The end of Second Life.

Brilliantly stated, Aldo.

I don't know why or how anyone could think that Second Life could be a web platform, given the fact that we don't even have HTML on a PRIM YET. I think its a fact that they're making a last ditch effort in order to increase the 'customer' database with false implications. If I were an investor I'd like to look into the nooks and crannies of a company and how they work. To me, SL is a forgary and a fraud.

Second Life will now go the ways of what Active Worlds has become. A giant wasteland. With nobody in it.

So, be at peace, knowing the view of Second Life has failed.

If they truely want us to be collaborative, they'd give us the tools so we can create the tools that are on 'as a needed basis' instead of us having to wait for them to push it out. In other words, Open Source.

And yet, Eins, for some odd reason you're still here. SL is a fraud and a complete failure and that's why I still log into it every day and have for the past three years.

It's exciting, I think. I am happy to follow the visionaries.

You don't want to precisely follow visionaries - you never know quite what their vision is (or whether they have one that makes sense at all). I prefer "hanging around with people doing interesting stuff, seeing what they're doing, and using that to (hopefully) do my own interesting stuff".

I honestly do not get the impression that SL is going to be sold off as a place for VR corporate conferences and showcase ad builds, though perhaps there'll be more of them - all the better for the escort business - because of the overwhelming sense of idealism that comes from Lindens whenever you talk to them or whenever they write. If LL went hardcore corporate I think most of them would quit, and so would a lot of the residents, and bang, all of the advantages that SL has over other systems would vanish. I've spent a lot of time in corporate environments and I just don't get the feel here. Now, that concentrated idealism might sometimes result in apparently mayfly development attention spans and well-meaning changes that cause complete chaos, but it's a hard balance to get right, and I'd rather have them get it wrong sometimes than turn into There or something.

I've not talked to Philip, clearly, but I certainly don't see that blog entry as being an abandonment of anything. It's when he seems bored that you should start worrying.

I didn't say CHAIN MYSELF to them. In the virtual worlds I've been in it has been most interesting when the visionaries have been in charge. Once they leave, for whatever reason, the suits take over and it becomes... uninteresting. A giant project like this requires the vision and dynamism of a very special person. I'd never be able to do something like this on my own, of course - but I'm glad to have the chance to be a part of it in a small way.

Seconded.

I disagree with your entire post.

First, SL is not a game and I can't recall LL ever calling it such.

Second, SL is not at a dead end as a game because again, it is not a game.

Finally, I can imagine a 3D iTunes in SL. It would be wonderful, sort of like SL back in 2003/early 2004 when Frankie Beach and Jellin Pico had their music stores. It would not be a slow experience like walking around a department store. We have a "3rd eye" in SL for a reason and if you are walking around stores instead of using your 3rd eye (camera angles) then that slow experience is on you.

Briana Dawson

So according to you all of SL's perceived problems are because LL has placed an emphasis on commercialism instead of creativity??

I'd have to disagree. especially with statements like:



As much as I love SL, it has always had an underdeveloped an ugly mess look in parts of the world. Even when we only had 40 or so sims back in 2003, there were still people complaining about the world looking discombobulated. We had gigantic prim builds in Hawthorne that lasted 6+ months, and horrific primtastic craptastic builds all over. It has nothing to do with commercialism. It has to do with people getting bored and quiting - this has been happening since the beta.

The rest of your points are all really just over simplified. SL is a love it or hate it experience, regardless of what aspects of SL that LL is emphasizing.

This place rocks...sans the sky is falling complainers

Briana Dawson

Glad somebody said this, because certain people have been talking about SL in this way since 2003 - residents, Lindens, and company execs in their notorious "white papers". Is there really any doubt that Second Life is

a) a demonstration system for outlining potentials?
b) still in (a very long) beta phase - technically, conceptually, and organization-wise?
c) based largely on a single, brilliant, non-technical conception: to get people to pay a company to create company product? for demonstrative purposes, of course.

No no no Pham, we've been over this already. If you want to work for LL, you have to learn to say what you don't mean and do the exact the opposite. It's not rocket science. Philip said quite plainlyWhat part of this is not specific? How do I properly interpret this to not mean that these servers, even if they're independently hosted, will not be part of THE Second Life grid? Or from another angle, what part of "the map" will Linden Lab not own?

Now I will grant you that Philip almost invariably says exactly the opposite of what LL finally do. Is that how I should interpret his statements?

I like to rant. Cause ya'll suckers for it.

yes...exactly..probably one of the best versions of Christmas Carol--right up there with the Magoo version. (which was pretty darn good metaphor in itself--"the blind man who shall be made to see"

THe sky is falling! The sky is falling!

Wait...SL has more users, the trade amounts on the LindeX keep increasing in overall dollars traded, more and more people get premiums to set up their businesses and then transact through LL to get the USD....

SL is failing WHAT? An IQ test, perhaps, if scoring some of your common hookers, but that's about it.

While I can't deny that this will probably continue to be a profitable industry in SL, I strongly disagree that this is the only industry that can benefit from SL.

Last fall I helped facilitate a distance education project in which a professor of International Business and his students planned to use SL as a practical example of another "country," with its own customs, economy, and culture, which they would need to learn about in order to start a business. It was a great idea. The instructor and students were enthusiastic. LL loaned the class land (through their Campus program). Unfortunately, none of the students were able to reliably connect to SL. They had reasonable equipment and bandwidth, but SL sets the technology bar pretty high, and if you don't happen to have the right video card, etc. and aren't comfortable with fiddling with your system until it works, you're not going to get in. (Especially in a compressed 8-week course format.)

Still, I hope that at some point the environment will be stable enough for long enough that most folks (with computers) will have systems able to access SL. I think the strongest, most unique feature of SL is actually the communities that form in it, and those communities are strengthened by the capabilities for individual expression and collaborative construction. If we must compare SL to the Web, let's remember that the Web isn't only a giant shopping mall. It's a reference tool, a communication tool, a community building tool, etc. Similarly, if we must compare SL to RL, RL also does not consist only of commercial enterprises. There are also neighborhoods, schools, parks, and town halls.

The community aspect of SL is not new, of course -- MU* servers and clients have provided similar capabilities for decades. MU* systems also provided the ability for "players" to create areas in the world, though based on text descriptions (and code), rather than visible geometry. But many people seem to find the visual aspect of SL much easier to relate to than the text-based environments of MU*, and there are ways in which SL is used that have grown and gone beyond MU* systems (flying machines involving physics, for example). Most of all, SL emulates the ability to feel as though you've really "met" someone from a different place, without actually travelling.

I recall two summers ago I met a woman who lived 2000 miles from me for the first time in RL. We'd previously met via email, phone, and then on SL. The first thing she said when she met me was, "I recognized you right away-- you look just like you do in Second Life!" And we were already familiar with each others' ideas and attitudes, as well. I think this is the real power of SL -- the ability to minimize distance and help bring people together across this wide world who might otherwise never have a chance to meet.

But then, I'm an idealist. You cynics can now go back to your discussion about how the world is ending.

neko

WHAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH.

Aww dont cry.

Heh, I think SL will be fine. Don't worry your wittle head.

Jarod Godel scripted an inworld iTunes controller. I think it works through llHttpRequest(), maybe old XML/RPC, to run a script on his webserver that interfaces with iTunes. He can probably automate that to update the music stream he feeds to his parcel and, when we have inworld browsing, can find, purchase download and set the stream using inworld controls on his little plot in Zoe.

I keep telling him he should open a little store.

I suppose by your standards the internet is a stupid failure too since people use it for business and not gaming.

BTW, Linden Lab's business model doesn't draw specifically on what Lewis Nerd wants and thinks best for everyone with a fuck everyone else attitude. Maybe if you give them a couple million dollars in venture capital they will take your theories into consideration.

I've never understood the "the end of second life" threads because I feel the same way Aldo does. You can do the same thing now that you did in Second Life 2 years ago. SL will get bigger, it will evolve and change, people will come and go, but that doesn't mean it's coming to an end.

I agree. I also think that fear of change is an inherent human emotion. I've always thrived off change because I get bored easily. I understand concerns about change when it is not completely understood. Its just the scorched earth / villagers with torches mentality that I don't get. If Second Life never changed at all it would have failed long ago. Change is good.

-Jennyfur

Anyone can throw money at any project they wish.

However, I have something far more useful to Linden Lab - enthusiasm, imagination, drive, and the desire to truly create "my world, my imagination" using their game/tool/platform/interverse metanet/phone a friend/whatever.

If more people were like me, concentrating on providing a quality experience for people to enjoy, rather than how much money they can make out of SL, then I think it would be a lot better off.

Lewis

I don't understand the "SL will die as soon as people start building other virtual worlds" posts either. Worlds built for purposes other than anonymous amusement won't even compete with SL. But the ones that do will likely target focused audiences by offering specilized environments catering to established groups.

Second Life will be that second (third?) iteration of gridded worlds, an open free for all virtual environment to play and frolic through as you "meet" other imaginary personae for years and years. It's not going away anytime soon. It'll also never be profitable, but always serving as a loss leading demonstration model. I wonder when LL will accept that fact.

But what makes you so sure you provide a quality experience? In general Lewis, your vision sorta scares me.
While in general i actually do agree with you about over commercialzation i have also seen some of teh most fantastic builds done for commercial uses...so the 2 are not incompatable

Have you ever considered a lucrative career in stand up comedy? cause I can't stop laughing.

I believe the exact opposite of everything Lewis said...

AND IT'S LINDEN LAB! SINGULAR! NOT PLURAL! STOP TROLLING! HOW MANY TIMES MUST YOU BE TOLD BEFORE YOU GET IT RIGHT!

"Stupid vision." Yeah, and yours is just so glorious. We're tiring of your constantly negative opera.

I prefer Harle's comments, she shows why it's important to dream big:



Regards,

-Flip