Transcript of Metaverse Justice Watch Meeting Sept. 1, 2005

In an effort to make sure everything is on the up-n-up with the MJW:

Transcript of Metaverse Justice Watch Meeting Sept. 1, 2005

EDIT: Oh hell. My apologies to everyone. I looked, but somehow managed to miss Lordfly's thread on the exact same thing.

Apparently I missed all the hubbub, what with relaying information about Katrina and all, keeping people up do date on things.

So, this Metaverse Justice Watch, do they have costumes? Cool Superhero names? Like Annihilator Anshe, Maniac Merwin, Secret Leader Prokofy?

Can I be Badass Burke? I have cool gadgets, and with some time I could make a really nifty custome.

Aint it funny how 'equality' pops up in the definition of justice?

DAMN THOSE PESKY WORDS AND THIER PEDANTIC MEANINGS!!! DAMN THEM TO HEEEEEEEeeeeeeell.


With liberty and justice for all.......except those content creators and tourists/players!


Made me laugh, thankya Jillian

So now we can circumvent forum rules by holding a meeting in SL and having someone else post it?

Haven't they always been able to? Besides, look where its posted and by who.. what they gonna do.... BAN them?

Heh. Good point.

I'm going to start a counter-initiative. I'll speak more on it later.
People can IM me in-world if they want to fight the MJW.
Have your Supervillain names ready.

This kinda makes me think Hall of Justice... You know the super friends cartoon thing....

My question is which one is the little blue space monkey?

http://www.funny-spot.com/html/Maitress-Vs-Superfriends.html

Here they are in all their glory!

Behold the power of.....

THE FELTCHMEISTER!

I joined this group because I think it makes sense for like-minded and similarly situated people to form groups to share ideas and lobby for their interests. I was a little put off by the self righteousness of "the notecard", but I joined anyway because I like the premise.

I am appalled at the reaction to this group from the peanut gallery. I am even more appalled at the reaction to the peanut gallery from the leaders of the group.

To the peanut gallery: Have you people been living under rocks? Hasn't anyone heard of the right of free association? And the right to assemble? What do these things mean? Any clue, folks, why are they important? (hint: authoritarianism and mob rule are BOTH bad. Think logically about how a population would defend itself from such eventualities.)

I never attended any meetings, because I only log in once a day and I need more notice. In any event, I have left the group because it has become devisive and counterproductive. ("has become?" perhaps it was inevitable.)

I seriously doubt this group will be effective. Too much petty bullshit and no focus. I just don't want to spend time sifting through it all with no prospect to actually make a difference. In fact by failing to claim any kind of moral high ground, the group may do more harm than good. Count me out.

Buster

While I agree with the bulk of what you have said, no one is questioning the fact that they have a right to free assembly. I have not seen one person state anything like that.

What people seem to be upset about is the fact that the founders of said group have an incredibly overinflated sense of self value. So much so that they feel it's legitimate to break people into classes based upon how much they spend on SL and exclude "content creators" unless they pass some sort of pre-qualification (subscribe to their idea of what the rules should be) screening, and then lobby from that angle. When folks like that grab LL by the ear and deem it proper to try and create and/or amend the rules based upon their own admitted special interests, the "peanut gallery" as you so eloquently put it, has every right to speak out, as these special interest driven changes would affect them and the rest of SL.

Footnote: It's sort of dismissive to label the people who are upset because of this situation as the "peanut gallery". You just further this notion that certain people's opinions are less important than others when you refer to them in this marginalizing fashion. In addition, because we saw so many people who don't regularly post here react with their own disgust today, you simply can't hang the reaction to this on some perceived "peanut gallery" of forum regulars.

The peanut gallery is the bulk of the very people who care about SL for the very same reasons the group MJW was started.

To be told "well, join the group and discuss or don't if you don't care" then "if you don't like it leave" once in the meetings, shows the inherent failure of the mode of operation chosen. It's obvious that it's not open. Someone among the founders of this group has apparently found a very effective way of putting one self at the top of the hill, in a position of telling dissenters to go away while denying their opinion (as posted in the forums here) any relelvance since it's not using the chosen mode of operation for dialogue (join the group or don't).

I hope my point is understandable :/

Self-righteousness is usually the first indication that something is conflicted between the stated objective and the actual one(s).



It is natural for people to resent those who attempt to use 'the greater good' as a shield for their own, highly personal and generally selfish ends.

That the leaders responded as they did would be the second indication that something is conflicted between the stated objective and the actual one(s).



Have YOU been living under a rock? If Michael Jackson showed up on your doorstep and wanted to babysit, would you welcome him into the house?

Freedom of association and the right to assemble are not even on the table here. Don't confuse the reaction and indignation against this group presuming upon the rest of the game's population as such. It isn't.



For many, this revelation may be classified as 'forgone conclusion' -- primarily because the history of those 'leading' is well known and validated as being about anything EXCEPT 'the greater good'.

Sometimes people really are what everything thinks they are... this simply proves it for those in question.

By the "peanut gallery", I did not mean "everyone who commented". I didn't even mean "all forum regulars". I meant the opinionated forum regulars (i.e., the OFR).

I think that much of the dismay was aimed at the concept of the group and the identity of the "leaders". I take issue with some of that. I think people should be expected to form invitation-only groups for like-minded similarly situated people. If people disrupt your meetings with constant arguing, then kick them out. A group needs to be able to formulate a position amongst itself and THEN, after debating the issues internally, only THEN compete with opposing viewpoints in the open marketplace of ideas. If every RL meeting of every group was always an argument with the opposition, then modern society itself would not be possible. What if the Republicans and Democrats always had to allow the opposition into every planning meeting they ever have. How could you even have Republicans and Democrats then?

Separate form that, however, this group has too much grandstanding and self rightious pontificating swirling around it. To the extent that people dislike that, I concur. Many people feel that such a group would be evil even without that element. I disagree with that part.

Buster

Actually, I do have a costume! One of the members sent me this Blue Armor suit! (In sincerity, by the way.) I lurve it!

coco

This business about no notice for meetings is over.

And any business about being devisive and counterproductive is coming to an end, too.

I agree with you - to hell with petty bullshit and no focus. I have limited time, too.

coco

I don't think Prok is responsible for Jillian or Lordfly posting the transcript.

coco

Which, by the way, I have yet to read.

WAY to go OFFICER of the group! I'm so glad to see you spend so much time defending the group on the forums without knowing what's been actually said in world! You are to be commended for your service to this group as an officer! I am glad that people like you are the ones taking an interest in these changes and available in-world for the meetings and group discussions!

Only an idiot would do that. Are you suggesting I might be an idiot?

I fail utterly to see any connection. I have no idea what you mean.

Buster

Like I said, Lynn, this business about meetings with not enough notice is over.

coco

Alt + Left Arrow = ?

Oh, you misread my post.

I was commending you on your zeal for this group without attending one meeting or knowing what the hell was going on.

(Just got back from taking a kid to school.)

I didn't spend yesterday on the forums "defending the group" or any individuals in it so much as I spent yesterday talking about the agenda of the group, which reflects ideals of justice and equal opportunity for all.

Not only that, half the people on these forums - or more - consider many of those ideas themselves to be good ones.

The Lindens are listening. The Lindens are always willing to listen. If you care about the points listed on the agenda (not necessarily every last one of them), then join the group, and be a part of shaping these ideas. Everyone's voice counts.

coco

But make sure you become an Officer, because they're going to have seperate meetings for Officers, and they don't feel safe discussing what makes one worthy of becoming an officer in the group channel.

Corrected