Increase in griefing? Also.. deserved praise!

So last night, some moron (or maybe more than one, I don't know) put out a batch of the "end racism" particle objects -- basically the same units as the ninja turtles and dollar bills ones. While the sim was up, I could see a stack of them (thankoo Torley for the Beacons video!). These objects were enough to continually bring down my home sim, and from all I've gathered, this is pretty common with these things.

This seems to be more an more common the last few. Is this some concentrated griefer thing, or jes cuz of school going back into session and some peoples getting their last laffs in? I seem to be hearing about more an more of these attacks.

Also, a big big kudo to Leo Linden, who restarted the sim and did the cleanup. He was quick, communicative, and professional. More like Leo, please - he's grrrreat!

Mari

Griefers grief, because they can.

If more people would pay attention to the land tools available to them to prevent such nonsense, it would stop, or at the very least, seriously decline.

The college kids are back in school

Colleges have high speed internets ...

What did you think these kids would be doing, their homework?

I'm thinking there's been an increase in this sort of attack lately. Until last weekend I'd never actually seen one of these before and then I ran into them in three different places.

Autoreturn should default to 1 minute, not 0, to stop negligent owners and limit griefing powers.

I just jira'd this.

https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/MISC-695

Well, I voted for it. Hadn't noticed much in the way of griefing, but then I haven't been in world much this weekend. Just been too sick and too busy. Grrr.. I love when the kid brings home his colds and gives them to me!

But, if I had to speculate, it's the fact that griefers by their nature tend to want to avoid working.. so to avoid homework/papers/other, they log in and see who can crash what first. Seems like a lot of work to me, though. *scratches head*

You're expect logic from people who enjoy crashing sims?

Mari

Since LL can purge the grid database of specific objects when there are gray goo attacks, why don't they do the same thing to get rid of all instances of some of these griefer objects, like the sponge bob screamers and similar garbage? Getting one of those things stuck on land next to you that you don't own that's not set to auto-return is a nightmare. One I don't think residents should have to deal with as often as we do.

The land tools help, certainly. Making things group only for object entry is a good step.

Thankfully my Estate Owner has given me the ability to clean up the island just in case these bozos try it here and also given me the prim allocation for the island waterways (so I am filling it by placing nice Heart Gardens trees for the prettiness of all as well as hopefully stopping any hassles.

Voted and added the comment:
"If someone is reviewing the effects on land settings in the sales process, could we pretty please add:-
Unset Build for All and Terraforming for All.

Currently the sale process enables everything for All, making newly bought land a griefer's paradise by default.
It's my observation that most people don't look at those settings after buying."

I have broadened the issue in jira.

I think Object Entry should be on, *when in combination with Auto-Return being set*

That's what I do on my parcels for the convenience of vehicles flying or sailing through. Next to Ban Lines, No Object Entry is the bane of voyagers' lives.

I'll only turn off Object Entry if absolutely necessary to prevent real-and-present griefer shooting from outside the parcel.

I don't recall seeing object entry being a problem for vehicles as it is usually an attachment. I had a tenant rez his bike on the roof and roof-hop across the sim. Plus see also the epic thread about flyover rights a few weeks back.

Vehicles in general are wonderful ways of exploring SL.
I use boats, motorbikes and cars (that would be automobiles for some).

It's a real PITA to move along feeling smug about getting across a sim boundary in enough pieces to carry on - and then hit the edge of a parcel with No Object Entry or ban lines!!!
Vehicle gone, and a big prob finding somewhere to rezz it again so that the voyage can be continued.

No Object Entry by default would cause mayhem on the waters of Corsica for instance. The open Linden oceans are fine, but once you venture into the narrow canals joining the oceans, you're in a potential minefield.

I'm so glad we don't have build enabled for our land. We're pretty leniant with a lot of things, but one thing we don't tolerate at all is griefing. We are very connected with our neighbors and if one of us gets a griefer, we immediately message each other to ensure that the whole sim ends up banning the person. No questions asked.

We have different levels within our group membership, allowing some peope to rez objects, but non members can not rez on our land. However, that still doesn't stop the determined.

Just the other night, we had one fly in and immedately shout that she hated furries. She sat right next to me and changed her avatar to a gigantic spinning wooden cube. A quick camera shift and I was able to see again ... right click ... eject. She immediately began working her way back and as soon as she came into our parcel, right click-eject and ban.

I filed the AR with LL and also informed the neighbors who placed her on their ban lists. We never saw her again.

Here's what I'd want:

Land owners should be charged L$30 per week per parcel they own without auto-return. (same fee as parcel listing).

If they can't pay, (most likely because they're not active in SecondLife anymore) then auto-return should be automatically re-enabled.

I bought additional land yesterday, and then set my entire parcel to a group that I created with an alt and my main. I set auto-return, as soon as I did that, everything was returned to me. I'm assuming it's because when I set the house, etc, out the land was not deeded to group, and I was wearing a different group tag. If I have the tag on that corresponds to my group, I should be able to set everything out again (<sigh>...very tiring thing since I had it all the way I wanted it in the first place) and not have the danger of it all being returned when I set auto-return again...is that correct?

Yes, that's correct. You didn't have the right tag on. The only way it wouldn't happen is if you didn't turn autoreturn on, or caught the group error before turning it on. It is a bit of a pain, but it is worth it to me to have it default to on instead of off.

Why should land owners have to pay tho. get rid of the damn free accounts.
If they want to sign up and pay to grief fine, loose there account on 1st offense.
Yes loosing free accounts may hurt a few but its at the point of who cares. We pay way
to much money to put up with this BS.

And yes I know LL will never do this cause it would hurt there numbers they show
corporations to sucker em in to SL.

Thanks Matteo. I held off because I didn't want to be the first one to comment on this obvious solution. Before anyone replies that paid accounts can grief too, yes yes yes, they can, but you'll see the number reduce dramatically especially as griefers continue to get their credit cards banned.

As far as the numbers reducing, LL is under so much scrutiny from their ridiculous inflated numbers that I believe their going to have to balance it out anyway to save face. My hope is that means we'll see paid accounts required, or at the very least, account info on file.

I think it is a mistake to villainize or penalize all landowners who don't use autoreturn. I have rental cottages and feel it is a hardship on our tenants to have to set things to a group to rez them and have them stick....maybe not so much for the initial furnishing of their homes, but it limits the ability of their guests to rez items (as they are not in the group) and is a general pain in the butt.

Yes, I know that opens us up to attack and just general junk being set down, but we are very hands-on landlords and have scripts that notify us of unusual prim situations and do general junk checks at least twice a day. We go out of our way to handle this stuff manually for the convenience of our tenants....it is a choice, not negligence.

Because even premium account users leave abandoned/crashed vehicles scattered about the grid on other people's land.

Griefing is only a subset of the problem which is the accumulation of garbage on neglected land.

Yes, I get bit by my own auto-returns often enough to hate how it works... if I'm in a group, active or not, stuff I rez on my land should associate itself with the correct group automatically.

I *STILL* want auto-return to be the strongly encouraged default for all land, with the option to pay extra to disable it as extra incentive, specifically for neglected land.

(Drop by my particle laboratory sometime and look east to see the lovely griefer orbs over my neighbors land that will likely never ever go away, or the vehicles to the north that are stuck over another inactive neighbor's land and have been for months.)

The lack of auto-return is still costing you something. Time instead of L$.

I wouldn't mind if it was a 7 day auto-return period... as long as there was *something* for when absent land owners can't be bothered to police their land.

Ivy, it's laudable that you try and check for junk twice daily, and I wouldn't villainize that at all - but Jopsy has a point. Making landowners pay for autoreturn would wake the negligent ones up, or eventually force the conversion from off to on.

As for the problem of guests, that is why I think more precise control through group roles is the way to deal with that. I give my tenants the power to invite their friends into the group. Residents can change media, etc. but their guests can rez objects, run scripts, etc. once invited in - they don't have any powers, and are not allowed to set home there. I think it works out well for all my tenants and I haven't heard a single complaint. In fact, I have had some people come back to me because the places they went to live weren't as secure, and griefers were giving a little too much trouble.

I know that I can ask my tenants to add their guests to our group, and wouldn't rule that out as a possibility. I see a few problems with it though...such as many tenants just don't read or fully understand such instructions and nothing gets people more angry than having their stuff returned. But that's really neither here nor there.

My point is simply that I don't think that I, as a responsible landowner, should have to pay a fee to 'wake up' the irresponsible ones so that they can help to guard against the real problems--griefers. That seems like a very convoluted way to solve the problem.