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Insulting or not?

Steely Carver
The dreamer or the dream?
Join date: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 515
07-25-2008 16:39
From: Kyllie Wylie
*note my tounge is firmly planted in my cheek*

Reading M.Linden's blog on his 2 month tenure and one statement caught my eye:

1. Second Life users are more mainstream than many assume. It’s not just tech-savvy early adopters or gamers. It’s a much broader cross-section of society with a median age in the early 30’s and nearly half the time spent in world is by women.



Err.. so he's saying women can't be tech savvy early adopters or gamers? I know i'm fairly new to SL, but I've been playing on line games since the mid 90's and build my own computers! Women can be Geeks too!!!!111!


Hmmm. Let's see. Half the people in RL are women. Half the people in SL are women.

Can't
Quite
Get
My
Head
Around
This
Concept!!!

:D

I guess he thinks women don't play computer games. Women don't play GTA or Quake Arena much, but women have been playing MMO's for ages.
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Lear Cale
wordy bugger
Join date: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 3,569
07-25-2008 16:45
From: 3Ring Binder
i think you are reading it wrong. they are saying that of all the residents, nearly half (49% or less) is women. it doesn't say what percentage of those women is techy or not techy, or which percentage is 30ish.

that means 51%+ is men, who may or may not dominate the techy part of the resident count. it is not clear enough to assume that either.

you can't hunt and peck the passages that suit you at any given time and twist them to fit a personal agenda. this is not the Bible. :p


You're reading it wrong too, 3Ring.

It means that:

- Half the people are 30's or older, the other half are 30's or younger.

- Nearly half the TIME spent in RL is by women. There could be twice as many men if the average women spends twice as much time in SL than the average man.

But you're right that it doesn't imply that they're not techy. In fact, his stats don't support his premise at all. If they're just additional stats, fine. If he's trying to use them to prove a point, he's missing the mark.
Steely Carver
The dreamer or the dream?
Join date: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 515
07-25-2008 16:47
From: Trout Recreant
My bad - I meant Mitch Kapor. I blanked on the name when i did the post. Mitch Kapor gave a keynote address at SL5B where he said that SL was made up of a bunch of marginalized outsiders. He said a lot of other, more interesting things as well, but that remark caught a bunch of flak. They are two different people.


If you are in SL and claiming that people in SL are marginalized outsiders, aren't you also implicating yourself?
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Trout Recreant
Public Enemy No. 1
Join date: 24 Jul 2007
Posts: 4,873
07-25-2008 16:51
From: Steely Carver
If you are in SL and claiming that people in SL are marginalized outsiders, aren't you also implicating yourself?


I'm not sure that occured to him. I think it was a case of foot in mouth syndrome. Someone should have vetted his speech for him.

As for me, I couldn't care less. Marginalized outsider, mainstream citizen, whatever. Nothing they say changes who I am.
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Cristalle Karami
Lady of the House
Join date: 4 Dec 2006
Posts: 6,222
07-25-2008 16:52
From: Steely Carver
Hmmm. Let's see. Half the people in RL are women. Half the people in SL are women.

Can't
Quite
Get
My
Head
Around
This
Concept!!!

:D

I guess he thinks women don't play computer games. Women don't play GTA or Quake Arena much, but women have been playing MMO's for ages.


The data says that women play SL, but the stereotype is that men living in mom's basement are the ones into games. I sincerely doubt that he believes the stereotype, but he has to put it out there because it makes SL look good. Hey, we've got WOMEN too!
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Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
07-25-2008 16:57
From: Cristalle Karami
The data says that women play SL, but the stereotype is that men living in mom's basement are the ones into games. I sincerely doubt that he believes the stereotype, but he has to put it out there because it makes SL look good. Hey, we've got WOMEN too!

Just the thing to bring more men who live in Mom's basement.... :rolleyes:
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
07-25-2008 17:04
From: Brenda Connolly
Just the thing to bring more men who live in Mom's basement.... :rolleyes:


Got em all already.

They are working on the attic over the garage types now.
Rhaorth Antonelli
Registered User
Join date: 15 Apr 2006
Posts: 7,425
07-25-2008 17:13
75% of all statistics are made up

and average age is 30's which means I am above average!! oh wait... is that a good thing in this case?
_____________________
From: someone
Morpheus Linden: But then I change avs pretty often too, so often, I look nothing like my avatar. :)


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Rhaorth Antonelli
Registered User
Join date: 15 Apr 2006
Posts: 7,425
07-25-2008 17:14
From: Trout Recreant

As for me, I couldn't care less. Marginalized outsider, mainstream citizen, whatever. Nothing they say changes who I am.


amen!
_____________________
From: someone
Morpheus Linden: But then I change avs pretty often too, so often, I look nothing like my avatar. :)


They are taking away the forums... it could be worse, they could be taking away the forums AND Second Life...
Steely Carver
The dreamer or the dream?
Join date: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 515
07-25-2008 17:22
From: Trout Recreant
I'm not sure that occured to him. I think it was a case of foot in mouth syndrome. Someone should have vetted his speech for him.

As for me, I couldn't care less. Marginalized outsider, mainstream citizen, whatever. Nothing they say changes who I am.


:D
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Liralyn Lyle
Registered User
Join date: 5 May 2008
Posts: 99
07-25-2008 23:21
From: Kyllie Wylie
*note my tounge is firmly planted in my cheek*

Reading M.Linden's blog on his 2 month tenure and one statement caught my eye:

1. Second Life users are more mainstream than many assume. It’s not just tech-savvy early adopters or gamers. It’s a much broader cross-section of society with a median age in the early 30’s and nearly half the time spent in world is by women.



Err.. so he's saying women can't be tech savvy early adopters or gamers? I know i'm fairly new to SL, but I've been playing on line games since the mid 90's and build my own computers! Women can be Geeks too!!!!111!


Female geek, too, but the fact hasn't escaped me that I'm usually a minority among my peers. My "peers" are usually delighted with my gender, so it's not been a problem in real life. My gender can result in annoyances in on-line games, probably because there are more adolescents than I encounter on-the-job. But what the heck, adolescents are generally annoying to all adults. There are exceptions, of course, just like there are exceptions to geeks being male.

So I don't fault M.Linden for the implied assumption that "tech-savvy early adopters or gamers" generally tend to be young males. It's probably accurate. As a "geek", I value accuracy more than warm fuzzies like being politically correct.

I do question his data about time spent in world by women. Unless he's referring to female avatars. He's right, if he's talking about female avatars. In on-line games generally, there a lot more real life males playing female characters than vice versa. While that pretty much refutes "penis envy" theories, it's not an accurate indicator at all about how many real life women are playing.
Cherry Czervik
Came To Her Senses
Join date: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 3,680
07-25-2008 23:46
I posted to that blog and my entry was not posted up. There was no profanity in it, no offence in it, but there were some observations about business practice in relation to my own experience in dot com land.

Hmmm.

Also the posts were numbered and cross referenced out of sequence.

I'll say here what I said there, in a nutshell - "Churn" might be over, but unless they pull their finger out in relation to Customer Support for the little people (yes, mighty estate owners, I include you Concierge people since you are just individuals not Corporate millions) then they can get in as many big spenders as they like, people simply won't stay.

Guess this was not a popular view.

PS - I think the stats for whether players are female or not stems from that annoying set of questions which popped up on login. WRONG AGAIN LL. What you are seeing there is that women are more likely to answer than men. Most men I know just closed the window.
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Cherry Czervik
Came To Her Senses
Join date: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 3,680
07-25-2008 23:55
From: Steely Carver
Hmmm. Let's see. Half the people in RL are women. Half the people in SL are women.

Can't
Quite
Get
My
Head
Around
This
Concept!!!

:D

I guess he thinks women don't play computer games. Women don't play GTA or Quake Arena much, but women have been playing MMO's for ages.


I realise I am not stereotypical. Never played ANY MMOs, didn't much enjoy Quake Arena (or any shooters online) but I do play GTA. Still prefer Vice City. Also love Half Life, Deus Ex ...
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FD Spark
Prim & Texture Doodler
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 4,697
07-26-2008 02:58
There is no way the can verify gender at login?
Do they ban people for not revealing their legal genders?
Just curious
My first guy wasn't tech savy and was born in 2003 nor does he have
same gender info he had then.
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Cherry Czervik
Came To Her Senses
Join date: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 3,680
07-26-2008 03:52
The account originally wasn't created with my payment details, and you can choose to change gender so, no. I think these stats are hogwash, based on the "Are you the same gender as your avatar".
_____________________
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FD Spark
Prim & Texture Doodler
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 4,697
07-26-2008 04:39
Gender thing for me needed to be changed but that is another story.
And it isn't really one else's business really unless it something I tell them but its not something I hide either at least in SL.
I really don't want to be marketing statistic when it comes to my gender personally.
There is more then two genders whether anyone wants to make it official is another story so it is easier to pick the easiest or the one the closely appear to be or define themselves as for most people, including myself.
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Newest video is

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Aleco Collas
Satyr
Join date: 10 May 2007
Posts: 1,463
07-26-2008 04:50
No, you're not banned if you don't reveal your true gender. Even the age verification is no proove, since it just checks if the number entered is a valid number. There are generators for german passport numbers and the number I entered for my female account with the female RL name was the one of my real, male, passport, so they aren't checked against the name.

The name did not even have to match the name of the credit card holder.

cu
Aleco
Cherry Czervik
Came To Her Senses
Join date: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 3,680
07-26-2008 05:18
From: Aleco Collas
No, you're not banned if you don't reveal your true gender. Even the age verification is no proove, since it just checks if the number entered is a valid number. There are generators for german passport numbers and the number I entered for my female account with the female RL name was the one of my real, male, passport, so they aren't checked against the name.

The name did not even have to match the name of the credit card holder.

cu
Aleco


Nothing actually has to match. This is the irony. But you know, personally, I'm glad that's the case no matter what risks it brings. The day we're all fitted with a microchip, and all communication is handled by Government ... is a dark day for humanity.
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Tod69 Talamasca
The Human Tripod ;)
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 4,107
07-26-2008 06:16
From: Kyllie Wylie

Err.. so he's saying women can't be tech savvy early adopters or gamers? I know i'm fairly new to SL, but I've been playing on line games since the mid 90's and build my own computers! Women can be Geeks too!!!!111!


Of course, Lil' Lady!

Men let women be tech savvy all the time! We let you use the stove, the kitchen sink. As for Early Adopters, there was the microwave! :D
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Steely Carver
The dreamer or the dream?
Join date: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 515
07-26-2008 06:38
From: Cherry Czervik
I realise I am not stereotypical. Never played ANY MMOs, didn't much enjoy Quake Arena (or any shooters online) but I do play GTA. Still prefer Vice City. Also love Half Life, Deus Ex ...


Nope, Cherry, I don't think you will ever be stereotypical. :)
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Tabliopa Underwood
Registered User
Join date: 6 Aug 2007
Posts: 719
07-26-2008 08:08
From: Tod69 Talamasca
Of course, Lil' Lady!

Men let women be tech savvy all the time! We let you use the stove, the kitchen sink. As for Early Adopters, there was the microwave! :D


But its the TV remote that truly matters :D
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