Prevent new accounts from running scripts for 30 days.

Prevent new accounts from running scripts for 30 days.

why?

I guess it's because they don't like running scripts

Why do these inane suggestions repeat every three days? Do newbs not ever check to see if this has been posted before?

How about we prevent people from posting in the forums for the first 30 days instead?

If a topic has been posted before then obviously that topic is popular, if you have seen such a topic before why are you trying to denigrate the topic, when obviously a *lot* of people think it's a good idea?

Guess I didnt see the 'ban newbs from using scripts' proposal from three days ago. lol
So I will put in my two cents.
If a newbie cant use a script, how are they going to experience all the kool script related objects and activities in SL? Are you saying dont let them use scripts just in case they want to fire up a push cannon and wreak havoc over at your house? What about the thousands of newbies who dont want to be griefers? Newbies who just want to do what everybody else does and have fun? Screw them out of the SL experience for their first month, just to keep a handful of dorks from running around acting foolish? NAYYYYY! You dont want to punish the majority in some feeble attempt at slowing down the minority griefer community. And if the newbs dont get all the toys, how are they gonna know if SL is right for them?

I may be exaggerating because of my irritation over the many faces of the "don't let newbies do this or that" meme, though it *is* a frequent topic.

Overall I agree with you, and want to put in a more constructive two cents: My initial interest in Second Life is entirely due to the fact that I could script. In fact I found out about Second Life from a Google Tech Talk video that describe that very thing, and *that* is what got me to try it out.

If I'd had to wait 30 days to do any scripting or building, I would not have been motivated to join. I am not here for sex or gambling or 3D chat, I am here to have fun in a 3D world where I can make some stuff and use stuff I made to have fun.

Okay, I'm just one person, but with the rapid growth of Second Life there will be a corresponding (though admittedly small percentage) increase in newer users like me: Those who want to make stuff. And like me, they will bring in many others, and evangelize this great platform. They will tell others what fun it is to develop new stuff, and try new ideas.

Second Life is the closest thing to "casual game development" available. I don't mean that in the sense that you are making "casual games" as the gaming industry buzzword implies, but more that you can casually make games because all of the tools are already here for you. The rendering engine is complete, the physics engine works (depending on your needs), the asset tracking system is there, and the scripting engine is as close to solid as in any other commercial game.

Wanna try out some ideas for a post-apocolyptic shooter? Easy enough to do. What about a platformer? Heh, more easily done here than on your desktop. How about my personal interest, melee combat with katana and other asian weapons? I have made a full combat system here in Second Life that would have taken 10x longer to build from the ground up, and it's JUST ONE of the things I could do here in Second Life. And I tell every professional developer I know the same thing: It's great here.

And if I had not been able to script in my first 30 days, just by virtue of the fact that people hate griefers and newbies, I would absolutely not have stayed in Second Life.

[Edited to add] Not only can you quickly prototype the general outline and look and feel of a game here in Second Life, you can make minigames specifically *for* SL, and have a ready user base willing and ready to playtest it for you. Focus groups? Got 'em. Need Testers? One combat system (C:SI) has over 4,600 active users already. You just can't get that anywhere else that I am aware of.

Locking people out of doing something productive just because some jackass out there gets his hand on a freebie watermelon gun and has no consideration for others is more harmful to Second Life than anything else.

why?

A correction my earlier post, seems there's a disconnect between the forum join date and SL join date, so Whispering Hush isn't a newbie.

Anyways, on with the show!

Just because a topic has been posted repeatedly does not mean that a lot of people think it's a good idea, just that a lot of people don't read what's previously posted or don't search.
I mod various forums with combined membership over 100,000, and I've seen hundreds of threads posted repeatedly despite the original one being shot down by at least 90% of respondents.
The most common cause of repeated posting of one topic is trolling and flaming. Somebody either looking to get a reaction or make a counter flame to something that was said in the previous version of the same topic which is locked.

As Colette has asked twice though, Why?
If you think it's a good idea, why not fill the rest of us in on the reasons?

Personally I agree with RobbyRacoon, coding and scripting is what I do, it's the first thing I tried in SL and if newbies didn't have access I wouldn't have stuck around.

If the suggestion was to stop scripting newbies killing the sims with lag, it'd be unenforceble but I'd be all for it

If you're doing this to try to counteract griefers, there's nothing to stop griefers from signing up with alts, aging these alts to the required time limit, and then using them to grief. Since there is nothing preventing a griefer from having many, many free alts (as far as I know), they could easily cycle them, age this one for 30 days, after 15 days, start another one aging, and you'd have a new grief-ready account every 15 days. They could even write software to manage their alt herd, telling them when this one or that one was 'ready to go'.

The only people this would inconvenience are newbies, especially newbies who want to wear something different (like furries or robots), which often use scripts for basic functionality, such as eye-blinking. As a couple of folks have already said, one of the things that draws a lot of people is the ability to design and create objects. Also, as a newbie, I would be damn pissed off if I bought a gadget and I then couldn't use it because of some arbitrary time limit.

Yeah, I admit that I worded my response too strongly and overly negatively, but that's because I have such strong feelings about it.

I doubt any kind of statistically significant poll has ever been done, so while a *lot* of people may think it's a good idea, I have serious doubts that it constitutes anywhere near a majority.

And had you searched for one of the many previous threads on this issue (and similar), you would have known that it has been discussed to death.

It doesn't have to constitute a majority, LL has already indicated they're willing to restrict the use of scripting in the past if there's a compelling need for it.

That was after the two weeks of frequent grey goo grid attacks.

If I hadn't been able to script the day I set foot in SL, I would quickly have lost interest. It took quite a long while before I actually paid into LL, but I started contributing in a positive way to the community well before that. At the risk of sounding conceited, with a draconian policy like this, the SL comminuty would lose out on the talent of people like me.

There's also the fact that this is laughably easy to get around, and won't have any useful impact on griefers. If I'm a dedicated griefer, I'll just have a little herd of alts waiting until their 30th day in-world before I use them. They would "age" their alts, like a fine wine :P The only person this policy would hurt would be the kind of person who would never grief.

Exactly. And Second Life would be much less interesting place if actual contributors like Lex Neva left because they couldn't do anything interesting.

Ever been to Suffugium? It's on my top 10 favorite places in SL.

In fact, I'd be willing to bet that the other 9 places in the top 10 were made by people whose primary reason to get into SL was to do something productive, and would not have stuck around if they were limited to chatting during that first 30 days.

If the original poster cant even explain why he/she made this suggestion then this thread seems to have zero merit.


Once you start making your policies to hurt new residents becuase your afraid of greifers - Then youve lost.


Ive been in Second Life over 2 years. Ive been greifed probably 2 dozen times in one form or another (not counting grid attacks). None of those was enough for me to think we need to hamper new residents in order to be "safe"

The worst problem was people able to bring down the grid and LL has vastly improved our defence against that.

So I see no need for this at all.

As the others, I see no use for this at all.

I am not a scripter or a builder.

But even then, without scripts the first days here may have turned into boreness...

And remember, the new people of now may be the master scripters, builders, designers of tomorrow.

Morwen.

QFT

Stopping a new resident from doing this or that or the other thing is ridiculous.

This is obviosly a responce to greifers. Painting all new players with the greifer brush will do nothing but alienate all new residents from the game. How the hell would YOU have felt when YOU entered SL for the first time and YOU weren't allowed to do ANYTHING?

"Oh ya SL is great, but you can't script, you attach anything, you buy anything, etc etc for 30 days...."

Silly, just plain silly. These 'Don't let new players do X for 30 day' threads have got to stop.

Ok, i started the thread so i guess i can add my reasons.

First, an obvious analogy. When you enter RL, there are many things you cannot do. (besides the obvious biologic bodily controls), i would draw your attention to driving a car and holding a license to do so.

A car in the hands of an immature driver is a weapon. It does not matter that the intent of the untrained driver be not to cause harm, an out of control car will kill both the driver, and innocent victims.

It's no secret also that maturity is also important. Most societies refuse to let children below the age of 15 hold a license to drive a car because they lack the judgment to respond well under pressure.

Further, if one is charged with a serious driving offense, say DUI, or DD (dangerous driving), ones license to drive is immediately suspended for 24 hours. At least in this country it is.

To bring the analogy into SL, we can substitute the ability to hold a license with the ability to have full control over an avatar, and full use of sim resources and scripting.

Limiting the ability of new users to be able to run scripts actually adds value to that ability. It gives a user a reason to stick around and look at what can be done.

If a user decides that they *really* want to contribute to the community and benefit from what the community has given to SL, then they should buy an account, and enjoy the full user experience.

One could successfully argue that the act of paying for an account displays more maturity than not, and such a person has grasp of the fact that by doing so, they are becoming part of a community with a set of standards to be upheld.

There is of course also a boon to the regular community members who have been the victims of grief attacks.

I am not saying that a determined griefer would be stopped, far from it. There will always be sociopaths attracted to SL who will find a way to circumvent any and all restrictions put in place to slow them down.

What I am saying is that by adding value to the ability to run scripts, fewer people will want to risk losing that ability, and of those who do, signing up for a throw away account immediately after being banned will cease to be such an issue.

I hope that my reply invites further discussion.

Got a car to finish scripting now byeee

Whisper.

Thank you.



All users of Second Life are already Adults. The avatar is not a seperate entitiy,the only person involved in this mess is the account holder. Who is assumed to have acceptable maturity.



Very few scripts have the capability to do any lasting damage. None have the ability to kill another Account Holder.



Since the danger is far lower in SL I dont see this analogy applying. It does sound like your country lets people off pretty light for driving offenses such as you describe.

You havent brought the proposal to deny scripts to people who have misused scripts you have proposed it based on their account age. Disabling scripts for greifers who have been cuaght is a much better idea than your proposal.



I dont see this - People use SL far more often when new than later. Many will definitely lose interest if they are second class citizens during this time.



Perhaps One could, but you sure havent.

Your proposal has said nothing about allowing premiums to use scripts before the 30 days were up.

I wouldnt agree to that either but it would be a bit better than your original idea.



boon meaning youd reduce the number of greifers becuase they are usually under 30 days old, I expect. This is a Guilty before proven innocent approach. And therefore a bad idea.



Again you never proposed using removing script running capability for offenses - therefore I dont see where losing the ability comes in as an incentive to play nice.

I also dont like the idea of "Adding value" to using scripts by reducing the access to them when they have unlimited access now.

Thats like living somewhere where you can buy whatever food you like then the govenment coming in and rationing the food then giving you coupons for "treat" items, then claiming those treats have added value.

Ah the forum troll.

Well, admitting your purpose here is rather refreshing. Kudos for honesty.

*Is in agreement with Colette Meiji*

I think the OP is Death Guy's Alt......

*growls making troll noises*

Trolls have mean faces I think.