Why isn't Microsoft trying to "LL"?

Well to be honest your use of linux pales into insignificance when compared with the unprovoked and unwarranted use of the word "woot"....

Google's already interested!

True. In my defense its early and my caffeine levels are dangerously low.

Hi Benn,

I'm happy to be proved wrong, but as far as I know current market analysis (as of Jan 200 shows a noticeable drop in the popularity of pure social networking sites, with SL and Friends Reunited leading the nose dive to oblivion.

Again, I know that there will be people jumping up and down telling me SL is so much more, but to the big bad world.. it really isn't.

As far as my reading has taken me, I understand that the whole Google/Google Earth/Sketchup thing is being positioned as an adjunct to RL processes and activities.

As I say, I'd be very interested if you have credible sources with a different position.

since when is sl a social networking site?
its not even a site.

Hello Trolane,

Well as I think I mentioned


Alright it's not a site per se, it provides an infrastructure for social networking. I guess I should have been a bit more rigorous in my use of terms!

There is an argument that it's more than a social networking site, however market perceptions are that it's facebook or bebo with avatars, and unfortunately when you live in the real world and are looking for money to keep your business afloat, managing perceptions is important.

Ok, you can build things and sell things and create a brave new world.. but it appears that our particular brave new world isn't as attractive as we might think.

So yes, pedantic point scoring aside, SL is considered by the world at large as a facility for social networking. The argument as to what SL "is or isn't" is pretty moot at present even to us, as the multitude of Game/Not Game threads on this board alone will evidence.

At the end of the day we can argue among ourselves about this as much as we want. The truth is however that SL isn't exactly a shining beacon of success and until then potential market entrants/competitors will be pretty thin on the ground.

As I say though, I'm happy to be shown the error of my ways..

Very astute.

coco

I would agree. The subscription model they have currently while I am sure makes a decent amount is not enough for MS, Google or the like to pursue. However once it reaches a critical mass as you imply it will cause enough attention for them to work on their own or buy LL outright.

However if they do decide to create their own ver of SL, I think is EXACTLY what LL could use. A little competition to force their hand at getting bugs and long term issues resolved faster.

Windows XP at this point it quite a solid OS. Just as solid and secure as a *nix box.

Hi,

Hmm, I think you need to look at the overall competitive landscape, and if you do you'll see a number of different vectors into "3d" software and that MS is already in there to some extent:

* Adobe Flash - Announced this week expansion into "3d gaming" and 3d Flash is already out there on the web

* Microsoft XBox

* IBM and OpenSimulator

* Sun Microsystems and mobile services for SL (who, along with IBM, seems like a good candidate to buy of LL eventually)

* Sony Home (which is where MS is likely to try to compete)

* Google VR (at this point more rumor than fact, but we shall see. If Google does it, then MS will too.)

* WoW

* New startups focused on VR


...and so on. Someone mentioned Apple, which AFAIK has shown no interest in 3d so far beyond some QuickTime stuff. But that could change. Of course if LL makes good on its promise to open source the server side of SL, then there is a good possibility that SL can become the immersive standard for the web.

As it stands now, the market for 3d is still relatively small and there isn't yet a totally clear differentiation between immersive platforms (which is what SL seems to want to be) and immersive games (which is what Sony Home seems to want to be). When MS gets into this space (when, not if), it will likely tie it to Xbox and IE and MSN in some fashion, and make it proprietary, possibly even limiting it to Windows users.

Also, the same VC who backed LL is also backing a startup who is focused on bringing SL to the mobile marketplace, so the story about what SL will be when it grows up is still being written.

The problem with completely flexible user content creation as it is on SL at the moment, is that from an economic point of view it's a rather bad tradeoff. Only a minority ever even use the content creation tools, and within that only a minority are good enough to make anything they want to keep. Yet, every user on SL has to deal with the lag that's caused by SL not being able to employ caching and graphical optimization in the same way that "games" with static content do.

Worse yet, other social sites like IMVU and Kaneva eliminate many of the problems that SL has, but also eliminate the ability for every user to create content in-world. But the problem is, the better quality and value the content on SL gets - and thus the less need any user has to create their own content - the better and better value that tradeoff becomes, which means that SL could be sleepwalking into a minefield. The introduction of sculpties, for example, was a disaster from this point of view. People often said that IMVU didn't support content creation as well as SL because to become a "mesher" you had to use external 3D tools, but the introduction of sculpties introduces the possibility of it becoming unviable to be a builder on SL unless you're able to use external 3D tools, potentially wiping out SL's advantage.

Likewise, I think the social side jars many people. The problem is that the bigger and the more mainstream a social site gets, the more it starts to just become the same as RL socialization, with all the problems and drama that result.

I think the big difference between SL and the other 3D environments is that SL's long term goal is not the creation of a gaming platform but the creation of an interoperable 3D virtual space:
http://secondlifegrid.net/programs/awg
It is a noble, and possibly futile, goal and not one to likely be shared by microsoft, nintendo, et. al. (google perhaps). I don't know what the future holds, but i'm confident sooner or later everyone is going to be getting into 3D space one way or another with their own particular agendas. LL has a good head start and i like their agenda so i will continue to support it ... and enjoy doing so.

Microsoft already has a presence on SL ... do a search in Places on Microsoft and you will find they have at least one island "Microsoft Visual Studio Island" I think ... or did the last time I looked. There are also at least two .NET groups which are fairly large and active although not necessarily Microsoft per se, it shows that integration between MS and SL is being explored.

Oh ... and Bill Gates is leaving Microsoft, so as far as I can tell he has no part in any of the above.

LL is poorly managed and the technology, management, and skills aren't yet fully available nor devolped. Microsoft has taken a look at virtual worlds and have a number of other things to worry about atm.

Funny enough whether any sexual scandals involved usage of Windows , Mac or Linux seems to be not important as would happen id SL became our internet browser.

Well at least we wouldn't be downloading 15 CD's of wall and floor textures everyweek

Maybe the big companies like Google or Microsoft or whoever ..

Is Waiting for LL to hit every brick-wall Second Life smashed headfirst into,

Like gambling, and banking, and taxes, and how to bring minors onto the grid with adult content, the Media, Politicians, etc, etc.

Then once Second Life has weathered all that mess, and its obvious what you can and cant do --- they will come in with a better competing product and steal the whole concept.

No but it doesn't make you more commercially attractive either especially if they have to tweak their software for it to work for you

I think they're probably waiting to see if SL will ever actually turn a profit rather than be

”absolutely in the ballpark of profitability”,

As Mitch Kapor put it recently...

More likely MS would wait till it looks like L has it at their best then drop their own version on the market with all the mistakes ironed out, buy SL under another name and either join the grids sucking all the good userbase away and leave the miscreats and freeloaders here then pull the plug on the servers.

Maybe in 30 or 40 years when SL is no longer a "beta" Bill Gates and those guys may take notice.

Yeah they will look at some exhibit build on old virtual worlds from MICROSOFT3D and go ..

"hey wow - Second Life was kinda like a clunky version of this game. "

When Microsoft does it, it will be the operating system, Your desktop will be your home and all the storage will be holographic and arranged in 3D rooms and corridors. You will have trash cans all over. Your Sims will be on your local computer.

If Second Life was being built as an operating system, then MS would be very interested.



Sun Micro in development
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZcJOZC38iQ

MS not inovative?

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilpPIafyTtg&feature=related

I knew that link would be about "surface".

Cool concept. And I really hope it does become as affordable as a PC.

Microsoft has probably looked at SL and thought "Wow. There's NO way we can push this onto a corporation".

I think MS & Apple has bigger fish to fry. SL is so low on their radar it barely registers. I'm sure they're keeping an eye on it just in case, but I severely doubt they have a single interest in it.

Well, at least till they'd find a way to charge home users & corporations alot of money for it.

Vista Service Pack 1, to clear up a few bug fixes - nearly 500 Mb to download.