Today's Grammar Pet Peeve

Hey... everyone has to get their freak on somehow... hehe

I didn't throw any rocks did I? I started a separate thread and didn't name any names, thank you very much. ^_^ If I threw any rocks they were lobbed at poor word choices that I find annoying, not at anyone else.

One thing that really annoys me (another pet peeve!) is this attitude that you can't point out flaws in others because you're not perfect yourself. Absolutely false. (Of course it's important that you try to help others correct their mistakes, and that you aren't just trying to belittle someone or prove your superiority.)


Related to that is the idea that your opinion on a subject is not valid because you don't own a PhD in that field. Normal people can have perfectly valid opinions on art, music, literature, and movies regardless of whether they're experts on the subject. ^_^

No matter how many words I might mispell, that doesn't change the fact that I get really annoyed when someone says "web sight" instead of "web site". At the same time, I've never seen any point in spell checking a forum post. I don't care enough to bother with it, and I don't care if it annoys other people (which it apparently does!) ^_^ Mind you, in every one of the examples I posted, spell checking would not have helped in the least.

This resulted in a very entertaining thread, which I didn't really expect but which made me laugh quite a bit. ^_^

There are a few errors which really annoy me, mainly because they occur at the highest levels, like the BBC News, which, at one time used to be an exemplar of spoken English.

These particular errors tend to come about because people hear two words which sound similar, and think they mean the same - they then use the longer word because they think it makes them sound more intelligent.

An example of this is fortuitous and fortunate, which most people these days seem to think mean the same thing. In point of fact something 'fortuitous' is something that has happened purely accidentally, and can equally lead to disaster as to fortune.

Another, mistaken by no less an authority than Tony Blair is 'full' and 'fulsome'. According to the BBC, the tributes on the death of George Best had been 'fulsome'. In fact 'fulsome' means sickly-sweet. cloying and inspiring disgust.

Another one which really makes me wince is 'crescendo' and 'climax'. They do *not* mean the same thing. 'Crescendo' is an Italian musical term, and means 'growing'. In other words, increasing in volume. The climax comes at the end of the crescendo.

One that I have seen become almost universal is the mix-up between 'discrete' and 'discreet'. I suppose people think the first spelling looks cool, and don't realise it means something totally different. 'Discreet' means 'tactful' and 'discrete' means 'separate'.

These are all important I think, because every one of them means that we have lost another useful word. An argument against correct word definitions and grammatical correctness has been that the language is always in a state of change, and that pedants shouldn't concern themselves with this, because it's all right in the long run. But in every one of these cases we are losing a useful distinction, and a useful word. That is a process of impoverishment, not change.

This one hits a chord for me (LOLEX), particularly because of how one can lead into another, but they, as you pointed out, are NOT one and the same.

In techno music, I think of the "crescendo" as when the snare fills and whooshy noises start building up, and the climax is when the cymbal strikes, usually at the beginning of a multiple-of-8-bar buildup. To have one without the other, to me, is like serving tomato soup without crackers.

my grammar is crap, but misusing good / well really bothers me...

I don't mind being corrected though.

using text chat a lot tends to do wonders for destroying grammar. Oh well language always changes over time anyway so may as well roll with it

or like underwear without elastic

Excerpts, not excepts.

I couldn't resist.

One of my peeves is prey tell in place of pray tell. I find myself looking for a talking rabbit!

I probably peeve some folks with my Big Bag of Commas ™. I am not sure that I misuse them; however, I do sometimes find myself looking at what I have written and wondering.

I always liked how Stephen King uses run-on sentences and horrible mispellings in parts of his book to accentuate a feel of urgency, desperation, and gnawing fear. His italic passages in The Dark Half are particularly gripping.

ohmygod mygod the sparrows are flying thesparrowsareflyingagain!

Oh my - on cue, a talking rabbit!

But surely this is the process in which the English language was born in the first place, and is why it is referred to as the 'vacuum cleaner' of languages?

It has always been part if the growing process of our language to adopt new words, phrases and grammatical constructs from other cultures (neighbouring, invaded or invading), or from the popularisation of snippets from local dialects and colloquialisms. This is one of the reasons why British English* is considered, at least currently, to be the Lingua Franca. To attempt to control or regulate a language in order to 'preserve' its integrity is essentially to kill this process and the convenience of it - and therefore reduce its popularity.

A prime example of this is the restrictions the French government have put on the words in use within their language. The General Commission on Terminology and Neology have outlawed the use of words that are considered "foreign" to their nation - but are in use worldwide. Words such as "e-mail" in favour of the french phrase "courrier electronique" for example.**

To stop the evolution of a language is, essentially, to sign the death warrant for its global usage.

Besides, with 959376 words currently estimated to be in use within the English language (see http://www.languagemonitor.com/) I think we can probably afford to lose a few!

*as opposed to American English - which although closer to "Shakespearean English" than its modern British counterpart is now classed as an entirely separate dialect. Mainly due to differences in it's allowed sentence construction and pronunciations.

**As a side note this is particularly odd as our word "mail" is derived from the french word "male" meaning "wallet" or "bag"!

Interesting . . .

As a "pedant," I find that addressing each of these points is essential to helping students make sense of the quagmire that is language. The question, for me, has always been: where does "formal written English" end, and "slang" begin? At what point does instruction in usage/grammar/syntax/spelling become completely irrelevant? As a teacher of composition (even that word is misleading), I try to aim for the middle ground--a natural use of English to communicate complex ideas and emotions as clearly as possible. To that end, I teach sentence diagramming as a tool to help students better understand how sentences work and to offer a visual representation of the vocabulary of grammar (e.g. independent clause, dependent clause, subordinating conjunction, conjunctive adverb, etc.).

In colleges and universities in the US, there exists a beast called, "English Composition." It is a class required of almost every first-year student; however, this particular class, as it is currently being taught, is absolutely useless (I have been teaching "composition" classes for more than ten years). After all, since you left school, how many employers have asked you to write a five-paragraph expository essay, double spaced, of 750 words or fewer? That is what I thought.

I think there is a difference between slang, including the incorporation of 'dialect words', and misuse of the language. The one enriches it, the other impoverishes it.

We are living in a world of growing illiteracy. If we are not going to be all speaking Pidgin English in a few years' time, we need to make a conscious effort to preserve the distinctions of our language.

Just to add to my Pidgin English comment. I like curried beans. But if I want to buy any at my local supermarket, I have to buy a tin which says it contains, "Curry Beanz". I really think they should make that 'Him Curry Beanz' to complete the process.

My apologies Jalia. My post was meant to be funny, certainly not an attack on you. You were simply the starter of the thread so I used you as an example. I am not accusing you of naming names or anything else for that matter. I was attempting to post something humorous and somewhat true.

The throwing rocks statement was meant in general, not specific to you or anyone else. Sorry if you misunderstood or I was not clear enough.

I get irritated bout all those things too btw... smiles

LAFS... see... I really do suck at spelling. Thanks for catching that Neehai!!!

the post above just reminded me of my other pet peeve. When people use except and accept as interchangeable words, or in the wrong place.


Everyone went to the party EXCEPT Billy Joe Bob.

It is NOT, Everyone went to the party accept Billy.

Did the teacher accept your crappy report that you forgot to use grammar and spell check on?

It is NOT, Did the teacher except your crappy report that you forgot to use grammar and spell check on.


If I really could smack people through the monitor for that, I would.

I also teach composition courses and have had student feedback that composition aided them in related tasks. One of my former students now works for municipal government and routinely makes presentations that incorporate the structure and methods of her basic uni composition course. Another student told me that his completion of the grammar section (part of the 050 Provincial English requirement) helped him to absorb the structure of JAVA by helping him to envision the computer language as just another type of grammatical construction. Still another student has used the outlining and prewriting skills learned in composition to efficiently create memos and letters in her administrative position.

I have not, since completing university level algebra, applied that coursework on a continual basis, but it did change the way in which I saw the world, and that was useful. I would say that what I learned in university composition (teaching it, aside) still serves me well when I need to argue a position and therefore I include a section on logical reasoning in my composition courses.

The subskills taught in composition (prewriting, outlining, description, narration, correctly attributing causality, and researching among others) can be applied to a wide variety of tasks one must accomplish as an employee, business owner, citizen, or in private life.

Once I had an online fling with a TSO player whom I did admire, but with whom I shared too little in common to pursue a rl relationship. As shallow as this may make me sound, one of the key issues for me was his awful spelling and sentence constructions. For example, he insisted on calling me pritty lady. When I told him that I didn't think we had very much in common, he said over and over through the text conversation that he didn't want to loose me. I had a hard time not laughing (and simultaneously, not crying) at the irony there: my entire aim was to be loosed.

(Loose=untie, unbind, free from restraint; lose=allow to go out of sight, miss from one's possessions.)

These are all excellent points! It is true that compostion can and does help students to develop skills such as outlining, argumentation, research, and citation (so very important, lately); however, the teaching of grammar in English composition classrooms in the United States has been out of vogue for quite some time (I am so glad to see that it has not with you). In the process/product dichotomy, process has been greatly favored. I sense a shift in this model on the horizon. Stanley Fish, for example, wrote an interesting op-ed piece for the New York Times regarding his approach to teaching English a synopsis is included here: http://weblogs.elearning.ubc.ca/rubeli/archives/012221.html.

Perhaps we should get together in-world and talk "shop."

Sounds like fun, Euterpe; although that, in itself, is probably scary. hehe. I've become such a word nerd. IM me when you are in world if you like. I'm on much of the weekend. Cheers!

I don't like it when people write "Here, here!" instead of "Hear, hear!". I always think they've found a hidden treasure or something.

I do wish people would correct my grammar more often - I'm not a native english speaker and I don't know what I'm saying half of the time

I think you have a beautiful command of English!

I think of my experiences in Paris with spoken French--that worked wonders in terms of keeping me language humble. If I ever feel the pinch of pomposity, I recall having to ask a waiter for his pen, having to order one week's worth of passes for the Metro, or having to explain to the gendarmes how my father's wallet was stolen (robbery is *not* covered in the standard French texts).

I sense the creation of a Scrabble game into SL very soon

Please diagram me out of my inverted thinking so I can stop making inverted sentences (you know what I'm talking about, so I don't need an example-- oops). Thanks.