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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
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12-26-2009 12:22
I disagree, that wasn't a lazy man's survey.
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Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/
"And now I'm going to show you something really cool." Skyhook Station - http://xrl.us/skyhook23 Coonspiracy Store - http://xrl.us/coonstore |
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Treasure Ballinger
Virtual Ability
Join date: 31 Dec 2007
Posts: 2,745
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12-26-2009 12:29
it's another survery! can't they just go away? I prefer newbs ![]() I prefer noobs too. Especially nice ones, still new enough to be starry eyed and excited about SL, and interested in learning what there is to learn, and falling in love with it. The ones who ask questions, accept the answers, and learn. Yeah, I like noobs._____________________
To LL: Sometimes I wondered, I didn't understand; just where you were trying to go, only you knew the plan. I tried to be there but you wouldn't let me in........
*************************************************** To my forum friends: I'm Missing You........... |
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Lance Corrimal
I don't do stupid.
Join date: 9 Jun 2006
Posts: 877
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12-26-2009 15:30
I disagree, that wasn't a lazy man's survey. every approach to getting to know SL that does not involve at least 350 hours in-world is lazy. _____________________
Your maturity rating is directly reflected by the number of question marks you place at the end of a question. Those who enter any virtual world with the main purpose of making money at it...probably won't. |
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Void Singer
Int vSelf = Sing(void);
Join date: 24 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,973
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12-27-2009 01:44
I could care less about the perceived legitimacy of any survey or it's writers, I don't even base my decisions on how lazy or not the surveyors efforts are.
what I DO care about is what purpose it serves. does it address a useful and actionable issue? is it in any way applicable to improving actual conditions, preferably for me and mine. if it's just about esoteric knowledge, or getting the surveyor through their class or degree program, or attacking a segment of culture me and mine belong to, then you can kindly go piss into the wind. I don't see this survey meeting the first criteria, and have serious concerns that it meets the second... _____________________
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Marianne Little
A hopeless fool
Join date: 14 Aug 2007
Posts: 645
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12-27-2009 01:53
I prefer noobs too. Especially nice ones, still new enough to be starry eyed and excited about SL, and interested in learning what there is to learn, and falling in love with it. The ones who ask questions, accept the answers, and learn. Yeah, I like noobs.Me too! Oh I remember the stars I had in my own eyes when i was new... ahh nostalgia. |
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Jumpman Lane
JUMPY!!!
Join date: 7 May 2007
Posts: 2,114
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12-27-2009 06:25
its a psyche test i think we're crazy! reminds me of the timei tried totake over public townscape
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Ya girlfriend says she loves meh! But it's just the jewlreh! Multicolored carots got ya girlfriend kinda curious!
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 06:37
Oh my - if I knew that people would respond so much to this survey, I would have posted it on a day when I wouldn't be away from the computer for a couple of days.
I want to thank the folks who have taken the survey, and have discussed it here. The research is very important to me, and I appreciate you taking the time. I'll respond to the points you have made now. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 06:42
I did the survey and have a few comments. I have to admit that it is better done than most of the surveys we're asked to do. 1. Two of the questions (which appear more than once) are worded in a way that I think will cause some people to answer opposite to what they intend, since all the other questions are negated in a more natural way: "There is no one offline that I feel comfortable talking to about intimate personal problems." "I do not know people offline well enough to get them to do anything important." 2. Questions on the page "Relationship of Second Life Use to Rest of Life" are repetitive. They ask the same things several times in the same way. 3. *Requiring* demographic information will limit responses. Many people will complete the pages up to that point and then stop. On that last point, you might want to list that requirement on your cover page. If I minded giving my age, sex, and income, I might be a bit angry at discovering that at the END of the survey. Seven, thanks for the feedback. I get what you're saying about the scale items - both #1 & #2 above. Thanks. Just so you know, filling out #3 is not required - the informed consent listed the demographic questions I would ask, and explained that all items of the survey are optional. Actually, properly-designed web surveys should always allow you to skip any question - this is in keeping with paper surveys which allow you to skip items, and avoiding potential harm by forcing individuals to respond to questions. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 06:49
Hi, I feel kind of bad for you, and I did read your response in the 'Survey' thread, where you posted that you're aware of this kind of response and chose to post your survey here anyway. Just wanted to mention that in my group Virtual Ability, we often host grad students, people doing thesis, doctoral and ph.d candidates, from various unis around the country and out of the USA too. I recently did an interview for a grad student in the UK, about being deaf in SL. When my groups learned of it, lots of them wanted to be interviewed too. In our case, mostly they want to know about virtual worlds and the disabled. These people come inworld, they learn how it works, they hang out with us. They come to our parties, they get to know us, they ask if they can interview us (once we get to know them and feel comfortable) and they never ask us for RL demographics, even though, we are a RL corporation/non profit and that info is actually pretty easily found. They read our website, by the time they are ready to actually ask us questions, they already know a lot. We advise our group that they are here with us, sharing our SL experience, and IF a group member would like to be interviewed, they are more than welcome to contact the student/researcher. It really is a better way. I understand that info on the disabled in virtual worlds isn't what you are going for, here, but just showing you that actually getting to know us, inworld, find yourself an amenable group and join in, heck you may not even need to ask questions, you'll learn it all for yourself. Best of luck to you. Thanks for explaining this, Treasure! I like your approach, and I definitely like Virtual Ability's cause - I just checked out the website. Best of luck to you, too. Your post brought up a slightly-related subject, which I've been also interested in - the impact of the introduction of audible conversation on Second Life. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 06:53
SOP for sorting out differing valuations based on wording. backhanded tactic for getting edge case people that might have stopped if it were on the first page, some of them may go ahead and complete this anyways so that don't feel they've wasted their time. Wow ... this was not what I intended, Void. I actually put them there because I thought they would be easier questions than the ones before it - sort of like a wind-down at the end of the survey. Thanks for letting me know. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 06:56
Listing yourself as a tourist shows the usual level of respect I've seen from folks doing studies of us little lab rats. Meanwhile, this may help you in your study: Hmm ... perhaps I should have called myself "Visitor". I felt like a tourist because I didn't own property yet in SL, so I wanted to call myself something other than a resident. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 07:03
You do realize that as a result of being constantly "invited" to participate in surveys, that most SL forum denizens become so irritated by these invitations that they actually go out of their way to answer your questions in such a way as to completely skew and throw off the results? Nothing good (well, perhaps seldom) ever comes from posting survey requests. Please review other posts on methods for potential improvements to your study. Elric, Thanks. Yes, I know that people might use my survey to vent about surveys. And I did do searches of surveys on your forum, as well as others, to understand how people reacted to them. It had seemed that people were frustrated about the quality of the surveys - "My anthro professor told me I had to research SL, so here are 10 questions" sort of thing. I thought providing a well-designed survey might get a different response ... but it seems that I was wrong. ![]() I also had limitations because I was surveying both WoW and SL - I had to find a common denominator of survey delivery between them, and forums appeared to be the clearest option. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 07:10
Why does everyone see WoW and SL as synonymous worlds? How can you, or anyone else, equate SL with WoW? If I thought they were synonymous, I would not be comparing them. I'd save myself a lot of trouble to just research one or the other, and then generalize the results to all MMOGs.The research is hoping to dispell some myths of being identical, or at least identify how SL & WoW social life are alike and how they are different. If I had to hazard a guess, the confusion might be related to the research on how people that are more similar to you appear more heterogeneous, and that groups of individuals that are dissimilar to you appear more homogenous. I don't have a reference right now, but I can hunt it down if you're interested. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 07:14
I suppose I could, but I don't care quite that much. Here's my comment: This would work much better as a split-plot design, where membership in Problematic and Non-problematic groups is determined by some plausible objective means. It will be difficult to devise any compelling interpretation of correlational results that rely on survey responses for participants to self-identify as having problematic usage patterns. Also, I did the researcher a huge favour by not participating, because I could only contribute to and possibly exacerbate the massive sampling bias introduced by soliciting Forums readers as subjects. This is a study about social behaviours, and yet it's selectively sampling participants in a specific social medium--these Forums--distinct from the universe about which conclusions are to be drawn. That's a Very Bad Idea. Qie, excellent points. First one is a really fascinating point, and could lead to a huge discussion of the nature of "problematic" vs. "non-problematic" which I can't have yet. Second one is lamentable, but true. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 07:23
@ the OP: I'm just curious if this is part of, or related to the VERUS study, in collaboration with SFU and York, looking at the relationships between the real-world characteristics of users and the individual activities and group dynamics of their avatars in VWs? FYI .. this might give you a similar idea of the type of user you are dealing with here in the forums http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWYhih-ve7M (nsfw) Joshooah, Actually, this isn't - the study sounds fascinating, but I can't find it on the web - would you send me a URL? What you're describing above also reminds me of Sherry Turkle's work with identity development, as well as Nick Yee's recent work: http://www.nickyee.com/cv.html My work is standalone, but is an extension of the work done by researchers such as Williams, Caplan, and others. Ha ha I sense the sympathy, and I appreciate it. Actually, I think folks have been quite reasonable - they've obviously got a bad taste in their mouths around surveys. I'm sorry it took me 3 days to get back here due to travelling - I think people deserved answers sooner. |
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Elric Anatine
Full Lunar Alchemist
Join date: 27 Feb 2007
Posts: 381
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12-27-2009 07:27
I know, everyone is sick to death of surveys. But he asked nicely, is an accredited researcher on a legitimate project, and truthfully, don't we all want there to be serious examinations of virtual worlds (as opposed to yet another sensationalistic "news" article"? I don't think the issue is the legitimate nature of the survey but the fact that it's obvious the researcher knows nothing about SL. It's insulting, quite frankly. It's akin to my joining a forum devoted to French Revolutionary history and then asking a series of surface question, including "how similar is Les Mis to real occurrences", all of which could be answered by taking some time to actually READ and LEARN about the subject. So the answer is: YES, we want serious examinations and some of us are willing to answer legitimate surveys IF the student has a serious interest and takes the time to LEARN about the subject at hand FIRST. _____________________
Elric Anatine
![]() http://slurl.com/secondlife/Alkahest/128/128/652 +Distinguished Aesthetics+ - unabashed commentary & reviews by a gentleman of the grid - http://www.sge-sl.com/elric_anatine/ +Apothecary & Home+ http://slurl.com/secondlife/Syzygy%20Selene/134/171/39 |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 07:30
This looks to be a legitimately-designed study from an accredited graduate program. Not only that, but when I took a quick look this morning I found that work has been done on quantifying selection bias in on-line surveys, which should at least help the OP interpret the results. Of course, everyone given to self-serious tantruming and laughable claims about "faux-science" can and should continue to carry on having fun regardless; it's just part of the social game that is SL. Egil, Thanks. I appreciate what you said.As an aside, I do agree that clinical psychology has some pseudoscientific beliefs, and I have found that frustrating at times as an ex-software engineer. I also think it's going through a revolution right now, and might look very different in the near future. |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 07:35
I know, everyone is sick to death of surveys. But he asked nicely, is an accredited researcher on a legitimate project, and truthfully, don't we all want there to be serious examinations of virtual worlds (as opposed to yet another sensationalistic "news" article"? Thanks, Virrginia - I hoped that this research would have led to a greater understanding of the social life of Second Life, as well as WoW. I did a presentation recently in front of an audience of 100 psychologists about technology, and you should have seen how many experienced psychologists were interested in understanding Second Life. |
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Elric Anatine
Full Lunar Alchemist
Join date: 27 Feb 2007
Posts: 381
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I recant!
12-27-2009 07:39
Elric, Thanks. Yes, I know that people might use my survey to vent about surveys. And I did do searches of surveys on your forum, as well as others, to understand how people reacted to them. It had seemed that people were frustrated about the quality of the surveys - "My anthro professor told me I had to research SL, so here are 10 questions" sort of thing. I thought providing a well-designed survey might get a different response ... but it seems that I was wrong. ![]() I also had limitations because I was surveying both WoW and SL - I had to find a common denominator of survey delivery between them, and forums appeared to be the clearest option. heh. You know, I sit here pondering the ever present survey and media debacle that surrounds SL and realize something just now: People such as myself are happy to share our experiences, and wish to do so with students and media persons that will present SL in an accurate light. We demand the researcher takes the time to learn SL FIRST or ask for guidance/touring etc. The reality... by the time a researcher has a true grasp of the SL environment, 3 to 6 months have passed and that's not necessarily time wisely spent. So really, I am being unfair in my demands that researchers learn SL more deeply. Will the media or researchers ever be able to discuss SL accurately? Perhaps one day when more persons are actually engaged in the virtual world. But not now. /me is just talking out loud. PS: To the OP, I do wish you luck with your research because the questions are acceptable although I can't help but groan that fingerpointing will occur soon after to cite SL as the second satanic rising, responsible for strife, and become the scourge of the world. But I do wish you well AND, seriously hope you find more time to be in world, because SL is truly a spectacular place. _____________________
Elric Anatine
![]() http://slurl.com/secondlife/Alkahest/128/128/652 +Distinguished Aesthetics+ - unabashed commentary & reviews by a gentleman of the grid - http://www.sge-sl.com/elric_anatine/ +Apothecary & Home+ http://slurl.com/secondlife/Syzygy%20Selene/134/171/39 |
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Anthony Luponox
Tourist
Join date: 31 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
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12-27-2009 07:41
What I want to know is who defined the "potential signs of problematic use"? Can anyone, other than myself and my family, decide if my SL usage is having any negative impacts on my RL? This is a really good question, which I can't discuss during the survey. But let me just say that it's a huge question in the research field right now, so your inquiry is right on target. |
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Elric Anatine
Full Lunar Alchemist
Join date: 27 Feb 2007
Posts: 381
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12-27-2009 07:41
Thanks, Virrginia - I hoped that this research would have led to a greater understanding of the social life of Second Life, as well as WoW. I did a presentation recently in front of an audience of 100 psychologists about technology, and you should have seen how many experienced psychologists were interested in understanding Second Life. You know... I just had a thought. How realistic would it be to pair researchers with one or several SL veterans? Like a buddy system? SL mentors have evaporated, but I'm sure that a group of genuinely interested and knowledgeable SL persons could form a group that would be happy to "tell it like it is" for the benefit of researchers and put them on the fast track of understanding. _____________________
Elric Anatine
![]() http://slurl.com/secondlife/Alkahest/128/128/652 +Distinguished Aesthetics+ - unabashed commentary & reviews by a gentleman of the grid - http://www.sge-sl.com/elric_anatine/ +Apothecary & Home+ http://slurl.com/secondlife/Syzygy%20Selene/134/171/39 |
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Joshooah Lovenkraft
Just Joshin'
Join date: 28 Dec 2007
Posts: 1,376
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12-27-2009 08:34
Joshooah, Actually, this isn't - the study sounds fascinating, but I can't find it on the web - would you send me a URL? What you're describing above also reminds me of Sherry Turkle's work with identity development, as well as Nick Yee's recent work: http://www.nickyee.com/cv.html My work is standalone, but is an extension of the work done by researchers such as Williams, Caplan, and others. Ha ha I sense the sympathy, and I appreciate it. Actually, I think folks have been quite reasonable - they've obviously got a bad taste in their mouths around surveys. I'm sorry it took me 3 days to get back here due to travelling - I think people deserved answers sooner.Here's a press release: http://www.sfu.ca/pamr/media_releases/media_releases_archives/media_12090902.html _____________________
Hello Avatard - Your Emporium of Fun Stuff In-world: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Fordham/178/19/63 Xstreet: https://www.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&MerchantID=103499 |
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LittleMe Jewell
...........
Join date: 8 Oct 2007
Posts: 11,319
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12-27-2009 09:12
Elric, Thanks. Yes, I know that people might use my survey to vent about surveys. And I did do searches of surveys on your forum, as well as others, to understand how people reacted to them. It had seemed that people were frustrated about the quality of the surveys - "My anthro professor told me I had to research SL, so here are 10 questions" sort of thing. I thought providing a well-designed survey might get a different response ... but it seems that I was wrong. ![]() There is legitimacy in studying SL and other online venues in order to better understand various social elements. Not only do we get totally swamped by survey requests, where too many are obviously just trying to quickly handle an assignment without putting in much effort, but we are also used to almost complete negative portrayal in the media. Unfortunately that does taint our view of any sort of survey or media interest. _____________________
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-Lil Why do you sit there looking like an envelope without any address on it? ~Mark Twain~ Optimism is denial, so face the facts and move on. ♥♥♥ Lil's Yard Sale / Inventory Cleanout: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Triggerfish/52/27/22 . http://www.flickr.com/photos/littleme_jewell |
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LittleMe Jewell
...........
Join date: 8 Oct 2007
Posts: 11,319
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12-27-2009 09:17
This is a really good question, which I can't discuss during the survey. But let me just say that it's a huge question in the research field right now, so your inquiry is right on target.When I was researching surveys a bit yesterday, I came across this other research paper that had been done on MMORPGs back in late 2002. I was impressed with the note that had been added in early 2006 showing that at least some researchers really are open-minded enough to see things a bit differently down the road. http://www.nickyee.com/hub/addiction/home.html and more info on the project as a whole here: http://www.nickyee.com/daedalus/ . _____________________
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-Lil Why do you sit there looking like an envelope without any address on it? ~Mark Twain~ Optimism is denial, so face the facts and move on. ♥♥♥ Lil's Yard Sale / Inventory Cleanout: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Triggerfish/52/27/22 . http://www.flickr.com/photos/littleme_jewell |
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Mickey Vandeverre
See you Inworld
Join date: 7 Dec 2006
Posts: 2,542
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12-27-2009 09:39
Anthony - why is it that the "research" is reduced to a survey only? Because it takes less time? It's been a while since I was studying....but in the old days.....we did actual research.
You said that you spent months developing your survey. A survey that is obviously going to be a huge Fail, based on the comments you received in this thread, and the fact that you seem to be limiting it to forum participants....while a huge population of people are immersed in SL, that never come to forum. But if all you need, is to get through your course of study....without actual facts.....but just a completed project......no biggie. Done. In another thread, you mention researchers "who wish to support the SL".......what exactly does that mean? Support in what way? By evaluating information inaccurately.....then tossing it out to the general public? It takes about two hours to create a "character".....if you have someone guiding you inworld.....and people love guiding someone. Within about 3 more hours.....you can become totally immersed, and your character takes on a life of their own.....defined. Proceed from there. Or....you can go in as "yourself"....and study from that angle....huge section of the population contributes in this way. The immersion can happen very quickly.....rapid pace, here. That couple of months that you spent developing your survey, could have been spent in immersion. Plus....you would have a pretty accurate picture of what goes on....an education that goes far beyond a survey limits. During those months you could have developed half a dozen other characters to get an even broader grasp. The time it takes to respond to this thread......yet another character could have delved into the real aspects. During that time....you will most likely experience any "problematic" behaviors first hand. Very few are going to want to admit to those behaviors, and plug them into a survey. What's important to you at the completion of your studies? That you found facts and info and presented it effectively? Genuine enlightenment? Or simply that you completed the task? I've offered many times to help a surveyor immerse and get real facts....not once have they taken me up on the offer. Probably because their project was due in a few weeks, and they already wasted their allotted time on battling with a failed survey. Same offer to you....unless your project is due next week, and your time allotment is gone. I swear....you guys with these surveys, make me want to go back and finish the master's in psych.....and complete a REAL study. Thanks for the motivation. |