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Why do people not report underage operating on the grid? |
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Malia Writer
Unemployed in paradise
Join date: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 2,026
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11-24-2009 11:24
Aren't there enough of these underage vs. child avatar threads every week that we don't have to bring back old ones?
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Proxima Saenz
Registered User
Join date: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 107
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11-24-2009 11:42
So.....at what point does it become your business? WHen their mommy comes in and finds the little darling having sex with you, (or any adult) gets LL involved, gets RL authorities involved, gets the media involved and subpoenas you as John/Jane Doe, forces LL to release whatever info they have on you so that you can be prosecuted for having sex with a virtual child, and your RL is forever impacted......then is it your business? I'm all for adults doing anything they feel like doing but when it's a kid impacting my SL, and I find out, he's leaving. Now. True I am not a babysitter as you say, but I need to protect myself, as I have no control over their parents watching them, but I do have control over who I interact with, if I indeed am aware of it. First, I am not a person that would do these things to children, assuming that says more about you than me. Secondly, it becomes my business if the child's behaviour is disturbing, and violating the other T.O.S. - in that case I will report this violation, including my suspection that this person might be underage. When a child does not bother me, or harrash me, i see no reason to report it to LL. I've met children that are behaving far more mature than SOME adults.. How do you need to protect yourself against a 13 year old girl that probably has permission from the parents?? And WHY? As if this child is going to harm you. |
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Treasure Ballinger
Virtual Ability
Join date: 31 Dec 2007
Posts: 2,745
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11-24-2009 11:46
First, I am not a person that would do these things to children, assuming that says more about you than me. Secondly, it becomes my business if the child's behaviour is disturbing, and violating the other T.O.S. - in that case I will report this violation, including my suspection that this person might be underage. When a child does not bother me, or harrash me, i see no reason to report it to LL. I've met children that are behaving far more mature than SOME adults.. How do you need to protect yourself against a 13 year old girl that probably has permission from the parents?? And WHY? As if this child is going to harm you. No, it does not say more about 'me' than it does 'you'. Why is one part of the TOS more important than another? A parent can't give permission to their child, to break somebody else's TOS. Unknowingly or worse, knowingly, interacting with a child gives me the heebie jeebies. And THAT does say more about me than it does about you. Since it's against TOS, it's my business, it's all of our business. If I know, to remove both myself and the child from the situation. |
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Milla Janick
Empress Of The Universe
Join date: 2 Jan 2008
Posts: 3,075
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11-24-2009 11:48
How do you need to protect yourself against a 13 year old girl that probably has permission from the parents?? And WHY? As if this child is going to harm you. It doesn't matter who the child has permission from, they don't have permission from Linden Lab to be here. Children should be on Teen SL, not the main grid. _____________________
 http://www.avatarsunited.com/avatars/milla-janick All those moments will be lost in time... like tears in rain... |
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Treasure Ballinger
Virtual Ability
Join date: 31 Dec 2007
Posts: 2,745
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11-24-2009 11:49
Aren't there enough of these underage vs. child avatar threads every week that we don't have to bring back old ones? You're right. One of these days I'll remember to look at these dates before jumping in. |
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sable Valentine
AU United
Join date: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 1,275
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11-24-2009 12:45
I was reading some of these posts and it got me to thinking why don't I report them. I have met and befriended underage participants. It never occurred me to report them.
I think why I didn't report them is probably reflective of my own experiences as a teenager. Sneaking into 18 year old & older clubs. Hanging out with people that I wasn't supposed to. I turned out to be ok. Now looking back, I probably had that same attitude towards underage players. My mindset then was well sl is harmless than what I was doing irl. Even with that I felt conflicted about the underage player because of this feeling to shield them from certain elements. On the surface I can say, it is not my responsibility it's the parents. But and this IMO as part of the human race I feel that I do have some level of responsbility no matter how minute it is. My sl sister has a huge sl family. I do recall the sl son reporting one of the "sisters" when he found out she age 15 irl was dating a guy in sl who was 29. My sl sister told me he did that because he thought it was gross. That kind of stuff worries me. _____________________
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Proxima Saenz
Registered User
Join date: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 107
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11-24-2009 13:03
Don't get me wrong now.
I say I do not report underage people, I do not say I do forbidden things. The ToS does not force me, as resident to report underaged people, therefore it is a free choice. I feel its not our right to take away the fun for them. Its for their own ''protection'' , hmm? Then why dont we kick out the offenders that harm our children? Instead of kicking out the kids? I AGREE, SL is an adult world, children should NOT be here. I am also against merging the two grids (teen and main). But if a kid manages to pass Linden Labs 'security' gates, then thats good for him. I wont be the one that pulls a Linden's sleeve and whisper in the ear that person X is a kid in real life. I have better things to do than playing babysitter or spy. I understand people ARE reporting children, but I dont understand why. |
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Holocluck Henly
Holographic Clucktor
Join date: 11 Apr 2008
Posts: 552
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11-24-2009 13:21
I thought Treasure Ballinger's post was quite thorough as to why it's our business.
Preservation of the grid. _____________________
 Photostream: www.flickr.com/photos/holocluck Holocluck's Henhouse: New Eyes on the Grid: holocluck@blogspot |
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Proxima Saenz
Registered User
Join date: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 107
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11-24-2009 14:04
Are you a linden then?
Or are you a nosey resident who sticks his nose in other people's business? |
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Jannae Karas
Just Looking
Join date: 10 Mar 2007
Posts: 1,516
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11-24-2009 15:21
After reading the op, and checking inworld profile....
The story sounds so obviously made up, that I find it hard to believe anyone could have taken it seriously. Edited to add that I hadn't noticed this multi-page time waster was resurected from the dead. _____________________
Taller Than
I Imagined, nicer than yesterday. |
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Treasure Ballinger
Virtual Ability
Join date: 31 Dec 2007
Posts: 2,745
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11-24-2009 15:54
Are you a linden then? Or are you a nosey resident who sticks his nose in other people's business? Neither. I am somebody who doesn't want to interact with kids, in any way, shape or form, inworld. If I find out that I AM interacting with them, it's my right to make it stop, because I don't want RL kids around 'me' inworld. So that's what I do, make it go away. That's it, really. Anything adults want to do is fine with me, I have no judgement or even an opinion, it's not my business. We'll have to agree to disagree regarding the kid issue. I"m out of this thread now, it's too old. |
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Pussycat Catnap
Sex Kitten
Join date: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 1,131
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11-24-2009 17:30
First, I am not a person that would do these things to children, But how do you know they are children -beforehand- ? That is the problem - plenty of us do not want to have to police our actions in SL as if there were children around, when it is clearly intended to be a format where there are only adults around. So... yes, if I catch an underaged person in SL, and know that is what they are - there will be an AR filed very quickly. _____________________
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Pussycat Catnap
Sex Kitten
Join date: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 1,131
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11-24-2009 17:39
I feel its not our right to take away the fun for them. Its for their own ''protection'' , hmm? Then why dont we kick out the offenders that harm our children? Instead of kicking out the kids? Its not to protect them, its to protect us. Its to allow us to continue to have the freedom to be adult in an adult space and not have to regulate our conduct. It protects us marginally in a legal sense - in that if the other party was a minor and you started revealing RL info about yourself during a relationship, you could get into legal trouble before you ever even knew that other party was a minor. But this scenario is highly unlikely. More likely, it protects us socially - when the other party is a minor and we don't know, and figures get involved over what that minor is doing and want to know who we are and why we are doing what we are doing with that person that we thought was an adult. It protects SL, in that SL simply could not allow a large amount of things that are done on mature, adult, and even PG sims if minors were welcomed in. That in turns protects us - in that keeping them out allows us to keep our sense of community intact. Which also protects our marketplaces, which then in turn protect's LL's suit life and educational goals. Very very little of it is about protecting them from us. Most of it protects us from them. _____________________
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Pussycat Catnap
Sex Kitten
Join date: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 1,131
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11-24-2009 17:44
Of course... The ULTIMATE way to avoid online pedophilia is to keep your distance from any and all avatars that look like this:  Because, that's EXACTLY what some kids prefer their avatars to look like. (Teen grid picture, by the way) =^-^= I tend to avoid blonds anyway on general principle.  _____________________
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Marianne McCann
Feted Inner Child
Join date: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 7,145
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11-24-2009 17:48
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 "There's nothing objectionable nor illegal in having a child-like avatar in itself and we must assume innocence until proof of the contrary." - Lewis PR Linden "If you find children offensive, you're gonna have trouble in this world  " - Prospero Linden |
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Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
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11-24-2009 17:59
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Don't you ever try to look behind my eyes. You don't want to know what they have seen.
http://brenda-connolly.blogspot.com |
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Void Singer
Int vSelf = Sing(void);
Join date: 24 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,973
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11-24-2009 18:48
"Why do people not report underage operating on the grid?"
because in most cases, we don't care? honestly unless I know with a high degree of certainty that a person is underage AND they are doing things that may endanger themselves or other users, (a fairly rare combination) I just don't give a rat's ass. I know I'm not alone in this. _____________________
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Jannae Karas
Just Looking
Join date: 10 Mar 2007
Posts: 1,516
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11-24-2009 18:58
"Why do people not report underage operating on the grid?" because in most cases, we don't care? honestly unless I know with a high degree of certainty that a person is underage AND they are doing things that may endanger themselves or other users, (a fairly rare combination) I just don't give a rat's ass. I know I'm not alone in this. What she said. _____________________
Taller Than
I Imagined, nicer than yesterday. |
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Kyrah Abattoir
cruelty delight
Join date: 4 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,786
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11-24-2009 19:06
This age play incident was reported to Linden Lab today: ------- Event happening September 18: - Kid avatar approached by male avatar who invites avatar to go and look at horses - Kid avatar teleported out of infohub to a location where male avatar makes an attempt to engage in sexual age play with the kid avatar (chat log submitted) Facts: - Investigation shows person behind kid avatar is a 13 years old girl living with female parent - Female parent lets daughter operate in SL "under supervision" - Female parent is also mother in virtual SL family - Male virtual parent knows the kid avatar has a RL age of 13 without reporting it ---------- Here we have a virtual family knowingly letting a RL kid operate on the grid, and status after a month on the grid is that the kid has actively been tricked into a sexual age play situation. My question is, why - why do parents, and what supposedly is adult people, knowingly let underage operate on the grid, and not stop or report them? Some people at the infohub must have known too. The kid avatar had set home there and it must have been pretty obvious to the offender the person behind the avatar was underage given he was engaging in, and almost succeeding in such a simple trick. Why did not anyone report the avatar as being underage or the person trying to trick the kid? I chose not to participate in any form of vigilantism, Linden endorsed or not that i believe is not bringing anything positive. Getting peoples banned for their avatar isn't, and i don't care what the ToS say about it. If ultimately it rely on me doing the ground work, i am free to decide if i want to be involved or not. That's not being irresponsible byt the way, that's having a different opinion. _____________________
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Pussycat Catnap
Sex Kitten
Join date: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 1,131
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11-24-2009 19:46
That's not being irresponsible byt the way, that's having a different opinion. Despite what those hippies in school tell you about being your own special snowflake, some opinions are flat out wrong and bad. I may be a hippie, but there are times to bring out the sunshine and butterflies, and times to learn how to act properly and keep others accountable - not just for their benefit, but for your own as well. _____________________
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Dakota Tebaldi
Voodoo Child
Join date: 6 Feb 2008
Posts: 1,873
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11-24-2009 20:25
Secondly, it becomes my business if the child's behaviour is disturbing, and violating the other T.O.S. - in that case I will report this violation, including my suspection that this person might be underage. Interesting. Are there any other parts of the TOS besides "must be 18" that you feel it's okay to ignore or violate after agreeing to them? _____________________
"...Dakota will grow up to be very scary... but in a HOT and desireable kind of way." - 3Ring Binder
"I really do think it's a pity he didnt "age" himself to 18." - Jig Chippewa |
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Raudf Fox
(ra-ow-th)
Join date: 25 Feb 2005
Posts: 5,119
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11-24-2009 21:20
Hmm.. let see, back when I started, we had to pay 10 USD to even create an account. Even when they stopped that, they still required billing information to help "verify." They took that way for the main grid, but still required the billing info or some form of verification for the Teen Grid. And then they wondered why there are kids on the main grid...
I would like to say that I'd report any RL kid I find on the grid, but honestly, I don't think I'm going to be able to tell beyond a shadow of doubt that the person behind the avatar is in fact a RL minor. Unless the kid is stupid and slips up, how are we going to tell? Ask everyone we see for proof of RL ID? Come to think of it, the only time I've reported a minor on the grid was when the minor realized she had somehow gotten the wrong grid and wisely wanted on the Teen. Reporting was the fastest way to take care of the issue at the time. She reported herself after I explained what she needed to do. That was years ago, however, when ARs were responded to in a timely manner and [email]support@lindenlab.com[/email] still worked. _____________________
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Tegg Bode
FrootLoop Roo Overlord
Join date: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 5,707
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11-24-2009 21:54
Its sad it happens. WhY i do not report underaged people? - Easy, I am not their parent. If their kids are on SL, who I am to betray them and get them banned? It depends on their behaviour, if they are being idiots I'm not going to just put up with them while I wait for their parents to login and catch them _____________________
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Dakota Tebaldi
Voodoo Child
Join date: 6 Feb 2008
Posts: 1,873
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11-24-2009 22:46
And then they wondered why there are kids on the main grid... No, they didn't wonder at all. They just said "no kids on the main grid". Then they said to the rest of the residents, "if you happen to run across a minor/bank/casino/etc, let us know if you're so inclined, and we'll take care of them", and that was the end of LL's worrying about minors. The only people currently wondering or worrying about minors are the residents. _____________________
"...Dakota will grow up to be very scary... but in a HOT and desireable kind of way." - 3Ring Binder
"I really do think it's a pity he didnt "age" himself to 18." - Jig Chippewa |
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Rene Erlanger
Scuderia Shapes & Skins G
Join date: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2,008
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11-25-2009 00:19
Some people are the type, that are afraid of their own shadow!
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