Hard work ain't enough anymore...

I guess I know that, I've set those prices. )

You know, it's the same amount of work for me, as for them, and as I pointed out earlier, I give a lot of extras, customer support is faster, cause I have more time for my customers atm...

Anyway, thx for taking a look, hopefully I'll become one of those big names one day, that will solve this problem.

One thing I know for sure: Don't do anything in SL for the money. Do it for fun. The hours you spend on any project here will render most of them money-losing propositions compared with how much time it takes to make money in RL. I'm guessing it was fun spending those hundreds of hours making your skin...now have fun trying to sell it.

Thanks guys, Bree, how did you know that I love cats? That picture made my day.

Wait for some of those people who bought your skin to tell people where they got it from, etc.

Im sure your shapes business didnt take off overnight, either. Mine didnt and I helped get the whole ball rolling.

Take out what classified ads you can, maybe just 1k or 500L , some people dont want to buy from the 100K ad places becuase they dont want to look like everyone else.

Also consider an "introductory" price .. make it clear the real price will be X , but offer the skin for 2 weeks or a month at a discount.

Good luck.

Oh, one more thing, before I forget it, it's miles easier to create a subtle skin from a heavily shaded one, than the other way around. I made a subtle version of the face in about 10 minutes, it might be a bit too subtle, but that was my first try.

Making a subtle skin seamless is totally different, a whole lot easier, lot less shades to work with. I might make a special version for you Ann - on the house. It will be good for learning.

Here's the result of 10 minute tweak:

Thx Colette, the introductory price is a nice idea, I'm going to use it.

I have an ad for 550L$, that's the most I can afford atm.

It's weird, but my shapes store always earned 15-30K/month, right from the start (and I really mean days here). But that was back in February, and it's a lot easier to advertise shapes.

On top of that, my main strength is the face, I can make pretty faces (I made very popular face mods for the RPG hit - TES4: Oblivion, so I had the experience), and a pretty face on a picture sells a shape much easier, than a pretty body.

I guess that's part of my problem, put too much emphasize on the face, but it seems that most people are looking for nice bodies when they look for a skin.

hi Pelthar

another suggestion for you....do you have an update group for your shapes customers at all ? If so make sure to send out notices letting people know when you bring out new skins etc. Our group is a vip one, which you have to be invited to by having custom work or spending a certain amount with us. Our vips then get special discount days just for them, and they get to see our new tattoos first because we advertise them to our vip group first. You could also try free give aways to one or two group members a month, anything that makes them feel special and makes them remember you is all good, as they are then more likely to mention your store in conversation with friends.
If you don't have a group set up yet I would strongly suggest you do, whether you have it as open join or by invite only is up to you, but I do know for a fact that ours definitely helps to improve our sales when we release new content.

I think you're probably entering a saturated market. And L$6500 sounds a lot for a skin - I have a CS one that cost me L$1000 and it's as good as any I've seen. For a long time I had another CS skin, the Malibu Passport, which was free - my current one is just a minor upgrade from that.

I dare say you can also pay a lot more than L$6500 for a skin too, but for most people there is not much point in achieving a super photo-realism that is lost in the general environment of SL graphics.

I used to sell my products - mostly houses, from small stalls on 64m plots dotted around the grid. Sales dropped off to nothing over the months, which seems a general trend in SL recently, so I sold the stalls to buy more land in my home sim.

I know that I should have worked more with the group I have, but the thing is, I didn't use the group much, so I don't really have anybody in there. That will change.

Conifer, 1 skin costs 1000L$ and you get a shape, an eyepack and the skin itself. THe 6500L$ was the price I was paid by my 3 customers altogether, one of them boought the whole pack for 3500.

See thats the problem with SL today right there.. Im sorry but people in here are fricking cheap! 6500 is NOT let me repeat... 6500 is NOT to much for a good quality skin. I am a builder and I know how much work, time and effort goes into some of the things in SL to make all our lives better in here. People just don't seem to understand that fact. It's like real life... You get what you pay for. Frankly there are way to many items in SL marked way lower then they should be.

1000L$ is a decent price for a skin.

I would never buy a shape. Too easy to make them yourself. For those that do buy (or are too lazy to make), I recommend shops that sell them Mod/Copy/NoTrans for @100L$. Eyes, no more than 50L$ a set and those best be perfect.

So with a skin at 1000, the issue (with me personally, other attitudes will vary) would be paying 2500L$ for 150L$ worth of items.

Try selling the skins solo. I think you'll do better that way. Still offer the shapes and eyes, of course, and probably the packs as well, but give people the choice to just buy the skin alone and by itself.

~Jessy

Things are "cheep" because there is no "work force" in SL. The only way to have L$ is to camp, buy, or build/sell. SL is NOT set for a heavy consumer's market.

From a capitalistic point of view, you are correct. Prices are so low as the work is sometiems not worth the returns.

However, for the social viewpoint, things are pretty well balanced. I'm a bit biased, but I can not afford to throw lots of cash into SL just to buy things all the time. Yes, I'm "cheep". I watch every L$ and make anything I can myself, as well as trade with friends.

As for the 6500L$ for a skin.....I'd not even pick up the demo of that one. You may think it's not too much, but from the average prices of skins through SL, most Residents tend to disagree. And the Customer is always right ^.~

~Jessy

If the market won't bear the price of 6500L, then it is too much. When it is free from government interference, the free market always works. If customers can't or won't pay the price you are asking, then your price is too high.

Suggestion 1:
Prim eyelashes. It really helps polish the look of an up close face- and the first impression face is what you are selling. By the same note- if you're selling ultra real skin and insist on having the avatars clothed, look for clothing and accessories that are also very strong in shading and realistic folds and lay. (Last Call and Ivalde spring to mind) They'll cost- but they are an investment in the presentation.

Suggestion 2:
Split out the shape and eyes or consider them freebies. Some folks will be looking for a package deal- but unless you're selling to the pure newbie sector (in which case you'd need to lower the cost)- the older residents are already going to have shapes and eyes... and since they're not searching for shapes/eyes to find your store- they're probably not shopping for new ones and will resent being charged extra. My shape is sacred. I simply don't change it for a skin- I'll choose not to buy a skin at all if it looks odd on my shape.

Suggestion 3:
The text is difficult to read and distracts from the item you are selling. In general the ad is too "busy". If you want fancy text, consider a ~very~ plain background. I'm really bad about this myself =/

Suggestion 4:
Be patient and accept that in a dominated market you may never find your niche. You had sucess with shapes, but the shape market doesn't necessarily indicate the skin market. Some markets are just too saturated for a newcomer unless you've got something amazing and new. (Example: Me trying to break into the jewelry market. Bad idea. I'm not as good as the top guys and it's a sluggish market to begin with.)

Worst comes to worst, see about marketing near your shapes so that you can take advantage of the traffic from people whoa re already in the market for a new look.

Only sold 8 skins in your first week? Lucky you! Some weeks I don't sell anything and yet I still manage to cover my tier from my sales. The answer: don't give up! Keep plugging away at doing your thing whatever it may be.

Don't bother with your ranking in the Places ads. People consult the Places if they're looking for a club, but a shopper goes by the classifieds. Especially newbies, who are the main target audience for the skin market. They check page 1 of the classifieds and that's it; after checking 3-10 shops, they'll make their purchase decision.

Cut your price to max. 3k per skin package and perhaps 700-800 for single skins. Make sure you have a wide range of skin tones and makeup options. Then risk $150 and place a classified ad for 40k for 1 week. There's no other way to get a foot into the market, you can't expect to earn without investing first.
Advertise all your wares in one ad of course, not only the skins, to have your shape sells also shoot through the ceiling. If you make back more than you invested, make the classified ad permanent. It's a risk, but if you get sufficient revenue in the first week it can only get better, thanks to additional word-of-mouth advertising of your customers.

I don't post much but just felt compelled to say: That's the best damn philosophy I've heard since joining this fool game two years ago.

Should be in the Terms of Service.

cheers
Snow

The SL market is not designed to cater to the seller, but rather the SL consumer. As someone stated before....there's no work force, so it's camp, buy L's or try and sell... and none of these options seems to have any kind of stability.

I have a shop....I have fun creating, so opening a shop is really just a way to DO SOMETHING with my creativity. I can't be in it for the $$$....that's ridiculous. I chose to become a part of SL and I keep that in perspective. Right now sales suck lol But I honestly think it's the over all SL market right now.

As for search....you're right...it's really hard to boost your listing unless ya have traffic....but search can also be done by 'name' rather than traffic volume, which has helped me discover a lot of cool little shops that offer seemingly superior products to the big 'popular' places. And malls.... yuck.... can't stand malls. lol

You're skins are cool, but I do agree 6500 is pushing it..... I have tons of skin cause I love to play with different looks....but I wouldn't even touch a skin for that price...and I never buy entire packages cause most of the time I only like 1 or 2 in a set. And the reason I wont spend that is simple.... I don't MAKE enough to spend that....and IT'S A GAME....I cannot truly justify a shop til you drop attititude for things I can only ever access visually on my computer screen....nope, that's just crazy.

I thought he said the price was 1000L?

just wanted to say I agree you should consider selling only the skins at a lower price. I love my shape and I don´t want another so I would never look for a combined pack shape+skin, the same goes for the eyes. And I would never spent 6500 hundred in such a pack because i know I would never wear that shape or eyes.

And usually once we get a skin brand that we love its hard to change (at least for me, i'm wearing skins from the same maker since my second week in SL), so I guess that someone that starts now selling skins has to be patiente. I didn´t try a demo of yours yet but they seem nice, hang in there people will come

Hi Pelthar,

Another marketing approach that won't cost you a cent is the fashion blogs. Not everyone follows the blogs, but a lot of people who do are fairly dedicated shoppers. A review on a major fashion blog will almost certainly attract more traffic to your store. Some blogs accept review copies - doesn't mean they will feature your stuff if you submit it, but it doesn't cost you anything to send out a few copies for review.

Here is a feed with most of the major fashion blogs: http://fashionplanet.worldofsl.com/

And a list of who the fashion bloggers are: http://docs.google.com/View?docid=ajc899dr62mg_508f557m9

I write for a fashion blog and some new designers have given me feedback that their traffic and sales have doubled or even tripled following a review. Gotta be worth a try on that basis alone.

Edit: Join the group Fashion Consolidated in world too. This is a group for designers to post notices about their new releases, you will reach hundreds of people this way. You have to apply for vendor status to post notices, you can do that at http://fashcon.com/apply/

that link made a few ppl happy

/empties the savings account

As someone who has been in SL for almost 3 yrs and has quite a skin fetish as I have well over 1500 skins the last time I tried to count, I would be glad to check out some demos and give my suggestions/feedback on your skins. I can't tell a whole lot about the quality by the pics you posted as things always look different in world with different lighting and such so I'd be glad to try a few on in my spare time.

(Sonia's boyfriend, Xio Jester speaking here)

Damn straight...

Whole Foods Market would be a great example. The suppliers and products are TOP quality, but until just a few years ago...if I mentioned the company to anybody on the street they said they had never heard of it.

NOW, it's practically a "household name", in America at least. In Britain they only have one store so far, but they never rely on the high quality and or rarity of thier items (which you have to sample to really see what I mean about the difference in quality...if you live near a Whole Foods Market, go in and ask for a sample of anything. Employees have to break it open and give you one; company policy). The quality of thier product alone isn't enough to keep them in business.

Whole Foods relies mainly on word of mouth, EXCELLENT customer service, and picking good locations to put new stores (do you rent any space in high-traffic SL malls?) for advertising...TV and radio did so little for them, that they did it for a short time, then pretty much quit using those channels period. This can be compared to the SL Classifieds. A good example would be Abranimations on Devil's Moon.


Since I only have a customer service perspective on marketing in my life I'll just leave you with that, things ain't what they appear to be when it comes to SL business.