Very new to SL

I always recommend people wanting to start programming should just dive in and start doing it. Particularly in SL where it's so easy, reliable, and predictable.

(no, I'm not being sarcastic, I started in assembly language, on punch cards, which I had to punch myself with a sharp stick)

(yes, really, I am not making this up)

(OMG, here's the machine I was working on! http://www.oldcalculatormuseum.com/canon164p.html#)

I "first" read that as STRIPPING class.

Jim Gustafson used to teach scripting for ^ASL^ (Academy of Second life - which has since closed). His classes are excellent and he now teaches freelance. I see his classes sometimes listed in Events - Education, but if you check his inworld profile if may give more info. He used to have a group to join as well that would notify members of when/where he was teaching.

NCI used to have a series of scripting classes that began from the basics and advanced with each session, so may want to check that out as well.

ETA: Torley Linden recommended this site in one of his video tutorials: http://www.3greeneggs.com/autoscript/

It is a clever website that allows one to fill in the blanks on what they wish their script to do and it automatically creates the script. I have not personally used it, but it looks interesting.

For some of us scripting, regardless of how easy lsl may or may not be is not as intuitive a skill. As in your quote above, you had some prior experience/knowledge.

I have now taken quite a few scripting classes, one from a Master Scriptor that hurt my brain. (Just because someone knows how to do something doesn't make them a good instructor.)

I am now at the point where I can fiddle with a pre-existing script a bit - I know how to modify colors and things of that nature or if a script is "off" somehow I can usually troubleshoot one. But writing anything of note from scratch - if I needed something major I'd hire a scriptor.

This.

Might as well try to teach myself Sanskrit.

I'll put it in a different light... anyone that can cut an paste javascript for web pages can script in LSL..... but the only way to learn is to read up an play with it, which does take time. having a math background at least up to the level of trigonometry helps (but isn't required... basic pre algebra is what I'd consider the cut-off) and a quick understanding of counting in base2. after that experimentation and seeing how others do it will teach you almost every trick imaginable.

programming (or scripting) in any language is very precise though, so requires a lot of attention to details, so you either have to be a masochist of have a particular mindset to want to do it on a regular basis (and if you have both, all the better). grammar nazi's are especially suited to the task, as are people that are willing to explain in every fine detail how something is done, with myriad comparisons, until even a 3yo understands.

Javascript? Trigonometry? Nein.

Scripting is a language. You cannot ask someone who is totally unfamiliar with a language to pick up a book and teach it to themselves. What they come up with will be their own invention approaching some distant cousin of that language, but it won't be the language itself. Said another way, what are you guys talking about, someone with no background can teach themselves?

Monkeys banging on Underwoods can eventually write Shakespeare? Maybe, but why waste time finding out?

I'll ask again - does anyone know of some good scripting classes? LOL. Thanks.

heh, nah, because computers are very picky... if you don't do it exactly their way, they just don't listen (and basicly say "huh?" when you get it wrong... only they use words that don't make sense like "syntax error"... but it all means "I don't get it"

as for classes, NCI used to do some that I hear were decent, and I occasionally pick up tutoring jobs (translation, pay me, real cash, or the L$ equivalent, which is pretty high) the forum people are helpful once you get to writing stuff, and the LSL Portal is good for reference to know how each function works (use the categories to find the functions that work on things you want to affect)

This is from my previous post but who I highly recommend from whom to learn scripting:

Couple of things.

First, I think you're misunderstanding my comments about assembly language. I taught myself programming with nothing but the computer manual, back in the days when there weren't "Fortran for dummies" books all over the place, and the only computer I had available was so primitive it only allowed branches to addresses that were a multiple of 10. It took me quite a while to become a GOOD programmer, but it doesn't seem reasonable to me that it should be so hard to start from scratch today given a language as safe and expressive as LSL or Javascript.

Second, programming languages are not languages in the human sense. They are all more similar to each other than any of them are to human language... even the tortured pseudo-algorithmic bureaucratese that human laws and rules are written in. Once you know any kind of programming language, learning another is not a great step.

If you're having difficulty making that first step in LSL, then step away from SL and look up a class in a community college on Java or Javascript or C++ or C# or ... well, anything. Get the fundamental understanding of programming itself under your belt, and then come back to LSL.

I don't feel like reading all the pages right now, in case no one mentioned yet, I great place to go, specially (but not exclusivelly) if you're a newbie, is the Shelther, on the sim Isabel (I don't got a SLURL at hand right now)

and a good place to start learning stuff is New Citizens Inc (I don't remember the name of the sim, they have more than one place I believe)

Argent - I don't think I mistook your post. I saw no ill intent in it. It's a bit frustrating, though, because you are basically saying people can teach themselves programming. Maybe some people can. Also, not everyone has the same foundation you've had.

Not sure whether you've considered your (city college/learn other script languages first) recommendation may be highly impractical or even impossible for some of us, either. Also I don't have years for that, before I can begin to create in SL.

Also I disagree that computer code isn't a language. But then I think math is a language, too.



Yes exactly. *I never said they were like speaking human languages, I said they were their own language.* So this would be like dropping me on Mars where everyone spoke in 0 and 1 and expecting me to get my bearings. I'm not saying it's impossible but why do things the hardest way? What's wrong in having a teacher?

I'm not sure why you don't want to recommend LSL classes, so I've tried to address what you did say.

It's a bit frustrating, because you don't seem to understand I have *no clue* what you are talking about. I didn't pick Sanskrit out of the air as an analogy.

But you also seem to be assuming how I learn. And I think it isn't the same way as you learn.

I didn't have the same foundation I have now when I started back in the '70s.

I'm not so much saying that everyone can teach themselves programming, but rather that anyone can teach themselves a new programming language. That if they need help learning programming they may be more successful if they concentrate on the "learning programming" part, not the "learning LSL" part.

It won't take years... or if it DOES take years, then so would learning to program in LSL. Scripting, programming, whatever you call it, requires a certain approach, or mindset, or SOMETHING, and until you get that you're not going to be effective no matter what the "language".

You and Larry Wall. That's one of the biggest problems with Perl - Larry Wall was a linguist first, and most of the problems with Perl are caused by his attempt to apply linguistics to programming.

If you can find good LSL classes that get out over the basic hump, that's great, but the odds are far greater that you'll get a GOOD class in a language that's being used by millions of people than one that's used by thousands. It's an approach you should at least consider.

I did consider your suggestion (real world classes), Argent. You seem to be missing key points. But I don't want to go into RL so I will leave out further explanation.

(I'm not sure why it would be true that simply because more people use C++ or whatever, the teacher would be better; also there's a ratio going here. SL general population, vs. proficiency in LSL, vs. the world's general population & proficiency in regular programming. Which has more programmers by ratio? But that still assumes that total # of users has something to do with the teacher's proficiency, communication skills, or talent. I see no automatic correlation there. Or at least, that's unproven.)

I get your point about it requiring a scripting background. (The bit about your studying for decades. And by the way you're still assuming that because you taught yourself, I can.) All I know is a lot of people have said they learned LSL and had no scripting background. It doesn't mean I turn up my nose at serious or real scripting. I have run into others who laugh at us tinkering around with LSL. I get it.

But, why do you (seemingly, anyway) read into my posts that I assume scripting is easy? It's just the opposite, which is why I'd like a teacher. I'm not discounting the 'serious' or 'real' scripters whatsoever. I simply want to learn enough to make some basic scripts in Second Life.



You seem hung up on that word. I don't mean it quite the way you seem to have interpreted. I'm not saying it's like speaking French. I'm not going to go around talking in ones and zeroes. It's closer to what you've just said, above - it's its own frame of reference and context and way of thinking. Kind of like, I need to learn how scripts think, if that makes a clearer analogy. Put another way - if you knew even that you should punch holes in a card, and why, and what the goal was, you knew miles more than I would've. Applying that to today's context. I'd have been jabbing at it blindly with no clue why I was doing so. I could've as easily been playing Bingo.



I've heard of Perl but that's all. I don't know what Perl is. I don't have any clue who Larry Wall is.

I'm not going to try to apply one frame to a new context. I'm comparing it to learning a new language as an analogy. I'm not going to apply linguistics to computer code or programming or scripting or LSL. I respect it in its own unique right.

oh and btw, I do appreciate all the answers given on this question, so thanks all.

That's why I suggested you take classes?

No, really, I got that.

I'm not laughing at anything. LSL is a very expressive language, well designed for the SL environment, it's not "lesser" than C++ or Javascript.

I don't know why, because I didn't think I had.

I get that. I'm just suggesting that you might find it easier or you might find better classes. It's something you should consider.

Sorry, there are people (eg, Larry Wall) who literally DO mean that programming languages are (or should be) similar to human languages. I thought you were referring to that school of thought.

Nixie tubes! *shudders*

At the risk of being too blunt: If you're not willing (or able) to learn the fundamentals of programming in general, and cannot devote a considerable amount of time toward practice, then you're not going to get much beyond "Hello World" before you give up in frustration. A computer programming language is not something that one can learn and perfect through a few simple tutorials. You *really* need to learn and understand the fundamentals of how computer programs flow before you can begin understanding any specific language. Argent is correct: You really need to take a formal course in programming fundamentals and maybe one object-oriented language like Java if you want to be able to get the most out of LSL.

I have a fairly decent programming background, but it still took me going through a college-level Java programming class before I really "got" LSL and I was able to script my own lightbulbs, switches, timers, doorbells, and windowblind controllers for my houses - but I am still not an LSL expert by any stretch of the imagination.

I love nixie tubes. I've made a clock and a set of scales in SL with nixie tube displays.

I'll second Argents suggestion of learning javascript... because there are LOTS of sites out there that do wonderful FREE tutorials on using it, and the background logic in how programs are put together makes it very applicable to coding in lsl. (http://www.webmonkey.com/tutorial/tag/programming has a few good starter ones). as an added bonus you'll be able to use what you've learned to make webpages, or tweak the pages you have)

Okay looking at my original post I now see why some of the confusion. I did not specify which type of scripting, or where.

But to repeat - city college/outside classes are not practical, or ideal, for everyone. (LL agrees with me - see how it's bringing colleges in world.) It also isn't *necessary.* (There are teachers in SL.)

And to repeat what I have said in the past on the forums (and which I don't expect anyone to remember) I do not learn well on my own or from tutorials. It is not an excuse, so save the lectures (all those do is make me take a few minutes break while I fume) - it's a fact.

If I could've learned on my own by now, I would've. I don't even have my own web page. Call it mental block if you want. But there are these marvelous things, called teachers...

I'm not going to go into RL and I'm not going to go back and do tit for tat on all teh miscommunications, or try to quote-prove and so on. Waste of time. And I do appreciate any attempt to help, even if it wasn't what I wanted.

So let me rephrase my question. Would someone PLEASE point me to a person in Second Life who's willing and patient, who would try to teach me some basic LSL scripts? I never said I wanted to become the next great in LSL. I want to learn some basic scripts and basics OF scripting, so I can sell things in SL eventually.

I know it may not be kosher or usual, but that's how I learn. I (obviously) can't just "dive in and do it" without any background whatsoever, but I am very intuitive and I learn quickly. I just do not do it well without a bit of guidance in the beginning. Maybe it's latent perfectionism; I like to know right away when I'm headed in the wrong direction. It's also more efficient.

That's hardly freakish. So please, if no one wants to pass along the name of a teacher, please, don't post the lectures either. However 'well meaning.' Thanks. Oh and again, *I never said that it was easy or that I expected to not work hard.*