Worst Star Trek Plot Device
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Joy Honey
Not just another dumass
Join date: 17 Jun 2005
Posts: 3,751
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01-12-2006 07:45
OK I didn't see this mentioned anywhere at all: If the ship was damaged in any way and in "peril" it would take Geordi at least 6 hours to fix the problem. If the warp engines went offline or some such, and the ship were not in any danger - 1 or 2 hours is all you would hear from Geordi. Something like this: "Captain, we can't go anywhere, our engines are so totally fried. There are Romulans in the area and we have pissed them off somehow and they're gonna shoot us? It's going to take me at least 10 hours to fix those engines!" OR "Captain, we can't go anywhere, our engines are so totally fried. There is no imminent danger? I'll have them fixed in an hour or two." Yes, yes, I know, nowhere near actual conversation on TNG - but very fun to visualize Geordi talking this way 
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Chosen Few
Alpha Channel Slave
Join date: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 7,496
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01-12-2006 07:46
From: Chip Midnight No, not when they have to invent a new one in every episode to get them out of bad writing. Well, I wouldn't say that happened in every episode, but it certainly happened a lot. Sometimes it was clever, but you're right, usually it fell pretty flat. You might be interested in hearing the song "USS Make-Shit-Up" by Voltaire. I'm sure you'll enjoy it. The rest of the album is really good too. http://www.voltaire.net/mp3/Voltaire-The_USS_Make-Shit-Up.mp3From: Chip Midnight Another thing that annoyed me is that every crew member was an expert of every scientific discipline and every system on the ship... and not just an expert. They were able to invent brand new technologies and find new theoretical uses for ship systems outside their own job descriptions and specialites. That's just silly. Don't get me wrong. I was a huge Star Trek fan for a long time and still have fond memories of it. It just doesn't satisfy me anymore. Keep in mind you're talking about a world where every 10 yr old knows calculus. Someone from 300 years ago looking at us today would probably be pretty amazed at how much we all know. That having been said, I don't recall Worf ever inventing any new technology or Jordi ever having shot down any enemy ships. Okay, Data could do anything, but if you were an android, so could you. For the most part though, everyone pretty much stuck to their own area of expertise, although the descriptions of certain people's backgrounds and skill sets did change a bit over time. It took a few seasons before they decided once and for all who could do what.
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
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01-12-2006 08:04
From: Chosen Few Keep in mind you're talking about a world where every 10 yr old knows calculus. Someone from 300 years ago looking at us today would probably be pretty amazed at how much we all know. We're not any smarter now than we were 300 years ago. We just have a greater base of knowledge to work from. A ten year old in the 1700's would be every bit as capable of learning what a ten year old today can learn if the knowledge was available to be taught. We already know calculus but we can't teach it to a 10 year old. Not now or in the future unless we seriously reengineer the human species.  Star Trek was a fun show... a badly written, logically inconsistent, fun show.
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Daz Honey
Fine, Fine Artist
Join date: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 599
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01-12-2006 08:29
From: Joy Honey OK I didn't see this mentioned anywhere at all: If the ship was damaged in any way and in "peril" it would take Geordi at least 6 hours to fix the problem. If the warp engines went offline or some such, and the ship were not in any danger - 1 or 2 hours is all you would hear from Geordi. Something like this: "Captain, we can't go anywhere, our engines are so totally fried. There are Romulans in the area and we have pissed them off somehow and they're gonna shoot us? It's going to take me at least 10 hours to fix those engines!" OR "Captain, we can't go anywhere, our engines are so totally fried. There is no imminent danger? I'll have them fixed in an hour or two." Yes, yes, I know, nowhere near actual conversation on TNG - but very fun to visualize Geordi talking this way The best episode next to the 'stuck in a temporal loop' one, is when Scottie was re-energised (oooh great pun Daz) and tried to give Geordie some advice on being known as a 'miricle worker' hehe......
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
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01-12-2006 08:34
From: Daz Honey The best episode next to the 'stuck in a temporal loop' one, is when Scottie was re-energised (oooh great pun Daz) and tried to give Geordie some advice on being known as a 'miricle worker' hehe...... haha, I quote that episode constantly when arguing over proposals and budgets with people I subcontract for. "You didn't tell them how long it was actually going to take, laddy?!..."
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Chosen Few
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01-12-2006 10:24
From: Chip Midnight We're not any smarter now than we were 300 years ago. We just have a greater base of knowledge to work from. A ten year old in the 1700's would be every bit as capable of learning what a ten year old today can learn if the knowledge was available to be taught. We already know calculus but we can't teach it to a 10 year old. Not now or in the future unless we seriously reengineer the human species. Star Trek was a fun show... a badly written, logically inconsistent, fun show. No we're not any smarter, but we are more capable due to having been raised in this particular society over that of the 1700's. You hit the nail on the head when you said "if the knowledge was available to be taught." The only reason we can't teach calculus to a 10 year old is because we're not in the practice of raising 10 year olds in such a manner as to prepare them for it. In Ancient Rome, it took decades of study just to learn how to do long division. Why? Because the tools to teach it efficiently and understand it easily were still a thousand years away. The Romans were every bit as intelligent as we, but even their brightest scholars were ill equipped to learn what every fifth grader knows now. That's the whole idea behind why kids on Star Trek can do calculus. To them, it's just basic math, the same way long division is basic math to our kids. To me that's logically very consistent. It's like Tommy Lee Jones put it in Men In Black. "1500 years ago, everybody knew that the Earth was the center of the universe. 500 years ago, everybody knew that the Earth was flat. And 15 minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll 'know' tomorrow." Well, 1500 years ago, everybody knew long division was something only brilliant mathmaticians could do. Now it's child's play. Just 50 years ago, everybody knew that relativity was something only a genius could understand. Now it's taught in middle school, and on the Discovery Channel. I think it stands to reason that 400 years from now, calculus could be considered to be simple. It all depends on what people are raised with.
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Chip Midnight
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Join date: 1 May 2003
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01-12-2006 10:28
I don't think a 10 year old brain is capable of learning calculus, no matter the method used. Of course I could be wrong.
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Chosen Few
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01-12-2006 10:36
You'd be suprised. I saw a video once of kids in a school in Japan who could perform complex astronomic calculations in seconds using nothing more than an abacus. In the time it takes one of us to key the numbers into a computer, they've already got the answer. Like I said, it all depends on what you're raised with.
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Chip Midnight
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Join date: 1 May 2003
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01-12-2006 10:40
From: Chosen Few You'd be suprised. I saw a video once of kids in a school in Japan who could perform complex astronomic calculations in seconds using nothing more than an abacus. In the time it takes one of us to key the numbers into a computer, they've already got the answer. Like I said, it all depends on what you're raised with. Good point. I've seen kids capable of amazing things with only the use of a mental abacus. They've practiced it so much they can just do the finger motions without even having an abacus. I still think Star Trek is far fetched and silly 
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Chosen Few
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01-12-2006 10:45
From: Chip Midnight Good point. I've seen kids capable of amazing things with only the use of a mental abacus. They've practiced it so much they can just do the finger motions without even having an abacus. I still think Star Trek is far fetched and silly Hahaha. Okay then. Far fetched and silly, if it floats your boat, but it's still great.
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Psyra Extraordinaire
Corra Nacunda Chieftain
Join date: 24 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,533
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01-12-2006 10:58
Satire is the most evil plot device of all. 
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
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01-12-2006 11:00
From: Chosen Few Hahaha. Okay then. Far fetched and silly, if it floats your boat, but it's still great. I think the new BSG has spoiled me for all other scifi shows, and even that annoys me at times. I loved Farscape because it made no pretense of being anything other than far fetched escapism. I'm trying to get into Firefly but I still can't get past the western motif which is just too gimmicky. I loved B5 because of the ambition of its storyline (once I got past the horrid acting). I still like the original Star Trek because of the way it used its premise to examine and comment on real world philosophical questions (BSG is great that way too) in the same way Twilight Zone did. Somewhere along the line STTNG lost it for me. It's just too one dimensional. Maybe some day I'll get back into it. My all time favorite ST episode was the one where Picard lives a whole other life with a wife and kids, and I thought the very last episode of TNG was amazing. The ones that dealt with time anomolies were my favorite ones in general.
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Lianne Marten
Cheese Baron
Join date: 6 May 2004
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01-12-2006 11:02
From: Chip Midnight My all time favorite ST episode was the one where Picard lives a whole other life with a wife and kids, and I thought the very last episode of TNG was amazing. The ones that dealt with time anomolies were my favorite ones in general. Yes! With the flute at the end! Amazing stuff. |
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Joy Honey
Not just another dumass
Join date: 17 Jun 2005
Posts: 3,751
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01-12-2006 11:06
From: Lianne Marten Yes! With the flute at the end! Amazing stuff. I loved that episode
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Reality continues to ruin my life. - Calvin
You have delighted us long enough. - Jane Austen
Sometimes I need what only you can provide: your absence. - Ashleigh Brilliant
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Rickard Roentgen
Renaissance Punk
Join date: 4 Apr 2004
Posts: 1,869
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01-12-2006 11:25
From: Sean Martin I always wondered about the jumping into warp speed. They somehow never get flattened like a pancake against the walls. But if they run into a ship or get shot, oh noo then they all go flying every direction possible.  Addition: If they are supposed to have some kind of anti-inertia "seatbelt" then it should apply to all physics.  Warp fields allow jumping to warp, not inertial dampeners. |
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Rickard Roentgen
Renaissance Punk
Join date: 4 Apr 2004
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01-12-2006 11:26
I do too. edit: nevermind, I read the link . |
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Teeny Leviathan
Never started World War 3
Join date: 20 May 2003
Posts: 2,716
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01-12-2006 17:34
I voted time travel, but that's just scratching the surface. The thing that really annoyed me was what I call "The Big Reset". I'll admit it was cool once. The Voyager episode when Janeway was fighting Red Foreman and his time altering ship. It was cool because we got to see Voyager thoroughly trashed over two episodes. At the end, Janeway rams Voyager into Red's ship, killing herself and everyone else, and in the process the timeline is restored, and no one is the wiser.
It was simply overused in TNG as well as on Enterprise. We are also supposed to believe that EVERYTHING is restored EXACTLY the way it was before. Not a person, atom or bug eyed monster out of place.
While I'm still on the soapbox, WTF was the deal with the final episode of Enterprise? The holodeck plot device seemed to be tacked on at the last minute, but that is a rant for another day.
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Bertha Horton
Fat w/ Ice Cream
Join date: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 835
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01-12-2006 22:54
I think the worst plot devices were when they had to "jump the shark" and do something outrageous. The episode where some aliens stole Spock's brain comes to mind.
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Aaron Levy
Medicated Lately?
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
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01-13-2006 20:24
From: Chip Midnight My all time favorite ST episode was the one where Picard lives a whole other life with a wife and kids. I extracted this lone episode from my TNG DVDs and have it on its own DVD to watch when I'm in the mood for some really, good Star Trek. It is the best Star Trek episode ever produced in any of the series(es?, esi? ?). |
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Susie Boffin
Certified Nutcase
Join date: 15 Sep 2004
Posts: 2,151
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01-13-2006 20:49
What are you all talking about? Star Trek began and ended with Capt. James T Kirk and Mr Spock. Who are these other guys you are talking about?
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Rickard Roentgen
Renaissance Punk
Join date: 4 Apr 2004
Posts: 1,869
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01-13-2006 22:57
From: Susie Boffin What are you all talking about? Star Trek began and ended with Capt. James T Kirk and Mr Spock. Who are these other guys you are talking about? spock I'll agree with. Kirk has always been a dumbass. |
