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Basic Membership = Illegal Alien

Lindal Kidd
Dances With Noobs
Join date: 26 Jun 2007
Posts: 8,371
04-07-2008 13:23
From: Keira Wells
You've got that title.

'Concierge Level Resident'

That'd be enough for me, but no, for you you gotta get a free all-gold monitor, 84000 inches, and flatter 'n' a pancake, yeah?

Snooty piece uh....err...HI! How are you today?


I'm fine, dear, but my shiny new monitor needs polishing. See to it, please.
/me sticks nose in the air and makes grand exit, trailing the scent of money.
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Lindal Kidd
Dana Hickman
Leather & Lace™
Join date: 10 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,515
04-07-2008 13:35
From: Chip Midnight
Sorry to be contrarian here, but if you want technical support you need to become a premium member. Why should you expect the same level of service (or any service for that matter) from a company that you don't financially support? It has nothing to do with LL making a judgment about whether or not you're an asset to the community. That's completely beside the point. They have to limit the costs of providing support and also ensure that they can provide adequate support to their paying members (who are vastly outnumbered by those who pay nothing). You can become a premium member for $72 a year, which is far cheaper than you can join pretty much any other mmog ($30-45 for the boxed product, $9.95-$14.95 monthly fee). If you want support, pay for it. You can't demand something for nothing.


I couldn't agree more. Many people argue "well I pay rent"... yes you do... to someone other than LL. The simple fact is that people who rent from others don't provide anything EXTRA to LL, and they don't affect LL's bottom line where land is concerned. The landlords tier will still be payed each month, whether there's 1 renter or 50 renters. Tier fees are what make this place go round, and those renters aren't occupying an inch more square land than wasn't already sold and bringing in money before.
Czari Zenovka
I've Had it With "PC"!
Join date: 3 May 2007
Posts: 3,688
04-07-2008 15:13
From: Cunundrum Alcott
I'm not a paying member since I own no mainland and I kinda like being an alien :)


/me raises my hand

I enjoy being an alien as well - my partner and I rent some awesome mainland from a great landlord, I contribute to the SL economy by taking classes and tipping the instructors, purchasing products from merchants, paying rent...and more recently began teaching at ^ASL^ and have learned to build well enough that I am selling a few of my own products.

My partner and I love to explore, dance, go horseback riding, and participate in myriads of activities. I am active in the Relay for Life.

If that is alien status - I'm one happy alien.

And at least for the foreseeable future, I have no, nada, zilch plans to become premium.
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Ordinal Malaprop
really very ordinary
Join date: 9 Sep 2005
Posts: 4,607
04-07-2008 15:22
From: Dana Hickman
I couldn't agree more. Many people argue "well I pay rent"... yes you do... to someone other than LL. The simple fact is that people who rent from others don't provide anything EXTRA to LL, and they don't affect LL's bottom line where land is concerned. The landlords tier will still be payed each month, whether there's 1 renter or 50 renters. Tier fees are what make this place go round, and those renters aren't occupying an inch more square land than wasn't already sold and bringing in money before.

Well, no, I dare say that if there is one renter, the tier won't be paid. Well, it will for that month, since it is calculated in advance; after that, probably not.
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Desmond Shang
Guvnah of Caledon
Join date: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 5,250
04-07-2008 15:37
From: CCTV Giant
I gotta roll with Chip on this one. The cost of support can break any company fast. And, it doesn't matter if premiums get 'quicker' support than a npiof. All this would do is create a backlog and pissed off people. Because....that backlog will grow until it cannot be handled effectively. This is then followed by mis-use and abuse of the system. People sending in multiple support tickets because their first ticket was not answered in 'THEIR' idea of a reasonable time scheme.

I guess the best analogy I can give is -- What ifs the Supermarket were to start giving away free Porterhouse Steaks tomorrow? Think of the ramifications there. Store being rushed, no steaks available, people getting pissed. Which will lead to -- counterfeit steaks, steaks of lesser quality, rancid product -- All of this to give something away for free.

Besides, if you are a successful business person with 3 stores. You're taking money out. But, you don't want to contribute to the community and you want all the same rights? Pffffffffft

Might as well just start asking for concierge rights. *Sorry Desmond -- I apologize Caledon is down but we're removing money pyramids from a few 512 sqm parcels -- Can ya give us a few days?*

(Sorry Des -- you and you 35 regions popped to mind on that one ;) Big Fan!!)

CC


Hahaha!

I give tons of support - I think any serious estate owner would.

You bet I'll get on the concierge channel to help a resident. But it's rare that I have to, as I already know what concierge will say in most cases.

When I absolutely can't figure it out (Mac problems, whatever) I'll sometimes ask on the estate group channel and usually there is somebody who has dealt with the issue before.

I'm already getting quite versed in explaining how to tweak the latest client's graphics settings (wow, what a weekend). For some people on low end computers, it's so bad they can log in but barely see what's going on around them.

With regard to basic residents: yes, if you keep asking, there is a ton of support available - more than they admit to - just give it time. The people at the Company really do want to help, and will.
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Steampunk Victorian, Well-Mannered Caledon!
Quaintly Tuqiri
Still learning
Join date: 18 Feb 2008
Posts: 220
04-07-2008 15:43
From: HoneyBear Lilliehook
You can file a trouble ticket. Just went through this yesterday on hubby's account. You DO have to provide them with the email address you signed up with, and say it's a Special Question on Basic Account, and then state what the problem is.

Doesn't mean they'll actually respond in a prompt fashion, but you can submit.


I have a basic account and I've submitted support tickets before. They've been fairly prompt in answering -- I was pleasantly surprised (one of the few good impressions LL has given me so far).
Trout Recreant
Public Enemy No. 1
Join date: 24 Jul 2007
Posts: 4,873
04-07-2008 15:44
From: Lindal Kidd
I'm fine, dear, but my shiny new monitor needs polishing. See to it, please.
/me sticks nose in the air and makes grand exit, trailing the scent of money.


You smell like sweaty wallet and cocaine residue? I always pictures jasmine or nutmeg or something more pleasant. Now all I can think of is a damp, crumpled up dollar bill with a stupid Where's George stamp on it.
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From: Jerboa Haystack

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Trout Recreant
Public Enemy No. 1
Join date: 24 Jul 2007
Posts: 4,873
04-07-2008 15:48
Illegal aliens can get public education for their children, in some case health care, and driver's licenses. The police will protect them if they are being victimized, the fire department will put out their houses if they catch on fire, or at the very least will risk their lives saving them. They can, in some cases, get food stamps.

You don't qualify for illegal alien level service from SL. I'm not sure even premium members get treated that well. I'm not saying illegal aliens have an easy life, but they get some services at least.
_____________________
From: Jerboa Haystack

A Trout Rating (tm) is something to cherish. To flaunt and be proud of. It is something all women should aspire to obtain!
Puppet Shepherd
New Year, New Tricks
Join date: 14 Feb 2007
Posts: 725
04-07-2008 15:50
From: Cunundrum Alcott
I've seen this answer given way too many times and I can't think of anything more inaccurate. Do you think that piddly monthly fee you pay to LL is what keeps them afloat?


No, I think that piddly monthly fee pays the salaries of the people who provide tech support. And I'm subsidizing the basic support tickets of the basic members. Yes, I should get more for the service I'm paying for than someone who isn't.

We've all hashed out this premium vs. basic argument time after time. Can we give it a rest and start bitching about something new for a change?
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Oryx Tempel
Registered User
Join date: 8 Nov 2006
Posts: 7,663
04-07-2008 15:59
From: Lindal Kidd
Yes, you are the SL equivalent of an illegal alien.

You're working here, making a living. Good for you.

You want government benefits? Get your citizenship and pay your taxes.

I pay mine, and it's little enough I get for them. I have no desire to spread what little services are available even thinner for the likes of you.

(And yes, if you were wondering...my comment applies to the OP and SL, and to RL.)

QFT.

Illegal aliens don't receive the benefits of citizenship (i.e. legal rights, public schools, healthcare, even if it is limited, etc) because they don't pay into the government.

Want rights? Pay taxes.
Want rights from LL? Pay Premium dues.
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Qie Niangao
Coin-operated
Join date: 24 May 2006
Posts: 7,138
04-07-2008 16:00
From: Trout Recreant
I always pictures jasmine or nutmeg or something more pleasant.
From: Trout
[in /341/4f/250134/6.html#post1930769] We originally thought that code was a bunch of ones and zeroes, but it turns out that it's a clear, oily liquid that smells like nutmeg and shame.
Interesting. Nutmeg is an hallucinogen. Might our Trout be in need of an "intervention"? :eek:
Dagmar Heideman
Bokko Dancer
Join date: 2 Feb 2007
Posts: 989
04-07-2008 16:01
From: Wilhelm Neumann
Now today I can't even get the loading screen to load so today I guess the land baron doesn't get paid even though they should be. So that's 48 bucks less that LL is making today.
No, that is just 48 bucks that the "land baron" doesn't get. The estate owner has the direct obligation to LL for payment of the estate's tier fees regardless of whether you pay your tier. That's the notable difference between basic account holders and premium/estate owner accounts. LL cannot look to or rely directly on the former for any payment while it can and does look to and rely on the latter for its income. That's why the analogy of basic account holders paying taxes by paying rent to premium/estate owner accounts does not work. It's like saying paying anything into the economy of a country makes you a taxpayer of that country just because ultimately a portion of it is allocated to payment of someone's taxes in that country. Paying into the economic system does not equate into being a taxpayer.
Gabriele Graves
Always and Forever, FULL
Join date: 23 Apr 2007
Posts: 6,205
04-07-2008 16:11
From: Puppet Shepherd
No, I think that piddly monthly fee pays the salaries of the people who provide tech support. And I'm subsidizing the basic support tickets of the basic members. Yes, I should get more for the service I'm paying for than someone who isn't.


You are - the ability to own mainland. I believe that support should be given at all levels if LL want to retain the numbers of people they have signed up. SL is not like regular software where once you have sold it to a customer any help you give them is money lost until the next upgrade. Getting support from LL to solve your problem is trying to ensure you retain people in the service. You don't know when that person might start spending money and/or upgrade to buy land.

The trick is seperating quickly those who can find their answer in another place and directing them there from those whose problem can only be sorted out by Linden support.

From: Puppet Shepherd
We've all hashed out this premium vs. basic argument time after time. Can we give it a rest and start bitching about something new for a change?


Nope, I thought it was a discussion and perhaps there are new perspectives to hear. You can stop reading this thread you know...
_____________________

Trout Rating: I'm giving you an 8.2 on the Troutchter Earth-Movement Slut Scale. You are an amazing, enchanting woman, and, when the situation calls for it, a slut of the very best sort. Congratulations and shame on you!
Snowflake Fairymeadow
Registered User
Join date: 21 May 2006
Posts: 704
04-07-2008 16:40
From: Eidolon Dreamscape


If things turn around I'll gladly pull the annual plan. But I still think we are all customers of LL in a way and should all get some type of support.



I own/have owned businesses in RL & SL and I guarantee that anyone who did not pay me was not considered my customer. Business just plain doesn't work that way.

Maybe LL should take it a step further and not allow anyone to take money out if they're not premium.
Gabriele Graves
Always and Forever, FULL
Join date: 23 Apr 2007
Posts: 6,205
04-07-2008 16:46
From: Snowflake Fairymeadow
I own/have owned businesses in RL & SL and I guarantee that anyone who did not pay me was not considered my customer. Business just plain doesn't work that way.

Maybe LL should take it a step further and not allow anyone to take money out if they're not premium.


When LL opened up the system to non-paying accounts they basically said that they want non-paying customers too. Everyone with a basic account *is* a customer. There are no non-customer accounts.
_____________________

Trout Rating: I'm giving you an 8.2 on the Troutchter Earth-Movement Slut Scale. You are an amazing, enchanting woman, and, when the situation calls for it, a slut of the very best sort. Congratulations and shame on you!
Snowflake Fairymeadow
Registered User
Join date: 21 May 2006
Posts: 704
04-07-2008 20:49
From: Gabriele Graves
When LL opened up the system to non-paying accounts they basically said that they want non-paying customers too. Everyone with a basic account *is* a customer. There are no non-customer accounts.


I believe you are confusing the term "customer" with the term "user". By definition a customer is a person who purchases goods or services from another. A user would be someone who uses a product or service, not necessarily paying for the product or service.
Gabriele Graves
Always and Forever, FULL
Join date: 23 Apr 2007
Posts: 6,205
04-07-2008 20:53
From: Snowflake Fairymeadow
I believe you are confusing the term "customer" with the term "user". By definition a customer is a person who purchases goods or services from another. A user would be someone who uses a product or service, not necessarily paying for the product or service.


Nope I am happy with my terms, in the high street if a shop gives me a freebie, even if I have never spent money with them I am still a customer.
_____________________

Trout Rating: I'm giving you an 8.2 on the Troutchter Earth-Movement Slut Scale. You are an amazing, enchanting woman, and, when the situation calls for it, a slut of the very best sort. Congratulations and shame on you!
Jannae Karas
Just Looking
Join date: 10 Mar 2007
Posts: 1,516
04-07-2008 21:12
If you want support, pony up the monthly fee. I go premium so I can buy mainland (love it ) and get support. I have gottten my $ worth from support, especially with all of the problems as of late. The stipend and free 512 tier make up for almost all of the cost if you pay at least quarterly.

Trying to be nicer than yesterday, but it bugs me a bit. Got to have some perks for being a premie.
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I Imagined,
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Snowflake Fairymeadow
Registered User
Join date: 21 May 2006
Posts: 704
04-07-2008 21:13
From: Gabriele Graves
Nope I am happy with my terms, in the high street if a shop gives me a freebie, even if I have never spent money with them I am still a customer.

OK then, I used the dictionary definition.

Of course you may use your own but as a business owner I stated earlier, people who have not spent money in my business are not customers.

They may be potential customers, but I am not providing support services for products which they did not purchase from me. I believe in this case LL is using the definiton the same way.
Gabriele Graves
Always and Forever, FULL
Join date: 23 Apr 2007
Posts: 6,205
04-07-2008 21:25
From: Snowflake Fairymeadow
OK then, I used the dictionary definition.

Of course you may use your own but as a business owner I stated earlier, people who have not spent money in my business are not customers.

They may be potential customers, but I am not providing support services for products which they did not purchase from me. I believe in this case LL is using the definiton the same way.


As is your right but I think that LL is not approaching things the right way to deny service support to non-premium people because it will drive away paying (buying L$ type) and potential customers when they don't get solutions to their problems. I think premium should be distinguished in some other way.

I paid nothing for 3 months whilst I tried out the service then for the next 6 months I spent thousands of USD buying L$ to spend at shops inworld then I became premium. If I had not received support in my first 9 months if/when I required it then I would not be premium now nor would I have started or continued to spend the money I did. I am not unique in my experience is my point.
Luckily I did not need support during that time.
_____________________

Trout Rating: I'm giving you an 8.2 on the Troutchter Earth-Movement Slut Scale. You are an amazing, enchanting woman, and, when the situation calls for it, a slut of the very best sort. Congratulations and shame on you!
Jannae Karas
Just Looking
Join date: 10 Mar 2007
Posts: 1,516
04-07-2008 21:28
From: Gabriele Graves

I paid nothing for 3 months whilst I tried out the service then for the next 6 months I spent thousands of USD buying L$ to spend at shops inworld then I became premium. QUOTE]

Holy sh_t. Thousands?
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Taller Than
I Imagined,
nicer than yesterday.
Gabriele Graves
Always and Forever, FULL
Join date: 23 Apr 2007
Posts: 6,205
04-07-2008 21:31
From: Jannae Karas
From: Gabriele Graves

I paid nothing for 3 months whilst I tried out the service then for the next 6 months I spent thousands of USD buying L$ to spend at shops inworld then I became premium. QUOTE]

Holy sh_t. Thousands?


I would say at least 2 of them yes - definitely but that is over 6 months - so that averages out to ... more than I care to think about :eek:
_____________________

Trout Rating: I'm giving you an 8.2 on the Troutchter Earth-Movement Slut Scale. You are an amazing, enchanting woman, and, when the situation calls for it, a slut of the very best sort. Congratulations and shame on you!
Jannae Karas
Just Looking
Join date: 10 Mar 2007
Posts: 1,516
04-07-2008 21:35
From: Gabriele Graves
I would say at least 2 of them yes - definitely but that is over 6 months - so that averages out to ... more than I care to think about :eek:


As a fellow shopoholic, I salute you.
_____________________
Taller Than
I Imagined,
nicer than yesterday.
Gabriele Graves
Always and Forever, FULL
Join date: 23 Apr 2007
Posts: 6,205
04-07-2008 21:38
From: Jannae Karas
As a fellow shopoholic, I salute you.


lol thanks, its the shoes *weeps* always the shoes....:o
_____________________

Trout Rating: I'm giving you an 8.2 on the Troutchter Earth-Movement Slut Scale. You are an amazing, enchanting woman, and, when the situation calls for it, a slut of the very best sort. Congratulations and shame on you!
Ann Launay
Neko-licious™
Join date: 8 Aug 2006
Posts: 7,893
04-07-2008 21:42
I have over $500 in skins alone...
_____________________
~Now Trout Re-Re-Re-Certified!~
From: someone
I am bumping you to an 8.5 on the Official Trout Measuring Instrument of Sluttiness. You are an enigma - on the one hand a sweet, gentle, intelligent woman who we would like to wrap up in our arms and protect, and on the other, a temptress to whom we would like to do all sorts of unmentionable things.

Congratulations and shame on you! You are a bit of a slut.
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