump out when the next fall begins. I've never seen a person be so wrong and then still try to come out and say he was right still. Oh, I only wish I never saw a person like RBD. Sadly, our local politicians are all like him, NEVER, EVER admitting anything, not claiming responsibility for anything, etc. Too bad we can't mute them like we can mute ppl on the forums |
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eltee Statosky
Luskie
Join date: 23 Sep 2003
Posts: 1,258
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08-26-2006 08:10
About RBD credibility..he is one of those "no payment/billing info" users its an alt of a big time currency trader used to manipulate people into nudging the lindex up/down but since the newer forum rules there hasn't been much point _____________________
wash, rinse, repeat
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Keiki Lemieux
I make HUDDLES
Join date: 8 Jul 2005
Posts: 1,490
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08-26-2006 08:44
No offense, but if these guys were really professional traders, they wouldnt have sold their skill for so little returns as L$ can give. In my opinion they are just a bunch of wanna be's. Quite a few weeks back I predicted a sharp rally in L$ valuation, you can access my old posts, and that was because I could see the technical formations in the chart, and these guys were shouting Bear, and everybody seemed convinced by them. Those who really have skills at trading stocks, they do respect themselves and their skills, and don't shout in forums like these guys do... thats more like a con job and not trading. I wonder why people listen to them: they are so obvious! (my bold) I don't think that many people ever took RBD that seriously. _____________________
imakehuddles.com/wordpress/
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