The Casino Mob Takeover of SL

Oh yes! He's a genius! Plan your repentance ahead of time and give people free land for 2 months before faking your death.. BRILLANT! </sarcasm>

Honestly I don't care about that stupid thread about his supposid demise, what I did care about was the short notice about the sale and he oppologized to me face to face in the sim. I always knew this day would come so it wasn't totally unexpected for me, I just figured I'd get a few days notice at least. Anyways during this talk with billy I learned he's leaving SL entirely becuase he can no longer afford it and refuses to go basic or lowest tier premium. From what I understand he's always been a premium user since he started and he can't imagine his Second Life countinuing on a basic account. With the way things are right now with stipends I don't blame him. Anyways I thanked him for 2 months free rent and the chance to build my first home wich was an awsome custom setup Noir Skylife skybox build. He sold the land to a friend of his, who apparently now also owns all rights to billy's stores and creations wich he's using to start up his casino. Honestly I don't know how long he'll last with Night Mountain over in Moen 3 sims away. Hell I dunno how long I'll last with Pink Rose accross the river from my build.

Oyun, you were pushy. Being the 2nd Jaffee resident and the 1st resident to complete their home I was there the whole time wich you can't deny. Hell I was there BEFORE Steelwolf. I remember you nagging me about my teleporter pad at the peak of the mountain that I claimed for the use of my skybox. I only comprimised since this was a community build and I wished to keep good relations with my neighbors. Then I saw you expanding beyond the 1024m2 area restrictment that billy layed out in the very begining on top of puting out those annoying sound spam generating meditation pillows. I was honestly waiting for you to complain to me again to move or remove my teleporter pad when I saw how your build was expanding around half the mountain. Face it bud, you're jaded because we wouldn't allow you to dominate the sim so you could have a grand build to make a name for yourself.

As much as it was great what he did.. what a crappy way to leave folks.. Sorry you guys are having to deal with this.

Like I said Pendari, this wasn't totally unexpected. I mean how long can you put out 200 a month with no payback?

Oh. I understand the no payback making things rough. Hell, I could not have done it from the start.

But, that still doesn't mean that a carpet should have been torn out from unsuspecting people. If everyone knew this was coming, then I have no sympathy. But if this was really a shock, I just think consideration for those being helped could have been taken into account.

I wouldn't give a needy person on the street a matress to sleep on, and then after a nights sleep, snatch it from him because I realized I forgot to pay the cashier, or that I did not like the store anymore. I'd let the needy person know what was going on, and that the matress *may* be gone soon. To at least make sure they knew changes could be coming. That would be the polite thing to do at least.

I do not think people are being as truthfull as they can be. I still have not removed anyones builds, they were asked to come get there things. I did not clear the sim or anything of that nature and since the first part of my build is going to be in the air I did not see a rush to move everyone out.

So no, I did not throw everyone out onto the street.

Good to hear!! It sounds like a lot of confusion.

Maybe you all could do an event/meeting thingy. Get everyone on the same page.

At any rate, I hope this works out for everyone involved. I don't know if there would really be anyone to totally blame in this situation. More just a "coulda been handled better" if that.

I don't mean to trivialize this, but this was a fascinating story! It's like a cross between The Maltese Falcon, Other People's Money, and The Razor's Edge. Somehow it's gratifying to discover how much life there is to Second Life.

well fritz do what u must with the sim that u purchased, and good luck with it it sucks how billy handled it, but then again, we're talking about billy. hopefully everyone that lived there will have opportunities 2 grow elsewhere.

Getting something for free? Then u r living on borrowed time. Be thankful for yesterday and never assume it will be there tomorrow. Expectation leads to pain.

Hugs... *sneaks Ani off into a dark corner of a casino in Shipley*

My very good friend Ani, with whom I have enjoyed many an interesting debate on a variety of topics-I stand corrected. And to the other members of the SL communities my apologies for my grosse oversite of the fact that there is indeed the pg sims available for those with tastes beyond the adult services offered on the mature sims.

However, I am compelled to touch upon one point in particular that you have made in your reply to my post. That is the issue of freedom that everyone should have to express themselves in any manner they wish.

Let us ponder for a moment those communities in RL that have home owners associations. These people pay real money, and quite a tidy sum at that, to purchase the homes they live in and they are subject to certain controls. My mother-in-law lives in an area where the home owners association has defined having a clothes line in the back yard as unacceptable. This is a far cry from having a little sex shop of your own to sell toys out of. Yet, all the same, she is bound by this rule of the home owners association.

Just because something involves the issue of monies paid that does not constitute that the individual should have the freedom to do as they will according to their preferences. If this were the case we'd all be in for real big trouble and the impending, prophecied destruction of all of mankind would likely have come by man's own hand many centuries before now.

What I mean by this statement is this: considering the proposition that each member should enjoy full freedom of expression and or taste, it is saddening to see that, with this open market of available options staring each person in the face so many have chosen to express themselves in the form of a strap on sex toy or whatnot. If that is the extent of the creativity that can be displayed by people with wide open options then I ask the same question as you-WHAT'S THE POINT?

Again very well put, however, that is real life, this is secondlife, and if second life became so much like real life, would you honestly play it anymore? The minute someone tells me what I can and cannot do on my land is the minute I leave SL and I bet you a thousand other residents also, and to touch base on the sex objects, not everything is SL is sex objects, there use to be guns and fun stuff, people complained about that, too, they are trying to turn SL into a real life scenero, and it wasn't mean to be that way, so the next door neighbor in secondlife has a million sex animations, so what, at least he's creative, and perhaps some of these ppl are just so sex deprived this is their only form of an outlet, still, it's their chose and they pay for that, it's a game it's a second life, and for the record, as I stated before for those who can't stand the sex stuff, YOU CAN'T HAVE SEXUAL OBJECTS IN A PG SIM, you can't even technically curse.

The rules are already stated prior to buying a house in real life and also when getting and account (and getting land) in SL.. these are the Terms of Service. A person may in both instances act in any way they wish if they follow the relevant rules of those in authority.

Personal opinions do not matter. As for society being destroyed by a strap on u may be correct but only due to the immaturity of most of the human race.

If it's acceptable in the TOS then it is acceptable. Full stop.

Comparisions to real life are based on the assumption that SL should be like real life. Surely thats a falacy.

*Hugs Ani too hard in the dark corner*

Thank you, I was trying to word that, and he did it exactly, comparing SL to Real life, means basically that you shouldn't even be in second life, second life is to escape real life to come to a world where the rules of society can be lifted from your shoulders and you can be free from the everyday stresses of REAL LIFE. Once you have become the product of society there is not need to have fun in another world, once you try to push and force those rules in a world that was meant to express yourself, then you are trying to change that into another form of society and society set standards, isnt this why we come here, to have fun to get away to build to explore? If by saying there should be control, then I guess noone should sell furniture anymore because there are enough furniture shops in sl and clothings stores and and prefabs, etc. By saying someone shouldn't build another casino you are saying that someone shouldn't build another shop to sell clothes, so should we Kim tare down the store, since right next door and down the street from us our clothing stores?
And this is not directed to Kim, this is directed toward others, never my friend .. cuz I love her, but as far as the rest of you, you are freeloaders, you were living for free, you sl world got changed and it upset you, oh poor you and your free way of living, like so many ppl i know in real life, will work the system to get whateve they want, then complain if they don't so that they can .... really for all of you, up your accounts to premium buy some land and then let me come over and put some restrictions on what you can build, okay, is that fair? I think it is, under the circumstance this is what you all want control, so go buy some land and let me come decide what is best for that land to have on it.

This is very funny. Thanks Ani.

There is one thing that I have noticed that seems to be a trend in America. People seem to think that their view is the view that should be adopted by all. This leads to much extremism which is a huge problem in the world today. We can all have our opinions on things but if we want peace we also need to accept that others want things that we don't and we need to allow that.

The only time something is wrong or evil is when a person is forced personally into something they don't want. Liberty means that even those u don't like who do things u don't like get Liberty too.

All this arguing is pointless though. SL is run by the rules of the TOS. All futher discussion is just chest-beating and ego and emotional manipulation derived from our fears.

All I have to say to this is .... your right.

Torley on alcona sim is also a nice Tibetan Merunyingba Monastery Alcona(88,46)

And i want to say a little my tibetan monastery was the first one in SL i started with it in may 2005, for a long time was my name and of my groups Tibetan monastery.
So i want to clearout that i not whas the pushy person of the project layout in this forum post.

My project is still going on a tibetan monastery totally non-profit under my protection of the cost of land, and i hope that i can give the monastery a place in the hearts of budhist of SL for to come listen to teachings, tibetan music and in the future budhist & culture events and this all onder my wings without that we must make profit but donations are welcome they going to www.freetibet.org, if you want a donation box client on your land contact me.
I'M not a budhist but i live a spiritual live and follow my heart and soul.

O great, thanx for the info! Whelp I'll come on over and have a look.

HAHAHA OK, OK. You win. And you are right-about some of the things. And for the record, I have no problem with the sex toys or anything. My fear in regards to all of that is just that SL is going to become a playground for sexually depraved strap on wearing fiends and I will have to stay behind lock doors or disguise myself as one and the same just to go shopping for some new hair. LOL. This is, of course, an exageration but it draws the basic picture of what I am getting at. I might not be of the same opinion if my spouse was a player as well so... I am finished bashing the sex fiends. But I am not in agreement with all that you have said. Once again you refer to SL as not RL. But in reality, it is probably more real than RL because in SL people can let down their hair and be who they want to be without repercussions from the communitites and people they associate with in RL. If anything, this is RL and RL is the virtual world of pretend. And I agree that those who are producing the sexual playtime objects show as much talent as anyone building other stuff in so far as they spend plenty of time, effort and energy to perfect their product as well as have a good eye for detail and texturing. And indeed it is every persons right to do as they please according to their (for lack of a more appropriate term) moral make-up. That is not to say that those who engage in these behaviors are immoral by any means, that is not what it is my intention to indicate. I am just lacking in vocabulary at the moment to find a better way of putting it. Let's just say that we are not wanting for little corner sex shops and casinos in SL. And sexual intimacy is something that has been, is, and for the love of God should remain intended for engaging in privately. Otherwise, what we will have is a new Sodom and Gomorah which most people know was destroyed by God because of it's immoral practices and behavior. For those who believe in God that is. One fact that can not be argued is that these cities where destroyed utterly by some catastophic event that did not effect any other area surrounding these cities and was for all intents and purposes otherwise unexplainable. If it had been a meteor there would have been signs of this condition. This is not the case.
A note to my newly found aquaintance Psyke. You are one of those noble people who feel that each to his own as long as they are showing you that same respect. Everyone has opinions blah blah blah. I used to think the same way. But here is the thing. Let us say for the sake of argument that all in the world do this. Each to his own, etc. No censorship. People should be able to raise their children the way they see fit, blah blah blah. People should be able to have the right to choose to do whatever they want as long as it does not effect those around them in a negative way. O.K. so here we have freedom of choice and the right do to as one wishes. What a great life that would be. But then we come to your point about the lack of maturity of many people becoming the primary downfall of mankind as opposed to the instruments used in said event. This is also correct. And as you must do with children, being the epitomy of immaturity, you keep that which they should not be playing with out of site and out of reach to avoid the catastrophy of misuse resulting in said catastrophy of various severity. Correct? And as time proceeds on you then allow for different things to be introduced into the environment according to their behavior. Here we have a controlled environment based on the levels of social, mental and emotional growth of the child. But controlled none the less. The only diference between the child and the immature adult is that the child is contained in a controlled environment and the immature adult is not. Of these two scenarios, the most dangerous is obvious. It is the uncontrolled environment of the adult that can result in the biggest catastrophy of all. And look at the world around us. This is where lack of censorship has brought us. This is where let each to his own has brought us. It is a known fact that the politically correct individuals have allowed for the minority of the this world to run rough-shot over the moral majority because they do not wish to offend. As a result you have the San Fransisco gay parade every year marching through the streets of the city in support of their sexual preferences and no one suppresses that event. Yet, you do not see the heterosexual community conducting a parade in support of their sexual preferences do you? I am not saying that they are immoral for being homosexual. I am saying that parading their sexual preferences down the streets in an actual parade does not constitute a behavior that is considerably moral. I don't care to have my children exposed to this event now or when they become adults any more than I would have them exposed to a heterosexual parade in support of sexual preferences. If thine eye offend thee. Right? I ask you this, why should I be forced into a controlled environment in so much as I should have to turn away and find something else to look at because I do not like that which is being paraded down the streets by a homosexual or a heterosexual community? Who is being controlled now? So yes, everyone has opinions and preferences. Why is it that my preference not to be exposed to this type of behavior take a back seat to those who wish to engage in said behavior? In short, without opinions and preferences there exists no basis for a way of life, which is of course impossible, because each person by virtue of neccessity has to develop a way of life for themselves. This fact is unavoidable. It is a condition of our very existence. Let me outline an addition scenerio. You have gangs every where these days and each of them engage in the practice of tagging. Freeway underpasses etc. And many of the artists display true talent in theire work. For some this is art, for others it is defacement of property. Should these individuals be allowed to practice this behavior when and where they want to because they display true artistic talent? So I disagree with your opinion each to his own. And as far as the TOS, isn't this exactly what I have proposed should be revised so that new users are subject to the new TOS prior to their choice to join the SL community? I have already indicated that those who are already residents should be bound by the TOS that was policy when they signed up. And I am not suggesting that the products and services in debate be obolished or forbidden completely. I am merely suggesting that there should be some control over the possibilty that it might become an out of control situation because again, as you and I have both pointed out-adults or no, some misuse and abuse and the end result possesses the possibilty of ultimate destruction of the our way of life and life itself. And quite like the real world we live in, SL could suffer the same fate. So who is right in this debate? I guess the answer to that question is subject to opinion! (smiles)

ROFL, LOVE YOU KIM

Luv ya too Ani.

" you are unable to accept your own inappropriate actions in respect to this, such as using an alt to claim more land for yourself and the siting of items."

Steelwolf, again a correction. Justice Faddoul was not my alt. He was a very excellent guy who had to take a break from SL for ahwile because of family trouble. He will be back. I guess you never got to know him, which is too bad, since he lived right next door to your rather large 4000 sqm castle.

Oerbewustzijn, you know us (alleged "pushy buddhists" quite well. After I abandoned Jaffee and Justice stayed on, the Milarepa Land Trust was founded and we now operate in four locations, and quite harmoniously with our land patrons. We just gifted you a nice Stupa recently. (Glad to see you plugging your monastery, tho.) So the civics experiment at Jaffee wasn't all bad for us, I admit, since it delivered focus and learning for what has become a really great and challenging project. (http://flyingmonks.blogspot.com/ for more info)

Ron, I apologize for trying to keep the top of Mt Jaffee clear. At the time, there was a proposal before King Billy to keep the peak open, as a nature preserve, so that everyone might be able to enjoy one of the best places in SL. That never happened, obviously. There were two of us on site wanting to do a group build, and the gomba foundation that was built (as short as it was there) was well under our combined allocation. Jaffee management ultimately didn't approve of collaborating -- yes, they were real people Steelwolf, that's how they managed to both be in-world and talk to you at the same time -- and that was probably the beginning of the end for the whole thing.

Non-traditional land use and zoning is important to the future of Second Life, as has been argued by many SLers. But I wouldn't advocate using Jaffee as a template for future experiments. Maybe there should be a Jaffee survivor support group tho...hehe

Fritz, an idea: if you wind up with extra prims, why not sub out any spare corners of the sim to a few of the Jaffee refugees? Either free or subsidized rent. I've met a few business people in SL who engage in similar sorts of land philanthropy and it suits them quite well. (And doesn't hurt the casino image, obviously.) And Lindens, SL really should give systematic monetary or tax (tier) incentives for in-world philanthropic activities, much like the kind that exist in RL. I can think of many good reasons for such policy, not the least that it might result in better treatment of the landless because the patrons get some tax/tier relief and land charity projects become better settled and more sustainable.

'Your world. Your imagination' it says on the SL homepage. They forgot to add 'Sod the little guys who just want to participate without the burden of RL kicking into their consciousness'. Unfortunately it seems that, no matter what you want to do, RL ideals (capitalism) always ruins it for somebody. (Before anyone makes any assumptions about me over this comment, I'd like to say that I am not an 'anticapitalist terrorist'. Just frustrated.)

I am acutely aware that LL need the funds to admininster SL in RL (it's just the way things have to be). I am also aware that SL wouldn't exist otherwise. However, I believe that SL should be a community which is free for all, not a 'free for all' to make quick cash at the expense of others, where a blind eye is applied to certain activities. (I suppose that makes me an idealist, one who'd prefer to live in a Utopian SL world.)

I enjoy the SL experience, but I am disappointed with the conduct of some operators, Tringo, and sex dens, etc. There's too much of this going on in RL without SL being corrupted by it. At the end of the day I just avoid them, turning a blind eye myself, as I do not have the power or influence to enforce my opinion - afterall I am one of the little guys).

To remove, or prevent, these influences appearing in SL, would probably lose LL a lot of cash. You couldn't do it without losing a lot of revenue, which (I suppose) is like the government losing revenue from the smoking industry. If there is a code of conduct regarding SL why doesn't LL review what is being built? Then again, this would be like oppressing the freedom of will. But it looks as though, just as in RL, people are quick to turn a blind eye just to make a bit of cash instead of solving the 'problem'.

Just because something exists in RL doesn't mean that it should exist in SL. SL shouldn't, and isn't (IMO), about making money. It should be about meeting new people from all walks of life, having fun, and being creative.

However, it's a shame that SL is dominated by the rules of supply and demand and RL sleaze.