Privacy Mode (Make yourself invisible to scripts)

Greifers. They turn on privacy mode, then attack folks using one of these combat systems. Your proposal would have just handed them "god mode".

Sorry to come in on this so late, but who gets grieved or attacked so much that this is needed anyway? After a year in SL, I have only been grieved once, I'm sure if I stand in the middle of a field with a sign around my neck saying 'come grief me' I could be waiting a long time before I was. This really sounds to me like SL residents bringing their RL issues into the game and trying to impose it on others.

Good points. In my experience, I spend a good deal of time chatting, maybe 85% that usually leads to shopping, then the rest of time I might script up the odd thing or two. Then I will get a request to do a project.

So for around 90% of my time in SL, I would not use this feature, but for that 10% of time when I am focused on producing good content, I would give anything for a feature like this.

I see this feature as being a boon to creators not a drawback, all my own scripts will work as intended. Everything on my land will work as intended. People who come on to my land in this mode will be seen by my scripts. I can't see a major problem.

It' will make the 10% of my time here that i spend creating 99% more productive, and the on the rare occasion that I meet a griefer, it will pay for itself in spades.

Not at all. If they are in a combat sim, estate tools will work just fine. Meanwhile everyone else can hit privacy to avoid the cagers etc. and go about business as usual until an estate manager turns up. Pretty much the same as they do now except no-one will be floating up to 4096 meters.

So it is about you?

The problem is that it introduces complicated rules and exceptions, with potential unknown consequences for scripts we may or may not have thought of yet, simply to allow somebody who do not want to mingle with people to sit in a public place while (not) doing so. And it even only takes care of the very, very rare instances of personally targeted follower scripts; not the far more common screamers/rezzers which hit the sim as a whole.
Frankly, it is a knee-jerk reaction which targets the wrong thing, and will not provide what the OP actually wants. -If somebody can cover what I am working on in a sandbox simply by rezzing random prims, it doesn't really matter whether they have access to the information that I am facing East.

After sex, weapons are the biggest sellers in SL. Try building in a sandbox. Try being new. The targets are the new, and the new trying to learn about creating, and those who have become the target of the griefer groups. Google Patriotic Nigras for a hit list, or just go furry for a while.

It sure as hell sounds like it when the OP says (and I'm quoting from a post on the first page of this thread):
Never mind the fact that lots of things use sensors for various reasons (not to mention the other functions they wanna be invisible to), never mind the fact that busy mode and muting already exists, no this is all about what a few people want and wish to force down the rest of our throats. And really, I urge everyone to read the JIRA thread in question, just for gems like this one:

So it's not enough to have this as an "option," no anyone that tries to script their products to deal with this should be instantly permabanned and have all their content deleted. Of course, that's perfectly rational, right? Especially when you consider the last line. Objects which have griefing purposes. So now it's not even dedicated griefing tools. It's anything anyone could possibly use at any point to grief someone, somehow. And the creator, who obviously didn't foresee this use, gets permabanned and has all their content deleted. Yes...that will work out quite well as we all saw during the E. Capalini purge. Again, the only reaction I can express is...

Those of you who can count the number of times you've been griefed on one hand need to tell me where you hang out. Do you spend all your time at home? (Oh wait, I've been griefed at home too.) Is your idea of griefing completely different from mine? Or do people here just like to shoot at dogs?

As a matter of fact I do spend a lot of time on my own land, a 512m parcel in a mainland sim owned primarily by furries who live and hangout right across the Linden owned street. I also go out to clubs and shop and do the other things I assume most people in SL do. I see people with guns sometimes, I never worry about it as they are usually holstered. Even if they were wielding them I'd still not worry, one of the few times I've been "attacked" was by some idiot with a freebie AK-47 which did pretty much nothing whatsoever to me. I've also been hit with a freebie cagegun (annoying but hardly OMG!worthy since I just TPed outta it) and orbited once, although that was a case of my being too close to a pack of zombies in a RP sim and being shot by someone who didn't know they were using orbit rounds. (Idiot.)

Trying to tease-apart the actual objectives of this... maybe there's a simpler way to get most of what's desired without all the collateral damage.

What if there were a "cloaking" flag that could be set on parcels (or some Estate-defined domain of a region or regions, maybe), rather like Jillian's "privacy pocket"? Within the cloaked parcel, everything would work for everybody just like it does now, but for stuff outside the parcel, the agents inside would appear offline. (Ideally, all content within the parcel would be invisible from outside the parcel; this has age-restriction benefits, too, but is considerably more ambitious.)

There's still some ill-defined consequences at parcel boundaries, I guess, but it's less of a bizarro-world than would result from having agent-specific privacy settings that behave differently depending where the agent is and what they're doing.

One place this alternative wouldn't help is public sandboxes. But for reasons Tali listed, I have grave doubts about the scalability of public sandboxes anyway. And I suppose, for a particular class of griefer gizmo, any public area would be similarly problematic. But as mentioned, there are all the other griefer gizmos anyway, so... I dunno. Making those more prevalent by restricting this class doesn't seem like a huge win.

(Puppet, honestly I've only been individually griefed once--by an adfarmer no less--back in the good old days of yellow smiley faces. No idea why not more--it's not like I don't get around, and my scrawny avatar is often mistaken for a kid, so I'd think that might make it more of a target. Charmed existence, I guess. )

Depends on whether you count a newbie opening fire or running me over with the lastest vehicle they have just picked up from Yadni's as griefing. I just sit down and ignore them.
It seems to me that the more rabid people are about writing long documents of rules, the more likely people are to toe the line. I hang out a *lot* in a sandbox where the admin team works from one, single rule: "Don't be a d*ck". The rest is common sense from there, which gives a laid-back attitude where people can goof around and just go with the flow. Conversely, if somebody gives a newbie grief there, one of the old-timers will step in and help. Amazingly, many times, just saying something to the effect of "Hey, cool it, or pick on somebody your own age" is enough. Otherwise, teach the newbie to sit down and ignore; getting ignored by a newbie seems to have a *very* detrimental effect on griefer morale. -And of course, there's likely to be an admin online who can drop by and put the hammer down if really needed.
My point here is that it's really about a community feel. The sandbox is *our* place; hopefully not in a cliquish way, but something to nurture.

It seems fine to me providing the land owner can turn it off.

The main places to turn it off are scripted combat areas (like the various DCS sims) where you need objects owned by different people to be able to affect others.

In all other places I see it as a good tool against griefers.

I was grieved once, by two Italian guys at the animation warehouse, they somehow attached themselves to my av and a string of abusive language spammed the screen, yes it did shock me for a few seconds, but I got out unhurt, I also realise that they just probably thought it was hilarious and had no idea that it would bother me.

I have lived daily on a sandbox for 3 months, usually at least 8 hours a day, I hardly see anyone, I never have been bothered, a few avs sail on by.

Victims CAN sometimes be the problem, sometimes people put themselves in to a position to be grieved, however, that doesn't mean I think they deserve to be grieved, they don't. As in real life where people can learn not to be a muggers victim, in SL you can also take actions to stop yourself being a 'victim' of grieving.

I might draw YOUR attention to the fact that I have no intent to view this proposed 'feature' and have said NOTHING at all concerning anything I may own.

I have stated facts while at the same time you continue to respond to others who raise valid points and concerns in a manner which clearly shows the sort of attitude not needed anywhere in Second Life or the Internet and even the Real World in general.

Your 'choice' as it stands would at the very least require a warning before activation to ensure that the average joe and jane user will not complain when they are unable to purchase items off of things like the SLX or out of a remote location vendor.

The simple fact that you seem to scorn such scripts and items tells me quite simply that you really do not care much for what an average user may want and instead care only for what you and whatever group you may (or may not) speak for wants.

Now, something to take note of: MOST if not ALL Vendor systems do NOT randomly message a user with any type of request (that is one part of the 'purpose' for this out the window), Most Animation systems are initiated by the user actually CLICKING on the object in question (those that do not have a no button on them AND are already blocked by the current 'busy' mode anyway - another item in this 'purpose' removed by current tools) lastly you have 'griefer' scripts ... Pray tell, what do you consider a 'griefer' script? Would that happen to be any sort of sensor system?

I personally have a chat range radar (several in fact) that I use to keep track of who is near me at all times. It is most useful when tracking down a GRIEFER to abuse report them ... I do not know nor really care what your experience with griefers is/was, most will not hang around to be reported and nearly all of them would be smart enough to use this new mode to their advantage.

So far as I can see - you have raised NO valid points for the implementation of this JIRA entry: Busy Mode works just fine, as does actually taking the time to fly up to damn near 4096m and using a building platform (most sensor scripts have a 96m radius ... Get well outside that and you cannot be seen for quite some time).

Do you have a truly valid reason for pushing this 'feature' request?

I've said all I need to. You can keep ranting though.

You have said nothing at all except to rehash the exact same argument time and again within this thread. If you did not wish anyone to challenge you to post a truly valid reason for having this 'feature' implemented ... You should not have created this topic.

As far as 'ranting' goes? Is that your answer and defense when challenged to come up with a valid reason for blocking off the ability of the average joe user to purchase content or to use the various third party, off Second Life market sites?

Let me see if I can manage to put this in a way you can understand hmm?

'Privacy' mode will cause anyone that uses it OUTSIDE of closing off all contact in any form so they can build or script MAJOR problems if they forget to turn it off. It will also cause the average user who turns it on and leaves it on major problems when shopping at a remote location for any form of content. In addition it will prevent users of this 'feature' from actually using any sort of third party marketing system!

The functions you wish to prevent can already be avoided by simply setting Busy Mode and flying well above the 1 to 2k meter range (all dialog boxes will be declined automatically, sensors cannot currently track that high up).

from all that I have seen in just this thread alone and in your own posts you operate under the delusion that you speak for any number of users ... You do not speak for anyone but yourself.

If you are going to refuse to provide a valid reason for having this 'feature' implemented, come out and say so .... That way at the very least you can be dismissed as having only your own interests in mind.

Gets popcorn.

well even to me, this appears to be the typical response by someone with their head up their arse, fighting invisible nazi's only them selves can see, preaching to save us from children bearing guns, LOL. I think someone should point out this thread in the JIRA proposal.

I think it does raise one serious issue, there should be the ability to vote AGAINST a jira.

But popcorn is yummy! I want some!

I like the idea of giving people more options, I really do. This proposal seems to be a bit extreme, however, and would require more examination to determine exactly how it could be implemented without doing too much "damage". I think if it were implemented, people would really need to have a good understanding exactly what they could and couldn't do if they chose to operate in privacy mode. However, I think too many people would just turn it on, not understanding how it works, and then complain when their transactions fail and their scripted items don't work properly.

Getting griefed bothers some people more than others, of course, but I wouldn't tell someone that they should just blow it off and not worry about it, or that somehow they're bringing it on themselves. I think it's very rarely the victim's fault - sometimes you just run across someone who's looking for trouble and it's your unlucky day. It's not a bad idea to look at options to help people protect themselves, and perhaps this Jira discussion can help people look at these options and find the best solutions.

Sorry this is a bad idea, if you are that hasseled by griefers then I would find a new place to work.. I spend hours working on many builds, and have never had a problem.. The few times I was griefed it was because I was standing in a sandbox or in a "welcome" area (which have to be the most un-welcoming places I have ever seen). Even then, I just went to movelock, took pictures, and AR'd the griefers before muting them. I really see absolutely NO NEED for this.

mmmm, either that, or someone who has posted many times, and is tired of people who seem to want to ignore the posts, and use that as an argument to troll.

You pick.

Yep, whats needed is constructive discussion. I like options too.

You're making assumptions about the conditions folks are playing under that are not necessarily true.