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Windows 2000: Do you think Second Life Should Stop Support for Windows 2000

Argent Stonecutter
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12-06-2008 18:04
/me replaces Jed's OS with Folgers Crystals...
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Tegg Bode
FrootLoop Roo Overlord
Join date: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 5,707
12-07-2008 02:08
From: Argent Stonecutter
You left out a "probably" in that sentence.
The issue isn't whether they test viewers for Windows 2000 compatibility, it's whether they fix bugs reported with Windows 2000.

Nope i didn't, the orginal poster was sure about it.
According to him there won't be any W2k specific bugs that don't show in XP anyway, so no point reporting them seperately.
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Argent Stonecutter
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12-07-2008 02:52
From: Tegg Bode
According to him there won't be any W2k specific bugs that don't show in XP anyway, so no point reporting them seperately.
You're reading a different message than me.
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bigmoe Whitfield
I>3 Foxes
Join date: 29 Jul 2007
Posts: 459
^.^
12-07-2008 12:14
I would say keep it, I do something have to fall back to that hd when I corrupt xp.
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Baloo Uriza
Debian Linux Helper
Join date: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 895
12-07-2008 12:49
From: bigmoe Whitfield
I would say keep it, I do something have to fall back to that hd when I corrupt xp.


Notice that the Lindens have mentioned up-thread that dropping support for 2000 wouldn't necessarily make SL incompatible with 2000, just that they would not be taking paid coders away from focusing on more popular platforms to ensure everything works in 2000.
Argent Stonecutter
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Join date: 20 Sep 2005
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12-07-2008 14:16
From: Baloo Uriza
Notice that the Lindens have mentioned up-thread that dropping support for 2000 wouldn't necessarily make SL incompatible with 2000, just that they would not be taking paid coders away from focusing on more popular platforms to ensure everything works in 2000.
Again, that's not the part that we're concerned about.

It's the bit where they won't fix it if it breaks on 2000. THAT part is a real problem.
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"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Sabastian Braveheart
Registered User
Join date: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 1
W 2000
12-07-2008 14:35
Yeah, move on.
Baloo Uriza
Debian Linux Helper
Join date: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 895
12-07-2008 16:16
From: Argent Stonecutter
Again, that's not the part that we're concerned about.

It's the bit where they won't fix it if it breaks on 2000. THAT part is a real problem.


I don't see the point in keeping official 2000 support around given that Quicktime on that platform's a year out of date with no recourse for the bug, first off. Second, as was already pointed out, W2000 users are in the desperate minority. Third, W2000 users have the hardware to run Linux, and W2000 works marvelously inside Virtualbox...
Torin Kahanamoku
Registered User
Join date: 2 Dec 2008
Posts: 1
Down with WIN 2K
12-07-2008 16:33
I do not know anyone who uses Windows 2000. I give support for WIN 2K a big Thumbs Down!
Jenrose Meredith
Registered User
Join date: 12 Jan 2008
Posts: 24
12-07-2008 23:15
If it stopped working on Win2k, my sister would no longer be able to log in. However, she's still using a hacked old viewer, so as long as the server won't balk, and it's not refusing the old viewer, then no big.
Argent Stonecutter
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Join date: 20 Sep 2005
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12-08-2008 02:37
From: Baloo Uriza
I don't see the point in keeping official 2000 support around given that Quicktime on that platform's a year out of date with no recourse for the bug, first off.
That's another advantage of Windows 2000, people won't be tempted to turn streaming video on because it doesn't work.
From: someone
Second, as was already pointed out, W2000 users are in the desperate minority.
So are active creators and scripters, and they're more likely to be using the best version of Windows they can if they have to run Windows... and that's Windows 2000.
From: someone
Third, W2000 users have the hardware to run Linux,
Video performance under Linux is not even in the same ballpark. If it was, I wouldn't be using Windows at all.
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Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/

"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Milla Janick
Empress Of The Universe
Join date: 2 Jan 2008
Posts: 3,075
12-08-2008 06:53
From: Argent Stonecutter
That's another advantage of Windows 2000, people won't be tempted to turn streaming video on because it doesn't work.

Then you'll get a whole lot more advantages when SL stops working on Windows 2000.

Features not working is an advantage? Not in my book.

Whether or not Windows 2000 is the best version of Windows is debatable. It may be for you, but it certainly isn't for most people.

In any case, I haven't seen the Lindens, or anyone else, present any compelling evidence that support for it should be dropped.
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Argent Stonecutter
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12-08-2008 07:22
From: Milla Janick
Features not working is an advantage?
Video and audio streaming is a privacy hole in SL.

In addition, Quicktime doesn't work in Linux. Should Linden Labs abandon that? I certainly don't think so.
From: someone
Whether or not Windows 2000 is the best version of Windows is debatable. It may be for you, but it certainly isn't for most people.
Every version of Windows since has caused problems for more people. If it wasn't for Microsoft forcing people to upgrade by dropping Windows 2000, and now XP, it's unlikely that most people who had the opportunity would have switched to 2000.
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Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/

"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Milla Janick
Empress Of The Universe
Join date: 2 Jan 2008
Posts: 3,075
12-08-2008 07:33
From: Argent Stonecutter
In addition, Quicktime doesn't work in Linux. Should Linden Labs abandon that?

Only if it really, really upsets Baloo.
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Destiny Niles
Registered User
Join date: 23 Aug 2006
Posts: 949
12-08-2008 07:53
I agree with
From: Jenrose Meredith
... so as long as the server won't balk, and it's not refusing the old viewer, then no big.

And should Win 2000 be on longer supported.
But some other features in should be dropped also. The damage system has long fallen into disuse by the residents and serves no function. Either revamp it or drop it.
Baloo Uriza
Debian Linux Helper
Join date: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 895
12-08-2008 11:47
From: Milla Janick
If they dropped Windows support, Baloo wouldn't have anything to post about in the forums.


That's not true; more like the Windows bigots wouldn't have any recourse for their moronics.
Argent Stonecutter
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12-08-2008 12:19
From: Baloo Uriza
That's not true; more like the Windows bigots wouldn't have any recourse for their moronics.
I've been accused of being a Mac Fanboy a few times (and a Mac hater almost as often), but I don't recall EVER being called a Windows bigot before.
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"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Baloo Uriza
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Join date: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 895
12-08-2008 12:25
From: Argent Stonecutter
I've been accused of being a Mac Fanboy a few times (and a Mac hater almost as often), but I don't recall EVER being called a Windows bigot before.


You might want to read again; I wasn't accusing you of being one, Argent. I was referring to the person who shot the ad hominem that all I do is complain about Windows, never mind I'm only pointing out other available options when there is no such option available on Windows (an ongoing example: Windows doesn't have any drivers that support vertex buffer objects for quite a few ATI Radeon models, but Linux does. The two possible fixes are "well don't use VBO then" or "Try the Linux version, ATI hasn't put out a decent Windows driver since the early 1990s";).
Argent Stonecutter
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12-08-2008 12:39
From: Baloo Uriza
You might want to read again; I wasn't accusing you of being one, Argent. I was referring to the person who shot the ad hominem that all I do is complain about Windows,
Well, to be fair, Baloo, I was *thinking* that even if I didn't post it.
From: someone
The two possible fixes are "well don't use VBO then" or "Try the Linux version, ATI hasn't put out a decent Windows driver since the early 1990s";).
Or "You know, an nVidia such-and-such costs less than the time you'll spend getting Linux up and working if you're not familiar with it". After all, I've been working on free software on UNIX and working on free UNIX lookalikes since before the GNU Manifesto was published, and I still hesitate to stick my interface into the whole "free UNIX video and audio support" morass again. I've been burned too many times.
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Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/

"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Garry Linden
Administrator
Join date: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 8
Win2k
12-08-2008 12:41
From: Baloo Uriza
Garry (and everybody else for that matter), for continuity's sake, could you please click the Quote button on the message you're replying to? When you click on some random Quote button elsewhere to reply, instead of the one on the message you're replying to, you're breaking the thread and making it hard to tell what you're replying to.


Hi Baloo, I was more replying to the thread in General. This response was not for one single quote, sorry for the confusion.

Hi Everybody, so after reading the history of this thread it would appear so far that we are more or less ok with the ending of Win2k support. I understand the position of holdouts and there is a decent case to be made for their preferred OS, but I would like to mention again that this does not mean Win2k will stop working with SL. The fact of the matter is that Win2k QA is done at the expense of QA time spent elsewhere and Win2k represents less than a percent of our active users. We basically just need to put our Lindens to work on support that affects more of our active resident population. Thanks for all the responses!
Argent Stonecutter
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12-08-2008 12:45
Garry: we're not concerned about your QA process, we're concerned about what you're going to do if you run into some glitch that tickles Windows 2000 the wrong way and it's discovered by users or SLDev. Fixing these kinds of things is not likely to be expensive, but not doing so is likely to have more of an impact on scripters and other technical types.
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"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Baloo Uriza
Debian Linux Helper
Join date: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 895
12-08-2008 12:49
From: Argent Stonecutter
Garry: we're not concerned about your QA process, we're concerned about what you're going to do if you run into some glitch that tickles Windows 2000 the wrong way and it's discovered by users or SLDev. Fixing these kinds of things is not likely to be expensive, but not doing so is likely to have more of an impact on scripters and other technical types.


Given that the SL viewer is also an open source project, I would imagine a Windows 2000 user affected would be more than welcome to submit a patch to fix it via the JIRA. LR just wouldn't be throwing good money after bad when it comes to paying employees to work on the viewer.
Argent Stonecutter
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Join date: 20 Sep 2005
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12-08-2008 12:55
From: Baloo Uriza
Given that the SL viewer is also an open source project, I would imagine a Windows 2000 user affected would be more than welcome to submit a patch to fix it via the JIRA.
Indeed, and I'd be sure to do so. What I'm looking for is some indication that they won't close it as "won't fix" immediately just because it's Windows 2000.

Given the fate of some other JIRA entries, I'm not at all inclined to take that on faith.
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Argent Stonecutter - http://globalcausalityviolation.blogspot.com/

"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Phantom Ninetails
Registered User
Join date: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 21
12-08-2008 13:02
From: Garry Linden
Hi Everybody, so after reading the history of this thread it would appear so far that we are more or less ok with the ending of Win2k support.


Wait, seriously? Did you read the thread? The vast majority of people who voted against Windows 2000 quite obviously don't even have any knowledge about the operating system, and in many cases seem to equate it to Windows ME.

And there's alot of people who voted FOR Windows 2000.
Milla Janick
Empress Of The Universe
Join date: 2 Jan 2008
Posts: 3,075
12-08-2008 13:32
From: Negationix Nikolaidis
In order to upgrade to XP, I would have to jump through some hoops, since XP isn't really sold anymore. Either I would have to find a small computer store that happens to have one in their stock (either installed or in shrink-wrap) or buy Vista and use downgrade rights. And since my computer can't possibly run Vista (it does run Second Life though), upgrading to Vista isn't an option.

I saw dozens of copies of XP at the local Best Buy and Office Max stores last weekend. It's still available through Newegg, and probably every other e-tailer in the world. It's still very easy to find a copy.
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