Temp Rezzers - use/misuse?

I've read a lot about this subject here in the forums but have not seen a definitive answer. What use, other than for some temporary effect or demonstation, is proper for temp rezzing? What is the current policy on the use of temp rezzing systems? Are they permitted for, say, building your house.

An example:
I have some new neighbors with a 512 lot (we are mainland, pseudo-beachfront). They have the standard 117 prims to work with. Currently they are using 90 prims of the available 117. However, they are temp rezzing some 240 prims for their furnished house, landscaping, waves, etc.. They also built a skybox shop that uses another 120 temp rezzed prims. Every 55 seconds all the temp prims refresh/reload.

Is this proper use or not?

I've taken out some landscaping on my lot near that neighbor because I found myself lagging when I was in that area. "Too many complex objects in view" or "images loading" with a client framerate of under 10.

What is proper use and what is abuse, and what do you do (if anything) about it.

They're basically tripling their prims with the temp rezzers...that seems excessive to me. Have you talked to the neighbors about the lag situation? That's usually the first step. If you get nowhere with them, I'd suggest submitting a support ticket asking a Linden to come out and make a definitive decision, rather than abuse reporting it.

If you're on an estate, rather than mainland, talk to the sim owner or estate manager instead of filing a ticket.

despite what one particular member on this board may suggest, that is not a proper use of temp rez. if you report this to LL i have no doubt they will return the temp rez objects to their owner along with an 'unoffical' warning not to do it again.

wow ..

So they are using 470 prims all the time basically

But paying for 117

Not to mention any difficulties with the rerezzing stuff over and over.

I have not spoken to them about it yet. I want to be sure of my data and facts before approaching them. I really don't want to cause anybody any trouble, and I don't want to find banlines up all of the sudden in my view. When I pull up the stats everything looks fine server-wise but my personal FPS goes down the pipe to under 10 near that rezzing house. Sometimes it take a bit for it to rez back and I see their stuff floating there in the air.

What I need to know is if there is any official policy on this kind of thing. If not, there should be. If it's OK then it's OK and I'll have to live with it. If it is not OK... I have something to say to the neighbors.

I've read those embittered threads on this topic but they've only helped to confuse the matter for me. That's why I asked here. I personally think that the knowledge base should contain something on this matter, some basic guidelines. If it did I could point my neighbors at that if they balked. As it stands now, it is really an opinion thing. :/

At least 350. I can't find the 90 prims, standalone. I am going by the "about land" report.

I do know that they have a 24 prim fireplace. Must be nice.

Related to the OPs question if you file an AR against them does SL reveal the source of the AR?

If they do, I would file a general trouble ticket against the SIM reporting that you are experiencing excessive lag but you are unable to discover the source. Let SL investigate.

From what you describe IMHO is some form of abuse of the system.

"CX"

Please, do NOT use temp rezzers, rezzing/derezzing objects constantly makes the WHOLE sim unstable. And they use the whole sim prim amount, so other parcels can lack of prims because of it.

Please don't use this if you wanta a better second life.

LL limited temp-prims on a single sim to 500 or so, that would limit the server loading (in general) but hell the lag problem remains, temp rezzers (and continuous rezzing) lags as hell, i were forced to use two on my sim (because of prims) until my new sim will be set on, and that's the max acceptable since for these two pieces the whole sim degratation is already noticiable.

This is common knowledge at this point.

What the OP was asking if its acceptable or against TOS.

whats not common knowledge at this point is that if youre experiencing lag when you go near this location, its lag on your end experienced by what your viewer is rendering.
if temp rezzers are causing lag for the sim, it will lag the entire aim area, not just a single area.

This may make it a little tougher to get resolved, because the ToS is pretty explicit about misusing sim resources. Still, an AR might work. It seems very likely that it's the temp-rezzing itself that's causing the client-side lag (I mean, the mechanism for it to do that is certainly there), but it is also possible that you'd see much of that frame rate reduction just looking at a statically rezzed version of those prims. So, it's not the clearest case, despite the high ratio of temp to static objects. And there's no real guidelines restricting temp-rezzing, AFAIK, other than it shouldn't lag the sim. (The actual technical limits for temp-rezzing are set absurdly high--I guess obviously.)

You pretty much answered your own question with that statement. There are different opinions about the use of temp rezzers, but they are not against the ToS.

One argument against their use is that they use other people's prims, but that won't be for much longer. In the near future, temp prims won't count against a sim's 15,000 prims.

I would just talk to your neighbours. Dont demand anything or accuse. Just make sure they are aware that it is causing you a couple of issues, and let them know of the possible effects of temp rezzers. try to get a good relationship with them.
Not everyone is aware of the problems they can cause if they are misused. Ask them if the would mind reducing the use a bit, just to see if it makes things better.
You never know, it might not be the rezzers - unlikely, but possible.

I dont see it as being against the ToS or anything, you said it wasn't impacting server performance. But I do think this is a misuse of the rezzers.

Anyway, it's your call. Opinions differ, but that is all they are...opinions. You will have to form your own based on the facts and on others.

I know. It might just be my viewer. It could be that there are too many prims confined in too small an area, extra large prims, or whatever.

Hmmm. Is anyone here willing to stop by my place and see if they experience any lag issues or stats bar stuff and nothings? That might answer some things.

Can you elaborate on how you know this Phil?

Not being inflammatory - there will still be some form of limiter involved. Resources aren't infinite after all. I am curious to know how this works as technically speaking if that's the case everyone could have smaller plots of land, temp rez anything they like, etc.

It's in the Havok4 server, and was in the blog.

http://blog.secondlife.com/2008/03/07/havok4-early-adopter-update-rc0-of-the-new-second-life-simulator-with-15-fixes-2008-03-07/#more-1710

Scroll right down to very near the bottom of the blog post.

"SVC-1066: Temp prims no longer count towards region prim limits"

Presumably, the limiter will continue to be the formula.

I'd probably still try the support ticket. Not like, "zomg, the evil neighbors are taking over the region with their temp rezzers! ," but something more along the lines of, you'd noticed they had x-number of prims on their 512m parcel, y-number of which were being supported by temp rezzers, and you were wondering if you should be concerned.

I stopped over and looked around a bit. To be honest, I'm not really seeing much lag at all, client- or server-side. There's a pretty extreme sporadic spike in server lag, apparently almost totally attributable to "Net Time", but it's not the usual "heartbeat" lag of temp-rezzers re-rezzing, and is way less frequent than the temp-rez interval. (No idea what that is, but when it hits, it feels like walking in molasses.) Being a Mainland sim, though, and being Net Time, the origin could even be in a neighboring sim.

(I must say, , that is perhaps the ugliest aquarium in SL, made extra annoying to all neighbors by emitting light--and doubly so when the temp-rezzed prims overlap in time.)

Thanks for checking it out. I appreciate it.

Yes, I agree about the aquarium. I see that light every night... and that wall. *shakes head*. Ugly house to waste so much effort on, really.

The aquarium, I think, is a freebie that tunes radio stations and has a built-in television too. I am not sure.

One of the scripting wiki's discussed some of the legitimate uses for temp-on-rez, such as objects that it was desireable for them to have a short life. Such as bullets sprayed from a gun. I use temp-on-rez for my Attack Sharks, Pirate Ghost Attack and other objects that attack avatars when they come too close. I do this so the attack objects have a short life and will delete themselves if they wander off.

One thing I don't understand here is the use of a temp rezzer can be reported with an AR? I know someone right now who sells these incredibly high prim statues of dragons WITH a temp rezzer setup. I mean when you buy it and rez it in world you get a box ready to temp rez this enormous dragon.

He's a smart man, I would really be surprised if he was doing this knowing it's against the TOS?

I know another person, equally smart, who sells builds with multiple groups of flowers temp rezzed. He even advertises that the total prim is less because of these temp rezzed flowers. I'd be equally shocked that he's doing this with full knowledge that it's against TOS?

It's a matter of degrees. Temp rezzers aren't against TOS, the OP was just trying to determine what's acceptable use and what isn't. If temp rezzers are being used to the point where they significantly degrade sim performance, then LL will probably step in and do something about it.

Well I just again stumbled over a problem on one of my SIMs that I blame on a running temp rezzer. Accurately every 60 seconds SIM FPS go down to approx 30, time dilation to 0.60 and below for a second or two. Now if I imagine not one but a pack of those things running - ewww.