How will the newly applied VAT tax affect you?

This is a simple poll about how you plan to react to this new tax being applied. You don't have to be one of those directly affected to reply as this change could affect everyone.

cash out and leave, wait for 3rd life as nothing can be ran more incompitence then how LL is doing it

OK, assuming prices don't fall in the next year (because that _would_ change the situation):

I have two premium accounts which I won't be upgrading in eleven months time.
I also have a mainland parcel which I'll hopefully be able to sell before I downgrade. (I'm not confident about land having much value after the server software is open sourced.)

If I still need land after that, I'll be looking at private estates.

Will wait and see how it affects me. I am glad I pay my premium monthly though, makes bailing out easier.

A few friends are cancelling their premium since it no longer/barely pays to have one (all L$500/week stipends) which leaves me short on tier for my mainland sandbox, so I'll probably just sell it.

For myself I haven't really decided yet, a yearly premium still won't cost me anything with the 20% VAT added and there's the support perk if I ever need a laugh so I'll probably hang on to mine.

My two rentals are US-owned so I guess other than loosing my sandbox land, I'm not affected.

LOL rather a one sided poll. Where are the "I'm not affected by the VAT" choices? *skews the results by picking one at random*

We're "The Minority". Remember?

Just seen this on a blog post and it kind of accurately surmises what might happen;

So………

LL increase charges to Europeans by 17.5% - Europeans leave game -

* LL then loses all their [Europeans] subscrption money
* Europeans sell off their land driving down LL’s auction land sale
* LL loses all the Europeans’ tier payments
* Rents and land prices fall through he floor.
* LL loses income from all non-European players as they tier down or sell off due to above
* Non-Europeans downgrade membership because of above - LL lose more income

Hmm, how long till the penny drops with LL? Big price to pay for moving your billing for a few bucks more.





For my part I have owned land that I've rented out to any resident at cost or no more than 3% so they have a place to live and create. Overnight LL have wiped that out and I will be shutting up shop as soon as I see a reply from them. I have now calmed down from my initial anger but I still think that the way LL have handled this is beyond the worse customer service that I have encountered in my entire life. For all you non-Europeans imagine going to bed last night and waking up this morning and being told SL is now @ 20% more expensive and we are back dating that charge so it applies to your current tier payment schedule.





When they moved billing somebody must have known this was a possibility, but were we told? If nobody knew this was going to happen then you have to ask yourself why you are investing so much money in a game controlled by some of the worst rank business incompetence ever known. Please, please Google/eBay take over LL and show them how to run an online company. The original ethos has long since gone and if it's going to be a corporate business then let a corporate business run it who have some idea of a basic standard of customer service.

well considering the US is at the top of every usage list, I dont see how we are the minority. Which country is higher? (And remember Europe is not a country..)

Wish there was a pie option


Especially since the OP states you don't have to be affected by the change to respond

For those who are tiering down, I wouldn't mind hearing, if you don't mind saying, how many m2 you were at and how many you're planning on going to.

lol, I thought about adding that option but figured since the poll was essentially about the VAT tax that those of us not affected by it would only be interested in the responses of those who are. I'm trying to get a sense of whether there is a large scale land dump on the horizon. (THAT would certainly affect us)

It could be however that more people consider SL purely entertainment and they don't care about a tax. I guess we will see.

Because everybody is affected. 100% of my tenants are non-Europeans but they will have to bear a 17.5% increase in rent if they want to stay on. Many Europeans will sell off their land driving land prices down so non- Europeans will see the value of their land drop dramatically. This will mean landlords lowering their rents which will cause some to sell up (further lowering land price) tiering down, or downgrading membership, which means LL will lose income and their only recourse to get the money back will be to raise your membership fee.

The analogy of the butterfly flapping it's wing in the amazon causing a hurricane somewhere in the world comes to mind.

[EDIT]

Tiering down to compensate the increased charge only works if you are in it for only pleasure. If you are owning land for non-profit or profit renting then you can no longer compete on price because everybody else has a 17.5% edge on you. If you own an island then tiering down is not an option at all.

I think once everyone affected gets over the initial shock and have finished venting their anger in the forums, business will continue as usual. No one ever really leaves SL afterall, atleast not in any number that would be crippling to LL.

Also I only use my land for fun and entertainment, so the property values could go to zero and it would not affect me.

1 island

That is true, but there was no option for that either. The OP says they want to see if there is going to be large scale dumping, but if you only ask people who are going to dump, well, guess what results you end up with.

Same effect as the VAT has everyplace in RL. It's a regressive sales tax that discourages consumption, hits the least affluent the hardest because they have to make real sacrifices when they have to cut back their buying because of it, and puts a drag on the economy. It will obviously hurt SL too. But don't worry if you're going to be paying VAT here - it goes to help pay for all those wonderful social programs you have in Europe. Be happy. You are happy, right?

For those of you in the US, the VAT (value added tax) is essentially a sales tax, but levied at the manufacturer's or wholesaler's level and built into the price charged the retailer, not levied at the retail level and charged separately from the purchase like here, so the end consumer never sees the VAT - it looks like the greedy manufacturers and shopowners are squeezing them, not the politicians and their government. Imagine it - a stealth 17.5% sales tax!

That's right, Europe. In the US, when we pay a sales tax, we know we're paying a sales tax at the moment we pay it. And you don't, really, because out of sight, out of mind. TO THE BARRICADES!

Why is every thread on this matter getting derailed by the comparitive tax debate. "It's not about that". It's the fact it was foisted upon us with no warning (even though LL knew they would be imposing it while selling subcription and islands at pre-tax prices) giving us no chance to argue the reasonableness of it or planning an exit strategy.

For the record I don't mind paying taxes that mean my friends, family or myself have "FREE" healthcare whatever ailment is afflicting them. I can't count the number of US friends I have who are foregoing medical treatment and drugs they need so that they can afford to eat that week.

There really are two issues, the Taxitself which I guess is a fact of life, and LL's handling of this. Was this brought on by LL's moving certain operations overseas? If so, did they understand the consequences of the action, and if so why didn't they give a heads up to the people it would affect? I agree the comparing social safety nets debate should be left out of the debate.

let me get this straight..... LL should break the law for some, LL has to change the VAT is their fault....

That's the part of the argument I'm not fully buying. Was it brought on because LL moved billing to the UK? Or was in inevitable because LL is providing a service over European data lines in Europe to Europeans?

No. Businesses outside the EU have to pay VAT to EU countries if they sell digital wares or services to EU citizens. It's the same as the import taxes on tangible wares. LL always had to add the VAT for EU customers but never did until now.

That's the reason. LL exports wares to the EU, the customer has to pay the import tax / VAT. Doesn't matter that the wares are digital. Guys in Brussels thought that out 7 years ago.

Exactly Brenda. I bought my latest island 5 days ago and it was delivered in record time. Can I be blamed for being cynical? Would I have bought it knowing this was coming? No! Would LL reach the same conclusion? Yes! So was I duped/conned/defrauded? Well if LL would tell everyone when they were first made aware of "their" tax liablitiy as regards EU VAT payments then we can see if LL have been deliberately misselling their service. But they seem to be keeping very quiet. My own pro bono legal advice from a friend says that I need to know when the management of the LL were first made aware of this tax duty. If they don't tell us then under the Freedom of Information Act in the UK I will ask HM Customs & Excise when they told LL they had to pay up. Either way I will get an answer soon enough. I'm just wondering if LL have the cajones to own up.

not enough poll choices. I'm affected by VAT, but own no mainland or private islands. I only rent my land so only my premium membership is affected by VAT.

And in actuality, I have a business so I have a VAT ID. In reality, VAT won't really change a thing for me at all.