Posting more than once in events is considered spam - please clarify

"SPAM (repeated posting of the same event in a single day) WILL NOT BE TOLERATED and will be SUBJECT TO DISCIPLINARY ACTION. Please do not use the Events calendar in any way which would inhibit its usefulness to the community at large. Failure to follow these guidelines may result in a SUSPENSION OF YOUR ACCOUNT."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So...even if one has a legitimate event that follows the event posting rules, hosted etc yadda yadda..

If you wish to post the same event FIVE times over the course of a 24hr period to cater to those in SecondLife who are from all over the first world planet ie: different times zones. You are going to get suspended for repeated spam?

HOW does this NOT "inhibit the usefulness to the community at large"?

Am I to understand that Linden Lab are only catering to the North American time zones?

Could someone from Linden Lab please clarify this to those of us who are not from the North Americas, and are not just trying to cater to North American time zones, but to everyone in all time zones.

If it is the case that Linden Lab do not wish to cater outside of their own band of timezones, then perhaps Linden Lab close off SecondLife to all BUT those people.

Thanx in advance.

If you are posting an identical event five times a day to cater to the global audience, i want to know when you sleep

Maybe the resmods are monitoring the events list now. It certainly seems the police blotter entries are written by different authors plus there is confusion about some posting violations such as this multiple posts per day etc.

Smells like a resmod to me.

Have you ever heard of hiring hosts?

you make a very good point here Luthian.

what linden labs has done here is to limit the posting of events to a narrow few time zones for any one particular individual.



If you know Luthian she goes days with out sleep so posting events several times a day for her is not a problem

I would also like to point out that Luthians place where she has her events is a cultural icon for New Zealand. It is superbly built and in my opinion the ipitamy of a great build and a great place to go and enjoy your self and learn about New Zealand.

what has Luthian received from linden labs and the community for all her hard work in creating such a spectacular and wonderful build. is a warning and and has placed on the police blotter.
I doubt very highly any one from Linden Labs has even visited her place I'm sure if they had this would never have happened to Luthian.
its very sad indeed that they simply used the fact that her events were posted several times a day to punish her. with out ever going to see what the event location was like.

I even remember Luthian and I talking one day about the time Phillip came to visit New Zealand and how he commented on how wonderful the build was.

Seems to me it's simple. One even, one post.

If you're hiring a host to host events at different times, then they would be *different* events happening at *different* times.

And I don't see where some sort of pro-north america bias comes into it at all. If you are holding an event at 3AM SL time for people located in a time zone where a 3AM start time would be apropriate, then you list it as starting at 3AM.

Unless of course, you're not actually holding *different* events, but the same "event" all day long, and want to be able to plug it multiple times a day. In which case it's not actually an *event* it's just an on-going business, in which case you shouldn't be posting in the events calender at all, and you should be listing it in the classifieds instead.

According to the definition, *real* events have a start time and an end time. Which I suspect is *not* considered to be 12AM to 12PM.

Honestly, I don't understand what's so hard about all this. That is, unless someone's using spammer logic, in which case, a severe LARTing is indicated.

IMHO - while the rule quoted above can be interpreted several different ways, and we probably all could benefit from some clarity: I think the spirit of the rule is clear.

Posting the same event, for an hour at 9am and an hour at 9pm in order to reach folks in different timezones shouldn't be an issue.

Posting the same 3-hour event, back to back 5 times resulting in 15 hours of coverage becomes something much more like spam. Bonus points if you use alts to acheive full 24-hour coverage.

That's the way I interpret it, at least. I'm curious as well as to Linden's perspective.

Please befor you bash Luthian take a min to visit her place it is a wonderful place and full of culture and beauty.

Luthian has spent hundreds and hundreds of hours building and refining New Zealand and she deserves better then to be bashed for simply posting many events because she is so proud of her build she wants the world to see it.

thnaks
crucial armitage

I don't see any bashing of Luthien going on at all in this thread so far. At most: maybe a little bit of disagreement with her position on the subject.

Regardless of how awesome Luthien's build is, how much time she has put into it, or how proud she is of it: we all have to follow the rules alike. Granted, those rules could use some clarity. I hope we get some so that everyone is on a level playing field.

Opinion:

I would put this question to Linden Answers, if you haven't already.

This whole thing is really beginning to bother me terribly. It's like - damn - I can't even articulate it, but it's like this HUGE whammy on something, way out of proportion. Like a witch hunt, or McCarthyism or something.

Events are something the Lindens should WANT us to do. They provide content. The calendar is right there for everybody to look at, new players and old, very accessible. You don't have to go to some web site, jot down notes, and then enter the game to attend the events.

Torley, this is a very grave mistake you are making here in listening to people on the forums, and then hauling off into action punishing your CUSTOMERS for creating your content for you. Most people don't really care what is on the Events list; they can read and thus scan it without committing hari-kari over the horror of it all; and I do believe it is mainly a few harking back to some fond days of yore who so much want and CHEER this strict punishment of people who are posting their events.

We aren't talking about bringing down the grid here. This cheering of people getting warnings and suspensions for what are really minor infractions, if indeed they are actually guilty, is unseemly.

And the fact that innocents (people who are not breaking any posting rules) are being punished along with the guilty is NOT a small matter, or an oh well, too bad, thing.

You know, things are hard enough for people putting on events without creating this climate.

If you are going to go about handing out warnings and suspensions - which are serious punishments - you must go to each and every one of these events, talk to the people putting them on, and see whether or not your first impression that they are illegitimate is correct.

These sweeping pogroms sweep up some innocents in the net, make something that is supposed to be fun (hosting events) a source of fear and practically a criminal activity, alienate customers, and consequently work against the best interests of SL.

CC

Agreed, Coco - good call. There's too much grey area here, and could benefit from some clarity from Linden. Whipping up an answers post now.

Oh please. That's as bad as comparing disciplinary action to nazi tattooing. It's nothing of the sort.



Your "most" and my "most" are not the same. My "most" rarely read the event list, because it's worthless these days.

Clearly.

coco

If it's the same freakin' event -- tringo/slingo -- with only the host changing every two hours, IT'S STILL THE SAME DAMN EVENT.

to have this on the rules for posting event:


You may currently post up to 5 events per day (including event edits).


and then to have this as well:

SPAM (repeated posting of the same event in a single day) WILL NOT BE TOLERATED and will be SUBJECT TO DISCIPLINARY ACTION. Please do not use the Events calendar in any way which would inhibit its usefulness to the community at large. Failure to follow these guidelines may result in a SUSPENSION OF YOUR ACCOUNT.


yes it is very confusing and really should have clearly defined parameters of what is ok to post and what is not.

if i post my how to make a prim dress class at 1am for one hour, then at 10am for one hour, then at 1pm for one hour, then at 4pm for an hour, then at 7pm for one hour - will I get in trouble?

that is five event in 24 hour time period - which is ok according to the first part. but does it mean spam according to the second part?

Yep! Agree 100%.

I am at a total loss as to why people freak out over such a small thing. I can think of a lot better things to be spending my energies on.

The spam rule is in place to prevent people from doing things like setting up an all day yard sale and listing it as an "event" several times during the day. This had become a very common practice, a way to avoid having to pay for a classified ad.

If you have 5 separate one hour classes during the day, even if they teach the same thing, that would be considered five different events, and you are perfectly within your rights to post event listings for each one.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I can tell you why I personally care about spammage on the event calendar:

1. Jesse Linden has essentially put us on notice that if we as a community don't clean up our act, Linden is going to start charging us to post events to the event calendar. Debate aside on whether paying to post is a good or bad thing, I think most of us would agree that we'd rather not pay to post events if there's another way.

2. There are so many events on the calendar now, that a single post can get lost in the shuffle. Just from a casual poll of folks that attend the few events that I do post, many of them never saw my event post, and instead heard via word of mouth. That's somwehat discouraging.

Ultimately, my perspective on this is that there should be zero restrictions on the event calendar, classified ads should be free - and technology (better searching) should take the place of all this policing. However, for me at least - reality has set in, and the best I can hope for is even application of whatever rules Linden decrees for everyone that posts events.

I agree. Search in general is a much-needed improvement inworld, but not having effective searches for events seems silly. It would be nice to be able to post events in multiple appropriate categories, have more specific categories of events (including perhaps unhosted events such as art competitions or things like the Darfur exhibit), and let people rate or comment on events hosted by that host or on that land in the past to give people an idea of how time-worthy it is.
It seems crazy that the best way to advertise an event is through out-of-world webpages or forums. Especially when boredom is such a problem inworld.

Personally in my oppinion Events are the same as classifieds really, you are advertising something for both things, therefore they should both apply to the same rules, and those rules should be CONSISTANT. If you want to take out 5 adds or however many you want in the classified fine, but should be the same for the Events because well, you are ADVERTISING something. Both do the same thing just one has a time associated with it and apparently you have to have a host there, and one you do not. Make the Events and Classifies the same, for education purposes have it seperate, get rid of all the other Event Tabs all together or make them pay for posting in the event tab since well, its advertisement same as the classified. Ok, i am done, flame away

Classifieds are paid advertising for commercial products. Event listings feature both commercial and non-commercial listings. Think of your local indy newspaper (for me it would be the Boston Phoenix). They take it upon themselves to list local events, concerts, museum shows, etc. as a service for their readers, but they charge for their classified ad space.

Yes, I agree with you there, but looking in your local newpaper in the events section does it have times and listings for say some car lots end of the years savings? No, they are advertising, so therefore it goes in the classifieds, as you noticed i said education should be in its own category all together, its educational and they dont make any money at it and just trying to help other people learn a new skill, thats cool, if someone opened up an art gallery that didnt charge anything for admintance that would be cool, its also educational. However, plosting in the events for say a club whatever event hmmm....maybe, thats a gray area, but anything comercial such as well grand opening of a new store, do you see that in the events section of your local paper? no, its going to be paid in advertising. Most likely movie theaters pay to have their movie times listed in the papers, dont know to be honest so if anyone works for the advertising department of a newspaper please correct me if i am wrong. But if someone wants to list 5 times for something and it says they can list 5 times a day including edits or whatever, then let it be so, if they want to do them back to back or break up in the day, its their choice. LL needs to be consistant witht their rules and regulations before just doing mass handouts of warnings or disciplinary actions. But I do thank you Pol for not "flaming" and actually giving an intellegent response and being mature about it

theres some good ol linden logic

1 make a system where anyone can post anything

2 make veuge rules (like the one in this post) and dont enforce it

3 get pissy about noone following your russian stereo instructions and start slapping hands like mad, making it look like ,after a long long time of apithy, that your doing something

4 threaten your comminuity with some sort of nerf, becuase they didnt instantly obey what was said (which i find amusing becuse Linden Labs is the biggest bunch of procrastinators ive ever seen in a activly developed mmo, "follow the rules or else !!!", what about the 4 mile long list of bugs and vaporware features? "eh well get to it"

*shrug*

Ah, hello! ^_^

Travis, thank you for asking--Jesse has replied in SL Answers:

/139/0e/106116/1.html

We like to keep it simple!

That Events Posting Rules page is already quite dense: too many rules create headaches. At the same time, a few easy things do apply.

One benefit of the recent events cleanup is, it's much easier to see what constitutes a valid event by looking at current examples of the calendar--because most of the NON-events have already been removed.

I suppose one of the most human, positive things, which hasn't been brought up enough, is simply: be at your event. One of the surest signs of something belonging in Classifieds is when noone--not even the host!--is present. 0 green dots makes me sad. But! What makes me happy is this... as I've mentioned in previous postings, I really like to have someone around to ask questions to and make banter with. Whether it's a yard sale, or a guided motivational stroll, it's beautiful. Just a genial, jovial thing to do.