I joined SL to advertize my novel -- but will it work to pay ppl L$ for advertizing?

you can rent, or find a free spot.

owning land is a much more involved idea. once you own it, you thn have tier issues, and then resale if you change your mind.

3-ring, i think it's MY profile that doesn't let private messages. i may need to log in to fix it? can't find it on web. I'll try to log on tomorrow or some other time.
but i can't go on SL now because my computer has Vista. I need to set up my crummy work laptop to go to SL.

I have saved this thread to remember all of you who want me to check them out for some reason or another.

You need to set options to allow ims to go to your email. I was bit confusing at first because I didn't understand what I was enabling or disabling I think 3ring if you do the following you can enable messages here through forum but it looks like you're allowing im's to go to email but it also allows people to send email via private post in profile in forums. I thought you enabled it already because you wrote me. Not everyone though enables this feature or even knows about it. You can only write people via forums email to those who enable it.
Go to your forum profile there should be option there to enable emails to forum
Also Null you can subscribe and have post sent to your offline email too via the bottom of page where you reply under thread subscription.

Are you saying you think Avion is a teenager? Or just that you think the concern is only one a teenager should have?

Either way, it's patronizing.

I happen to agree ... you are getting some good advice here, but your basic approach is 'how can I use SL to make me some money and get my book out without actually having to be involved in it?' And I think that's a bad approach.

If you got involved in SL, made some friends, took part in books discussions, and then wanted to find ways to get the word out about a RL book you have available, it would be different.



Second Life wasn't made with the idea that people could swoop in from outside and get a few thousand dollars' worth of advertising real-world products for pennies. When you're selling pixel creations that cost you a few L$10 texture uploads to make and you sell for what amounts to a dollar or two USD, then advertise them. If you have a RL book to sell, use RL advertising venues to market it.

If your interest is just in getting it read, then make an SL edition that you can sell for a few hundred L$ ... easy enough to make and you can hire someone to help ... and advertise that edition in-world, maybe with a small notice that there is a real-world version available.

This is just my opinion. As far as I know, there's no Linden Lab policy forbidding it. But do be aware, a lot of people in SL are not going to react well to this unless you do it very creatively and, ideally, you do it as a user of SL and not an opportunist looking for cheap ad space.

My L$2.

FD, did i say thanks yet and mention that i will check you and your writer friend out? i will. All my adds will end up being at a LOSS compared to sales prices of books so your friend cant' expect any $ that way. I'd rather pay even some minimal L$ for eyes-that-view-add based on # of people on your land / attending event rather than non-existant proffit. I have a real-life job so although i can't afford real-life ads, i can certainly spare some L$.

i guess i need to make 1) billboard (NO scripting flashing, which is better) 2) book to sit around places 3) "decorative object" -- rocket from my book

And i need to get a microphone for my laptop and figure out how to use it, lol. readings. that might be an ANTI-advertizement but i'll try anything.

I've been trying to tell people on Amazon about my books. So far: two new "amazon friends" and ... zero sales! It's SL -- or bust!

i'm running SL on Vista with no probs.

to change your PM settings.....up top, left, in the blue bar "User CP"
then "Edit Options"

There is different ways to go Null.
There are people who are story tellers, they do events and tell stories.
There are also those who create prim books and sell them.
It depends on what is most important to you.
Lot of my artist, writer friends the primary purpose is to create and have friends to share what they have done.
Friendship and creating is more important.
I can connect you with really nice writers who write because they love to do it and publish because they want to share who help you for probably nothing because they aren't into the money for it.
But if you're wanting in world book there is going to be upload cost to do so depending on the pages.
If you're hoping just for free publicity for your book. I don't know if Second Life is way to go unless you're like someone at the level of Stephen King.
There are business who make money in SL but its extremely difficult and competive.
Best bet would be is if you want to promote your book create website on the regular internet, self publish and save your money for advertising and self publishing sell copies on regular internet.
If you want people to read, appreciate your writing, friendships and community there is way to do this in Second Life.
I have friends who are artist, musicians, writers, book lovers, into creating cultural events but they aren't doing this for money they are doing it for other things.
While one did become quite well known and did make a lot of tips doing concerts it wasn't enough for her to quit her first life job. She eventually decided the stress of promotiong her musical events was taking the fun out of SL and decided to do other things.

Mickey, i didn't say Avion was a teenager, but when i was a teenager, I thought just like him. I also though i could write what i want and get published and read and i had a nasty word for anyone who tried to tell me that realistically, i can't.

Please understand, i'm going to LOSE money on my book. I am buying readers for my book, yes, otherwise i'd not spend time on SL but on meetup.com looking for REAL people to meet up with.
Please understand: PEOPLE WHO MAKE MONEY ON BOOKS DON'T NEED SL!!! Please understand that Middlesex is a bestseller because it had four salesmen working for it -- salesmen hired by the publishing company to market to MAGAZINES. Please understand that i have no hard copies of my book for people to come across by accident in any bookstore, ever. All i have is an entry on Amazon people can't find unless they look for it by name. I have make people aware of it.

And if you still have a problem with that.... Do not tell your children to follow their dreams! Do not tell them 'never give up'. Because you know something, I am the result. Everyone my age quit writing, quit playing music, quit doing ANYTHING creative. Everyone my age, even people who thought they were born to be writers or musicians, saw that it went no-where and quit. Ok, not everyone. People who were able to make a career out of it -- people who were able to SELL it and MAKE MONEY of it are still doing it. I am not making money. I have no illusions about that. I just want people to know my book exists.

You know what, if SL goes nowhere, I'LL QUIT. I won't write anymore. I'll have 5 kids and spend my life cleaning up after them and living vicariously through them.

If you have a problem with me trying to sell my pathetic novel on SL, just tell you kids to just hang out and talk to people and enjoy life, without HAVING dreams and without CREATING ANYTHING. Then they will be people you like. People who just talk, who don't have any agenda. I know i'll tell my kids "it's ok to follow your dreams, but the happy people are the ones that don't have any dreams."

I agree i'd be more likeable if i just hung out and didn't try to create anything or do anything special. I don't know why -- because *i* like people who create.

If i thought a SL version of my book would be READ, i'd make one. But i would not want to read 300 real-life pages on a computer screen -- especially with friends IMing and stuff!

FD, I know what you are saying. But friends and stuff only go so far. I don't think i want to write for just friends. I really deluded myself into thinking i had something to say! Of course i grew up since i started my novel, and i realize that what's popular is stuff that doesn't say anything.

I'm not looking for money. I'm looking to spend money to get readers. I'm looking for readers -- even if it costs me. BTW, I DID self-publish. I couldn't wait 5 years just to be rejected (as i would be) by a real publisher. I have to get on with real life. That's why i'm in this pickle.

I don't know how many people would visit a web-site. If i made one, i'd have to them promote THAT and that would be annoying too.

wow ... you do have quite the gift for over-reactive melodrama. Not to mention putting words in people's mouths.

For the record ... I did not, and would not ever, say don't create.

I did not, and would not ever, say just hang out and don't try to create anything. Where on Earth did you get that out of what I said?

Let me put it simply: My advice (and only my opinion) is, take part in the SL community and get the word out about your creative work AS PART OF the SL creative community ... not as an outsider trying to find inexpensive advertising.

Now tell me how the hell you can get "don't be creative" out of that?

OK, I'm done here. Differences of opinion are fine, but I'm not going to be accused of saying things I didn't say by someone who knows nothing about me.

Good luck.

I wonder if there is way to create special camping reading device with trivia questions on the book. Not sure how you script it.
I do understand that we all are seeking something and all have dreams.
I wish you luck, I hope you find your dreams in SL or real life without too many disappointments.

Micky, my choice is 1) create (books) or 2) don't create. I have no desire to create just SL graphical things. I'm not good at that. I've been writing since i was 9 years old. I'm no Stephen King but i have some more practice than the average person, and it shows.

you are the one getting all melodramatic. I didn't say anthing about YOU without knowing you. I was trying to explain MYSELF to you. You are the one talking to ME without knowing me. You see that i want to advertize and you rightfully see that that's evil, and you attack without understanding why i'd resort to this. What did i say about you? Nothing!

My choice is 1) create (books) or 2) don't create. That's what i was trying to say. If i can create books -- but no one reads them, that's just me talking to myself. That's pointless. Then I have no choice but to quit creating and find some other way to fill my time.

Of course, i did the wrong thing by giving you the dignity of a response. I knew i should have just ignored you. But something in me made me treet a total stranger on an internet chat board as a human capable of understanding. You are not interested in anything I have to say. You just want to bash me. My mistake.

FD, thanks. I will look you up on-line as soon as i get a half-way decent avatar. All in all, i'm glad i asked this question in this forum, and it's better to get angry people HERE than to work hard on making scripted adds only to find out that *scripted* adds are hated while normal adds (so much less work!) would get a better response. All i need is 5 words, really! 5 words and book title will be enough!

True, best to make something that has value -- *other* than being an add -- got it

I never even considered putting adds NEXT to other people's land -- that's WRONG. I'd never do that! I'd only compenstate people for voluntarily putting it on their own land.

I will check out related events full of writerly people, fix my profile and avatar, maybe get (RENT) some land for events, and re-read the non-hostile portions of their thread for their ideas again.

I will buy some add space in Fantasy & Science Fiction real world mag too -- IF i can afford it. I don't expect to get many readers from that tho -- i'm really hoping SL works out.

OK, last try ... you are reading my advice against opportunistically using SL as an ad platform as somehow challenging the value of being creative or produceingcreative work at all. You are linking two things that are not in the least bit connected.

But in re-reading your post I caught this:



Right. People in SL are not "real people."

Well, don't do that. Post it on the internet for free before you do something as rash as all that.

I write, too. I am what I would call "marginally successful": to wit, I'm published, but am hardly in a position to quit my day job. But as you say, you have no choice in whether to write or not. If you had any sense, you wouldn't. But you have no choice, eh? Those dratted voices yibber yabber at you, and the only way you can quiet them down is to jot their stories down. Trust me, stop writing, and you'll be miserable.

SL offers a lot, but little or no real commercial success. In a world where $2000 Linden (less than $10 US) is considered a princely sum, no one is going to buy your book for anything approaching a realistic price. And I think you have seen how people react to ads for "outside" products.

Now, if all you wish to do is to share your work, then you might be able to achieve that goal. But it will require social networking, hosting reading, all the suggestions you've got from the people above. I'm not sure your time spent doing that might not be better spent in RL writer's workshops, networking, or just unplugging the internet and working on your next novel.

Whatever you do, best of luck. Just keep on writing.

Micky, i explained what my position in on SL. I realize you are baiting me, and I should ignore you. But Instead of trying to explain myself to you again, i will ask you: so what will YOU have me do? How can i let people know i have this book out on Amazon -- when it's no where else?
And if i don't do that -- if i use SL to just hang out in virtual bars as you seem to want me to -- what choice does that leave me given that without advertising my book is invisible? Do you think i should write books -- and have them read zero times? Or not write?

I've read a lot about SL in the new york times and other publications. All they do is say the same thing: how SL is the model of un-restrained corporate opportunism, so much so that business schools are using it to study! So what exactly are you protecting? A land of fake pixels being sold for real cash -- agaist a real book that you can touch and hold in your hand?

What the heck is you problem and if you have a problem with what i'm doing, tell me in simple words what you want me to do instead? I enumerated the choices as i seem them already. Perhaps i missed something?

Or you only want books that make Operah's list to be advertized (and read)? Because without "opportunism" of SL that's all that's left -- opportunism of big publishing companies and salesmen like Operah.

ok, Null. please stop now.

You are being very aggressive with people who were honestly trying to help you.

This is not the way to generate more helpful responses/offers or to publicize your book. It's a great way to ostracize the very community that you want to read your book.

Without spending time and creative energy on second life you will not acquire solid advertising opportunities for your novel.

It's one thing to create. It's another thing entirely to market- which you seem to understand. Marketing must be audience driven and have relevancy and be thought provoking otherwise capture the audiences attention.

Written media is strongest when printed and portable. Until computers achieve the portability of current written media, you will have a hard sell. You will have to go farther and do more work for less gain. It's not fair. it's certainly not reasonable, but its reality.

I'd love a lot of people to see the stuff I make in SL. I poured hours into each piece... but I can't expect that putting it out on the ground and yelling into the void that it's for sale is going to get anyone to look at my stuff- much less purchase it. I can't just create the jewelry and achieve sales from my inventory by sheer force of will. I had to build a shop. I had to build display pieces. I had to spend almost as much time in photoshop designing the boxes, the signs for the shop, the rug on the floor, the welcome sign as I spent designing the pieces themselves. And you know what, even after all that work I still have a long way to go still. I have to list my pieces on onrez, on slexchange, I have to look for ways to increase my foot traffic. I have to start up a blog, and write articles for my new releases. I have to submit an application to fashion consolidated to get the ability to broadcast my releases, and then build up even more notecards and textures to get the word out. I have to cross post my releases to several different forums and put together a press pack for the fashion blogs so I can have a *chance* of being reviewed on a high traffic site.

I create. I love to create. I've spent years oil painting and all I have to show for that are 4 paintings that I'm willing to hang up in my home. I spent 4 years pursuing a career in music, 16 hour days- multiple private instructors, and you know what I have to show for it? I can sing beautiful lullabies to my niece- because they kicked me out of college. All the private lessons in the world can't change a bad voice.

Either create for the joy of it, or create for the profit of it. The first sees little recognition but should give you inner satisfaction in a job well done. The second takes a hell of a lot of work marketing yourself.

I create in SL for the profit of it- to achieve recognition and hopefully someday profit- but really I'd be okay with everyone wearing my stuff and breaking even. I enjoy myself quite a bit in the process but it's work, make no mistake.

You wrote a novel. Congrats. Hard work! I've always meant to write a book, never got past the first chapter though. Advertising it's going to be rough. Listen to people giving suggestions and don't take them as criticism.

Ok. thanks to all the friendly people. I get it. SL -- networking good, marketting bad. Fine. networking won't get my anywhere. not with my book. I'll live. There's always that little box on the back cover of F&SF.

Null, Good luck with your dreams.
I think there is communication problem though that happens. I have ideas or things I thought of or even questions not come out right.
That happens a lot here.
Things on business level here can be quite discouraging for lot of people its not as easy as I will get island, pay someone to develope it and they buy my product type of thing.
We are warning you for your own protection if we didn't care we wouldn't say anything.
Or at least I care and I am good person and I hate to see you disappointed because your expectations of SL were too high few thousand usd dollars or more broker down the road.
We could tell you to go head invest and give all your spare money and you get tons of readers. You probably could pay people to read your book but that wouldn't pay for the shipping and publishing cost, some people could take the money say they read it and didn't. I don't think that is what you want. Or maybe thats what you want?
Dreams are good but I am not sure if expecting SL to be the all fullfilling place to achieve those dreams and spend every dime in your pocket that you have to spare is good thing.
I don't have lot of money and I have lost a lot already. Yet because of friends who cared and could afford to help me even though I didn't expect it the losses and mistakes didn't hurt as much.
I am warning you because I care.

Wow. That's pretty harsh, insulting the people you want to help you. Oh, wait. We aren't "real." So therefore we can't "really" help you. And our feelings can't "really" be hurt. Well, guess what? We can't "really" read either. So I won't be reading (or buying, since that seems to be what you are really pushing) your book.

Princess Ivory

You don't need to, Null. I LIKE to dress up, but one of the richest people I know in SL still wears pretty much the default AV...he's too busy making money to spend it on primping.

And still the big corporations struggle to find ways to use SL as a marketing tool. SL cannot just be used as a billboard, if you want to sell outside products to residents then first find out who you are selling to.

You can read articles from any publication, about SL, but it doesn't substitute experience of the place itself.

And personaly, if i want a book I will go to the library or a bookshop. There I can flick through the pages and read a few paragraphs before i choose. I can spend hours looking for the next book to read. If theres a book i know i want i will go straight to amazon.

I do not go to SL to find books, my next RL car or to stock my fridge.

I hope this helps and good look anyway.

Do a search for some of the book clubs and groups here. I've seen people advertising books. That will give you some ideas on what you can do here.

There are also some tasteful billboards around, they're not all spinning ad farms.

There is a Book Island somewhere out there I stumbled across. Hopefully you can find it in SL. Interesting place. Actual writers with books up for people to see.

Also there is Book Stacks that holds meetings of readers (it grew out of LibrayThing.com and BookMooch.com). There is also a weekly Book Mooch meeting at the Book Mooch island (I am not sure if Book Stacks is searchable, but Book Mooch is findable in search).

Oh, and your book sounds rather interesting