RE: Crashing and no answers on Tech Forum

Please see this thread:
/111/98/140818/1.html#post1299659

I realize the place for this is Tech answers, but it desperately needs attention so I am pointing it out here in the intersts of being a squeaky wheel.

As I said in my question on the Tech forum which no one has offered a clue as to what I should do... I will only tell you what a friend of mine suggested after they hooked up their more powerful computer to my modem.

1. My computer (The one I normally use) is operating with-in established boundaries. That means there are no problems with it. The Video card was checked, the motherboard was checked. And my friend said that Live Help is wrong when they say I need a New Motherboard.

2. Upon Hooking up his computer... They were able to operate ok inside a sim but when my avatar (on his computer) crossed the border wham it crashed. This is on a more powerful computer than I have and using a similar NVidia card.

3. My friend (We were using my avatar (With me moving it around and he watching some instrument like things)) suggested that Second Life Is the sole cause.of my modem going off line (We looked at other Virtural Worlds and Games and Secod Life is the only one that knocked me off line. Looked at Google Earth (Another Streaming software) And it did fine)

Conclusion. Since this started with the last update or two. I believe there maybe a problem with the last updates and that a fundamental examination of the software, compairing it to earlier successful versions should be undertaken. Also, an examination of Flexi-prims should be undertaken as well.

Finally: Useful Information I got out of my friends visit is that my computer is running normally and that there are no problems with drivers, motherboards or the NVidia 6600 256MB ram card.



As I am typing this, My avatar has yet again frozen. This time while standing still on a Private Island. (My friend is laughting saying why I invested so much money into this)

Any suggestions would be very helpful.

Some of the things I have done in the meantime:

1. Had my computer checked out and it runs fine
2. Uninstalled the software and re-installed
3. Contacted the cable company but they say that since its only that one software that causes the modem to go down that its Second Lifes fault (You would expect a different answer from such a stuck up group as Comcast???)
4. Shut down Norton Anti-virus and Firewall thinking it might be those, but am now turning them both back on since it is still freezing up and crashing
5. Did a System Restore.

None of these have helped. SO what should I do?

NEW DATA: We have discovered that some times, the Website www.secondlife.com and the blog also shut down the Modem. This does not happen as often as the Second Life Software but it is only limited to the .com and the blog. We tried several other web pages and only the Secondlife. Com site shut down the modem

More new DATA: I removed my skin etc and tested the Sim line. I still crash and this time the modem was down for quite a while.

Merged -- please do not misuse Linden Answers, it simply isn't the right place and makes it difficult for others to find questions which belong here. Please read About This Forum:

/139/45/138320/1.html

I really don't like crashing problems either; you should contact our Support for help with that, that would be the right place.

I'll move this to Technical Issues too. BTW, Technical Issues is read by Lindens but not replied to regularly. So to get an answer, contact support please.

I sent a message to support 2 weeks ago and havent gotten an answer yet.
So if you try that dont expect anything to happen right away.

Bad Answer. We are not amused.
Torley-- I love you, you are a darling caring person, BUT-- Sweetie-- tell me again why I can't seem to get anywhere with the normal channels you suggest except the obvious- uninstal reinstall, defrag, update drivers and the usual (by now totally obvious) things to do? Tell me also why I am paying as much as I am between my tier and the 2 estates I co-own to play in a world where I can't stay logged in more than 20 minutes without a meltdown? So your supervisor asks you to sweep this under the rug and out of sight? Sweetie-- that isn't right, although I don't expect a single one of you Lindens to OWN this situatin & quit blaming it on my or Magnum's computers, both of which operate normally other than playing SL. I don't mind so much you moved the thread, I mind that you wag a finger at us for posting to Linden Answers with a non-reply to the problem. I had hoped you would go-- "hey Techie Linden-- could you please take a look at this thread and help these long-time residents out, please?"
Good Lord. Please pinch me-- I am apparently fantasizing again.

The topic is buried now and I expect an answer- well-- I don't expect one, really--"Technical Issues is read by Lindens but not replied to regularly." I expect the cavalier attitude to continue; I expect my voice and that of us other crash test dummies to be silenced or ignored. That attitude says horrible things about LL, sadly and will eventually lose the paying customers who run afoul of tech/ griefing/ performance issues.

Again, Torley, this is not an attack on you personally. I am frustrated near to tears by this for 3 months, botched updates, grid attacks and all--- and nothing I have had suggested has helped or even lessened my crashing woes. I have tolerated this crashing for 3 months now, so obviously I tenaciously love SL. Does LL even give a hoot about me?

You guys tout SL as a place where one can run a business and make real money--Maybe you need to add this to your front page: "-- so you can sink every cent and more of your profits into computer upgrades that do not help. Your World, Your frustration"

Yes, I am quite hot about this now. Sorry you had to be moving target to my rant, Torley. I am going to go pet one of my cats and try to calm my blood pressure back down now.

How sad is it that I expect no helpful response still?

This is Mirra Hathors RL and SL husband. I imagine that it's not too much a stretch of the imagination on your part to believe that I have been hearing Mirras frustrations about her issues with the SL client.

The issues go back a while. Starting when she had a very nice 256MB Radeon 9600 XT card, a card capable of playing games much more graphics intensive games than Second Life without a hitch. However, she started crashing and you guys blamed on it on the card "We're not compatible with almost 50% of graphics cards out there" (I paraphrase).

So, I viewed one of the files SL installed file, I believe featuretable.txt and the top of the line, compatible with everything card, was the Nvidia Geforce FX 7800. So I went out and bought the souped up Gefore 7800 card for her, and fitted it. That did, admittedly, seem to fix the problems. Score 1 for the Lindens.

Then came this latest bout of crashes, starting at around SL Client V 1.10. Having just spent $400 on a graphics card, this was quite annoying. I tried everything I could to get it working.

Today, I seem to have stumbled on the actual problem, and its something the Lindens didn't even think of. When I got home from work today, Mirra informed me that she had received an "Out of Disk Space" alert, perplexed as she has a rather large disk, I took a look.

I shared the drive using windows sharing, mounted in on my mac (which I have no problems using SL on btw, Intel MbP, very nice and ran OmniDiskSweeper on it. And lo and behold, I follow the folders down the following path:

C:\Documents and Settings\USERNAME\Application Data\SecondLife\Cache and what do I find? 63GB, YES 63GB of cache files.

I uninstalled SL, removed the SecondLife folder at the path above, and would you know, SL seems much more stable. I would imagine that loading 63GB of cache files probably was hard work. Oddly enough, Mirra has repeatedly uninstalled and reinstalled SL at the Lindens request... this doesn't seem to have removed the files in question.

Obviously, there is some sort of bug here. Why don't you look into it, instead of adding features for a change? As a software developer myself, I understand the attraction of working on shiney things, but lets face it, they're useless if the basics don't work - and SL is built on the backs of its in-game tools, and the users who use them; lets try to accomodate them, hmm?

Magnum, can you check this folder too, I'd be interested to know if you have the same problem.

- Davey

Edit: To see the files in question, check out this unbelievable screenshot I patched together: http://www.pixelated-dreams.com/uploads/misc/sl_cache_b0rkage.gif

Removing the bazillion copies of the cache file have NOT solved my crash issue by any means, although it has helped my overall machine performance. It seems that SL is failing to delete this file in about 1/2 of my crashes and adding a new one on relog. To clarify-- uninstal/ reinstall did NOT delete these files, they had to be deleted manually. If you happen to look at Davey's image, EACH line of that image except the last dozen or so is a 500mb file. Just insane.

SO-- this leaves me pretty close to where I started (just with a lot more disc space).

I STILL NEED HELP TO RESOLVE THIS MATTER, SL IS STILL CLOSE TO UNUSABLE.

SO ... no one is willing to help ... the basic answer is to BLAME the user NO MATTER WHAT??

I too have asked for help ... and recieved NO assistance...yet .. the cases were closed as solved. I have asked for non-tech help too ... and received the same response: less than NOTHING.

I understand this is a huge and complicated system ... but we the paying users are NOT being listened to ... or if we are ...there is no acknowledgement. We need help ... and need to know that the SL issues are being worked on. The features are awsome ... but what good are great ... and needed features ... if we cannot use them?

Calling support? Why??? Just save yourselves and us grief... fire then all and disconnect the phone number ... at least it would be an honest reply from LL.

I'd been having crashing issues since I got my brand new computer - a massive powerhouse that runs every benchmark and stress test with flying colors, but for some reason SL kept crashing, and crashing, and crashing. With some spontaneous reboots in there on top of it.

Worked with LL, worked with the motherboard manufacturer, took it to Geek Squad, everything kept on coming back roses. Finally when it crashed after Geek Squad went through it, I checked out this program: Driver Detective

It has a free trial, which will scan your system and tell you everything you have a driver installed for and if its out of date or not. You have to pay to get access to their database of driver links, but the free trial will at least give you the names of the hardware so you can look up the drivers yourself.

I found 6 drivers out of date, including two on the network cards from 2001. Since I updated those I haven't crashed once and no more reboots (still keeping fingers crossed though). Sooo even if you're sure you've updated your drivers, check this out and see if there aren't a few you missed that might be causing the problem.

Try mucking with your modem setings, I got a pretty good increase in speed teaking. There may be something borked in your current settings, I dunno.

Might try turning down your network speed slider to very low and see if the crashing changes. Your symptoms sound like network problems. SL can move a high volume of data relatively quickly and it may simply overwhelm a weak modem. No other online world or game sends out 500meg at 1500 kbps plus so comparing it to other online sites isn't helpful really. Few content providers offer speeds and volumes in this range, the average is around 300kbps or less. Also, some internet providers have download limits they don't tell you about. For instance mine has a 4 gig limit. If I go over that in a month my internet speed goes way down and playing SL a lot can push me over that easily.

Sorry, not much help but its all I can add.

well i have a laptop with ll the right equipment and 11mb connection, and i deleted a 500mb cache, but whenever i start sl, it freezes on the login screen, i cant even enter my name and pass, it just freezes, and when i do get lucky and enter pass, it gets stuck on (verify protocol)

*UPDATE* ~9pm eastern us time~

i tried using driver detective and updated drivers, but sl still freezes, and when i check processor usage, it says 90-98%... i run an athlon 3200+ so i have no clue wtf is wrong

also is ther a possibility of getting an irc channel up for this stuff? seeing how posts are slow and live help is for those who can actually log in.. and if anyone wants to get ahold of me im me at [email]gokuui@yahoo.com[/email](yahoo) or [email]gokuui@hotmail.com[/email](msn)

this way we can actually get live help outside of sl

it didnt say in sys reqs. ,but is there a difference between the mobility radeon 9600 or radeon 9600? i have the mobility and really dont have the cash to get a better card so please be it that i can use my current card..

ok well i just got to school and tried the really bad internet connection here and my client didnt freeze until i did login.. (verifying protocol)

and no one can thumb us in as to whats on the down low? the internet connection is worse than the 11b network at home. so how is it that the client works here to an extent? also if i use a school hard line connection i can fully login and play, so i guess the whole problem isnt client or server sided, its internet card sided... which means ppl should use g connections with better data rates.. damn.. this sux much..

first.. i know this is quad post but im tryin to keep thread from being buried..

next.. i just tried the client for the millionth time at home and it didnt lock up! so the problem has to be server side.. because my client then locks up here


ive asked about it from various other users and they all concur from their own investigations that it is just the crash bug at work. strange thing i can still log in using same client but on school computers.. so may still be an internet thing..


anyways, with the small but rather huge improvemnet with client, i have to say the lindens are making progress!

HIP-HIP-HORREEY!!