Second Life Forums Archive - Take 15,000 Linden .... and run

Abba Thiebaud

PerPetUal NoOb

Join date: 20 Aug 2006

Posts: 563

05-01-2008 11:48

From: Theodora Duke

The post wasn't about idiot Germans or any other racist remark. It was about lousy customer service no matter what language. There are idiot Americans, British, etc. out there, and plenty of them.

SL seems to be more and more populated by mediocre people of low ethical standing - a high percentage of whom are in for the quick buck and will stop at nothing to get it. And the only solution being offered is to behave as unethical as they are, by selling a "fix" and undermining other businesses? Puh-leeze!

Why are we being punished for asking for simple courtesy from someone we gave a large amount of money to? If you're going to conduct business, in RL or SL, you'd better be prepared to give people what they pay for. And if there is a problem, that means communication at the very least.

Scripters tend to be airheads in the first place, in my experience, and I understand a delay in a fix. But rudeness, deceit, non-communication and unethical behavior in any business are unacceptable; and it doesn't matter if it's SL or RL, or what language a person uses.

Too bad so many of you are so easily mollified by sloppy work and mediocre service.

Ok, next time you buy a brand-spanking new car, drive it off the lot. Enjoy it for a few days. Then have an idiot bang up a fender. Try to get the dealer to fix it for free.

If they do it, I'll give you $15,000L (or roughly $56US). If they decide to do it for free, I can guarantee you spent more than that in making them do it.

It's not about lousy service from the object creator. Its about lousy service from the platform provider. It's also about understanding who is at fault for the problem.

Scripters are a dime a dozen. Good scripters are rare. If you've had bad service from a dime-a-dozen scripter and you paint all scripters as bad because of it, you're no better than someone who, say, references a nationality when disparaging a person. It's called stereotyping.

A.

_____________________

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FD Spark

Prim & Texture Doodler

Join date: 30 Oct 2006

Posts: 4,697

05-01-2008 11:51

You can leave comments and feed back in the SLX product good, even bad, and you can tell people what happen and how you fixed it because no one else would help.
If I remember right its not against the TOS there.

_____________________

Look for my alt Dagon Xanith on Youtube.com

Newest video is

Loneliness by Duo Zikr DX's Alts & SL Art Death of Avatar

Kitty Barnett

Registered User

Join date: 10 May 2006

Posts: 5,586

05-01-2008 12:00

From: ArchTx Edo

I agree, the Lindens broke it, not the product creator. It isn't the product creators responsibility to fix something LL broke, nor is it even possible in some cases.

It all depends on why it broke.

As a practical example: sculptmaps

The fact that the alpha layer isn't currently used but is shown in the texture preview dialog led to people using it as a watermark even though it was never intended or designed to be used in that fashion.

If LL suddenly decides to use alpha for something and breaks watermarked sculptmaps in the process, that's not their fault, it's the fault of people who used a flaw or oversight to their own advantage. You know for a fact that it's risky and prone to failure at some point in the future so you have to take responsability for creating something you knew could break.

Back to the item in question: if the script did nothing out of the ordinary then you can lay the fault with LL, if the script used bugs or unintended behaviour to accomplish whatever it did, the fault lies with the creator.

Theodora Duke

Registered User

Join date: 27 Feb 2006

Posts: 3

Off Topic, but let's respond anyhow . . .

05-01-2008 12:01

I would remind you that the same dealer would probably not continue to offer a car with a banged up fender for sale for the same price; nor would they offer that you just slip the money into their mail box and drive away in a car that they knew to be defective; at least not one with any kind of ethics. Which IS the point.

I did say, 'in my experience', knowing someone would take offense on all scripters' behalf. However, as for quality controls on scripters - who appoints these druids after all? As a matter of fact, no one; as we discovered for ourselves a year ago, they're self appointed druids shrouded in their own mystique. Yes, dime-a-dozen; no, rarely a great one.

The point of this thread is long gone and has turned into a flame war. I am done with trying to get average people to understand what extraordinary is supposed to be.

Amity Slade

Registered User

Join date: 14 Feb 2007

Posts: 2,183

05-01-2008 13:19

I think if you're a scripter merchant selling expensive scripts, you have a duty to keep up-to-date on the changes and potential changes that Second Life revisions have on the products that you sell, and notify customers accordingly.

Of course, since Second Life has no means of dispute resolution for these kinds of issues, there's nothing that a consumer can do about it.

Second Life provides a fertile ground for rip-off artists. Whether the particular merchants who are the subject of the OP's complaint are rip-off artists intended to act fraudulently or not, I don't know.

However, it would just be so easy for so many script merchants to make one last ditch to sell as many of their scripts as they could, for as much as they could, before those scripts became obsolete.

In the short term, it's more profitable and easier than updating the scripts or warning consumers that the scripts will be obsolete.

In the long term, the script merchants could come back with alts to sell updated versions of their scripts. And heck, a nice long list of the people who paid for the scripts that are now unusuable is a perfect marketing tool for the new scripts.

Scott Tureaud

market base?

Join date: 7 Jun 2007

Posts: 224

05-01-2008 13:28

it's the end of semester for a lot of colleges, lots a people could care less about what's happening to their products.

shame on lindens for their bad timing.

Take 15,000 Linden .... and run
Abba Thiebaud PerPetUal NoOb Join date: 20 Aug 2006 Posts: 563	05-01-2008 11:48 From: Theodora Duke The post wasn't about idiot Germans or any other racist remark. It was about lousy customer service no matter what language. There are idiot Americans, British, etc. out there, and plenty of them. SL seems to be more and more populated by mediocre people of low ethical standing - a high percentage of whom are in for the quick buck and will stop at nothing to get it. And the only solution being offered is to behave as unethical as they are, by selling a "fix" and undermining other businesses? Puh-leeze! Why are we being punished for asking for simple courtesy from someone we gave a large amount of money to? If you're going to conduct business, in RL or SL, you'd better be prepared to give people what they pay for. And if there is a problem, that means communication at the very least. Scripters tend to be airheads in the first place, in my experience, and I understand a delay in a fix. But rudeness, deceit, non-communication and unethical behavior in any business are unacceptable; and it doesn't matter if it's SL or RL, or what language a person uses. Too bad so many of you are so easily mollified by sloppy work and mediocre service. Ok, next time you buy a brand-spanking new car, drive it off the lot. Enjoy it for a few days. Then have an idiot bang up a fender. Try to get the dealer to fix it for free. If they do it, I'll give you $15,000L (or roughly $56US). If they decide to do it for free, I can guarantee you spent more than that in making them do it. It's not about lousy service from the object creator. Its about lousy service from the platform provider. It's also about understanding who is at fault for the problem. Scripters are a dime a dozen. Good scripters are rare. If you've had bad service from a dime-a-dozen scripter and you paint all scripters as bad because of it, you're no better than someone who, say, references a nationality when disparaging a person. It's called stereotyping. A. _____________________ http://www.ponystars.com/abbathiebaud Pony Up.
FD Spark Prim & Texture Doodler Join date: 30 Oct 2006 Posts: 4,697	05-01-2008 11:51 You can leave comments and feed back in the SLX product good, even bad, and you can tell people what happen and how you fixed it because no one else would help. If I remember right its not against the TOS there. _____________________ Look for my alt Dagon Xanith on Youtube.com Newest video is Loneliness by Duo Zikr DX's Alts & SL Art Death of Avatar
Kitty Barnett Registered User Join date: 10 May 2006 Posts: 5,586	05-01-2008 12:00 From: ArchTx Edo I agree, the Lindens broke it, not the product creator. It isn't the product creators responsibility to fix something LL broke, nor is it even possible in some cases. It all depends on why it broke. As a practical example: sculptmaps The fact that the alpha layer isn't currently used but is shown in the texture preview dialog led to people using it as a watermark even though it was never intended or designed to be used in that fashion. If LL suddenly decides to use alpha for something and breaks watermarked sculptmaps in the process, that's not their fault, it's the fault of people who used a flaw or oversight to their own advantage. You know for a fact that it's risky and prone to failure at some point in the future so you have to take responsability for creating something you knew could break. Back to the item in question: if the script did nothing out of the ordinary then you can lay the fault with LL, if the script used bugs or unintended behaviour to accomplish whatever it did, the fault lies with the creator.
Theodora Duke Registered User Join date: 27 Feb 2006 Posts: 3	Off Topic, but let's respond anyhow . . . 05-01-2008 12:01 I would remind you that the same dealer would probably not continue to offer a car with a banged up fender for sale for the same price; nor would they offer that you just slip the money into their mail box and drive away in a car that they knew to be defective; at least not one with any kind of ethics. Which IS the point. I did say, 'in my experience', knowing someone would take offense on all scripters' behalf. However, as for quality controls on scripters - who appoints these druids after all? As a matter of fact, no one; as we discovered for ourselves a year ago, they're self appointed druids shrouded in their own mystique. Yes, dime-a-dozen; no, rarely a great one. The point of this thread is long gone and has turned into a flame war. I am done with trying to get average people to understand what extraordinary is supposed to be.
Amity Slade Registered User Join date: 14 Feb 2007 Posts: 2,183	05-01-2008 13:19 I think if you're a scripter merchant selling expensive scripts, you have a duty to keep up-to-date on the changes and potential changes that Second Life revisions have on the products that you sell, and notify customers accordingly. Of course, since Second Life has no means of dispute resolution for these kinds of issues, there's nothing that a consumer can do about it. Second Life provides a fertile ground for rip-off artists. Whether the particular merchants who are the subject of the OP's complaint are rip-off artists intended to act fraudulently or not, I don't know. However, it would just be so easy for so many script merchants to make one last ditch to sell as many of their scripts as they could, for as much as they could, before those scripts became obsolete. In the short term, it's more profitable and easier than updating the scripts or warning consumers that the scripts will be obsolete. In the long term, the script merchants could come back with alts to sell updated versions of their scripts. And heck, a nice long list of the people who paid for the scripts that are now unusuable is a perfect marketing tool for the new scripts.
Scott Tureaud market base? Join date: 7 Jun 2007 Posts: 224	05-01-2008 13:28 it's the end of semester for a lot of colleges, lots a people could care less about what's happening to their products. shame on lindens for their bad timing.

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