Forcing You To Buy to Enter a Sim?

/me pulls the sofa out of inventory and settles in with her bowl of popcorn.

We each have our own impression of SL. To me it is no more a game than the real world is. And just like the real world it's full of a lot of people with a lot of different motivations, interests and goals, which for many of us are business related. I respect that you are interested in a different SL experience from mine. It isn't really a slap in the face that other people are living different types of second lives from yours.

QFT!

Personally, Black Swan would have to pay me to return there - it just wasn't my bag.

I enjoyed Greenies the couple of times I went there but as you said, one or two times and I was ready to move on.

I answered yes to attend a live performance (MUCH easier than figuring out all the tipping etiquette) - but answered no to get into Black Swan. Heck...I wouldn't go back to Black Swan if it was free.

I would totally pay $L99 to visit Greenies, but I've been there before, and know I love it. Black Swan, I've not tried, but probably will.

I don't know how all the people who put so much into making SL a wonderful, fascinating environment for us make ends meet. DJ's, Live peformers, and the wonderful builds. I always tip performers and DJ's, but TBH, I often forget the venues.

/me makes a note to go inworld tonight and drop some cash in the jar at Inspire Space park.

Ironically people being opposed to having to pay entry fees is exactly what keeps purely social places in SL from being able to sustain themselves. Not many people can afford $295 a month without recouping their expenses some way. I think you're being offended at the wrong people. SL could and would be a lot less commercial if LL made the tier pricing more affordable.

This topic has come up before.

I still think they should have gone through their records and sent people who have bought items at Black Swan and Rezzable Collecters Gallery a free pass. To have bought more than a few things at these places then be told I can't come back if I don't spend a few more L$ left a really bad taste in my mouth.

I don't object to the idea in general - not at all - but the way it was implemented will be something I remember before I pull out my checkbook again there.

It's very simple really.

The OP is annoyed that they can not enter the place.
This indicates that they think the content is worth experiencing.
The level of annoyance as indicated by the trouble taken to express it in this thread indicates that they think the content is *really* worth experiencing.

So hand over less than US$1 for access to a place that is apparently
- well worth experiencing
- less lagged than might otherwise be the case

Exactly. Even a nice notice that the policy was changing would have been nice.

The only reason I originally went to Black Swan was because I wanted to buy some of the "Inspired by" outfits that creators were highlighting on their blog. That until I saw the price tag anyway, L$1500 for an outfit of questionable quality (no demos) that's not even a limited edition item that I'll likely wear once to a costumed event is just plain ridiculous.

I went back just now to see if they had bothered moving those items to a freely accessible area of the sim, but they're still where they were. Paying L$200 just for the privilege of entering what amounts to a store selling overpriced costumes and statues does seem just a little bit over the top.

---

BTW- you can cam down from the skybox to where the original underwater landing point was just a few days ago and buy the authorization device from there for L$0 . You can even see most of the sim from up there too since the sim's interest list never did care about draw distance along the Z-axis (smaller prims are still culled from your interest list but you can see most of what's there to see without the need to pay).

Back to the drawing board for them.

It would be an interesting study for someone to conduct to determine whether more revenue for a sim were generated from donations or entry fees.

My guess, based on what I think I know about the SL economy and consumer psychology, is that in the long run, more money would be collected through voluntary donations rather than entry feeds, all other things being equal.

Part of my guess is based on the fact that I see very, very few places charging entry fees, and many places that have non-mandatory tip jars that do actually get filled. Unless I have reason to expect otherwise, I assume that this is evidence of a free market determining a winning method when it comes to generating operation revenue for sims.

Personally, I have made a few donations to places just to keep a sim I liked running (admittedly, not many donations and not huge donations). I don't recall ever paying an entry fee to a place, and my quick instinct when I see an entry fee is to avoid the place.

As Chip pointed out, it's hard for nice, purely social places to remain in operation if the expense is going to be borne entirely by one person. Even in figuring out the best way of generating revue for operation costs (entry fees or donations), I doubt either, alone, is going to be enough for anyone to be compensated for the time they spend running the place, if it even comes close to covering tier expenses at all.

Nope. No dress code. Never was, either.

People tend to like to participate, but it is certainly not required. And after two and a half good years I guess that's enough time to prove that this philosophy works out okay.

I know "avatar rights" have been kicked around a lot, and laughed at perhaps, but... I think there's something to it.

Funny there should be such fuss over charging for entry, yet when people demand conformity there is almost no fuss. Sure, people can ask for both. But I see more need to ask for admission to cover tier, than ask someone to change how they choose to represent themselves.

That's interesting...for a sim that is charging admission. Thanks for posting that, Kitty.

(Still not interested in going back, but did find that interesting.)

BTW Steely, thanks for posting your comments. It's the liveliest Thread of the day

Glad we could get a discussion going. That is the the purpose of a forum.

I guess I'm just an open-source, non-drm pinko commie at heart.

Greenies (September 2007)


Black Swan when it was called Rezzable Hallucinogen (and picture from October 2007):

This might have already been mentioned but they change stuff at Greenies all the time (or did back in 2007 when I kept going back there. Looks different when I went last week or week before, but then it had been a while since I was last there).

oh, hehe, this indicates that while I am reasonably sure Black Swan used to be Rezzable Hallucinogen, it doesn't look a thing like it did. There were no dresses to buy there (or anything to buy there for that matter) when I was last there.

No where in SL has ever impressed me as much as Greenies.

Privateer Space impressed me more, but that was because it was something like four worlds spread across, I think, four sims that was entered by way of flying around (in a shapeship or otherwise; the worlds were entered that way, darn, I am not explaining correctly; I use "was" because it is closed now, or was last time I tried going there).

Greenies did and does impress me. The yard extension Sim is less impressive, but then I went there the first time before they had really put any of the "neat" stuff down. I do not mean that it does not impress me, just that the wow factor is slightly less since I already knew of Greenies before seeing the yard extension.

(and heh, this pic is from 2008, July even!)

The concept will remain the same though and for me personally at least it's only interesting as a novelty the first time. After that, even with changes, it's just more of the same and not interesting enough to bother visting a second time.

I liked Greenies because it something different and new, a return visit wouldn't be even nearly as compelling or worthwhile. Same theme, different display doesn't have much appeal.

A lot of it is as it was back when the region was named Hallucinogen. The dresses are fairly new addition, off to the side just above the water.

I would happily pay L$199 cover charge to attend a live music event. I would not pay that to enter Black Swan or Greenies, or any other place that doesn't have some sort of live music/event going on.

QFT.

We all know how much it costs to obtain and maintain a private sim, without adding the costs of having a staff to support it. It's just too expensive to run out of the goodness of your own heart, and the population as a whole spends less per capita. You cannot rely on people to donate because tipping isn't part of their culture, and the greater masses either don't know or don't care how much it costs to run a sim, much less a network of developed sims.

You cannot expect SL to not become commercialized when you know what the costs are to run a sim. Not many people are willing to pay $200+ per month to maintain a piece of digital art. And not many people are willing to tip, either, to keep it running. So long as the cost of entry is fairly low, I would be willing to pay. Once this model becomes more prevalent in SL, we will really see who is here for the long run.