Sign the "Boycott Camping in SL" petition!

I agree with Fiona on the atmspheric campers are ok, they do add to the viusla effect of the sims. More of thos and less of the dancepad zombies would be welcome for sure.

Double that amen.

For anyone thats ever truly researched HOW traffic is generated, the idea of paying people to be on your land afk for hour upon hour should be ridiculous.

I personally can't wait for 'traffic' to be eliminated completely. It's been gamed, exploited and taken advantage of beyond reason.

When I see camping chairs I leave a place, because it means to me that the owners of the property have nothing much to really offer so they entice the scavengers with shiny coins.

Hopefully once 'traffic' is gone, places will be popular based solely on thier content.

Oh yes The Idea of "FREE MONEY" Electric Bills anyone? Unless you live with your parentrs, or in a dorm or university Housing. I am sorry camping is a waste of money ( IN REAL LIFE TERMS ) Its cheaper to buy money instead of camping. Dilbert Is right in many cases. Have you been to his Island? This person is one of the most intersting yet kind hearted person you find on SL. He runs a PG Formal Dance Island and offers many many freebies to the ( COUGH COUGH Newbie(s)). Dibert is something you don`t see much these days. He is running a PG Island and is always in the top 1 to 9 popular spots. Hows that for not promoting SEX Drugs, Xrated Escorts, Games, Camping Etc...... I tell you! Its ********** UNREAL!

Usagi

So camping is a good thing? If i am reading this right?

OMG its a large SL world! You name it we have it as a job!..........




Not everyone how about those that "ONLY CASH OUT" Its just not that simple of deduction how people use their Lindens.



How long have you been on SL? Really? Remeber GOM? LLABS put a stop to them fast back in 2005. Anyone can make a worse case example here and make things look favorable in views. No sence what so ever.........in all due repect.



Well Love everyone want EVERYTHING for Nothing nowadays....... Again Really how long have you been playing SL?


Usagi

The whole anti-camping thng smells to me like a little SL elitism. Who cares if some big casino wants chairs full of campers? Most of the people I know don't want to live near such places for other reasons.

To me the main problem with SL is the lack of mainland zoning. If some areas were just residential or commercial, we would eliminate a lot of conflicts, such as my pet peeve, ad farms.

Considering LL's reluctance to get involved with issues like zoning, do you really think they care that some people don't like campers?

I have a large willow grove with a small cottage, it's not a commercial venture but my home. I found a lot of newbies wandering through my land and some but not all would end up begging me for a few Linden. I created a little campsite, four logs, a campfire which gives out free hot dogs and hamburgers, a little stand nearby that gives free mead.

I put camping sit balls on my logs. When a newbie wanders onto my property and asks for money, I point them in the direction of the campfire. It adds to the atmosphere of the grove having people around the campfire. I often will join them and spend sometime chatting about Second Life. I even have a notecard filled with some links to locations that give out some nice freebies and or offer SL tutorials.

Besides the camping, we host a themed party once a month. We give away over two thousand Linden at these events. My partner and I are very fortunate in that neither of us have any cash draining vices, besides SL, and have disposable income. We are able to invest two or three hundred dollars into the Linden economy every month. And no, we don't own a SIM, just rent a couple of pieces of property.

My two Linden - Klaus

I ran into some of that when I came to SL and it really helped me to stick around. I've met some very nice folks that did similar things and we are still friends. The idea of banning camping seems a mite overbearing - throwing the baby out with the bathwater, as it were.

Camping is the least of your worries.
How about reliable TPs, or IMs, or transactions....

SL business people are the hardest working people in SL. It takes months to get a business going-and it is very expensive too. I own one so I know. I send 10 or 12 hours a day here working on the place, and have invested thousands of dollars in SL from the begining last November.

To do that and then to have my search listing upstaged by a guy that sells junk, but has 20 camping chairs out (possibly filled with his own alts) is a form of cheating that is almost too much to take when I am about to shell out a couple hundred bucks to pay my tier again.

Right now, my ONLY alternatives are to pay more and more for classified ads so my store will be noticed, or to put camping chairs out at my place too--which a refuse to do. Not only does it cost more money, but nowadays--I have come on late at night and there is often some guy, that has been sitting there naked on a chair for hours, with his wang hanging out.

No good way to judge traffic? Bull. A simple count of unique visitors of the owners land where the business is (not just a tiny section where the landing point is) works very well. I have a simple unique people counter at my place (reset every morning). It tells me how many different people come to the place every day. With that figure I can menatlly see if things are more or less normal--and I can spot changes in trends easily. That's what I want to know! Not some crazy calculated "traffic" figure that I can't even understand.

These figures work because, over time, there is positive correlation between the number of vistors I have and sales revenue. If my products are'nt selling--the number of visits drops--if they are selling, the number of visits increases. It's just that simple--and it would be the same for any business.

If I was going to report a figure for comparison to other businesses, I would calculate a moving average of these figures for 7 days to smooth them out for every business in the mix.

Another useful statistic would be the number of visitors divided by the number of square meters. I have done that to see if new land for the place makes a real difference at my place. It is a very good way to tell if the place is efficient or not. I would like to have that information for businesses in general, because well managed places would rise to the top no matter how big or small they were.

Shoppers could use these kinds of figures---they could understand them and use them to separate truly well run businesses from--those that are run by clever gamers.

If the designers want to support hard work and fair play, but give the noobs some spending money --then they should increase the stripends when people first come online but decrease them over time so they don't learn to expect something for nothing.

Right now Camping used to pad Search results incourages dishonety and gaming, lazyiness, and enormous lag, which overloads the system because the Avs are'nt doing a darned thing except sitting there. If we want new features--such as Voice--let's spend the resouces wisely--The internet has it's limits and SL is down a lot because it is taxing what is realistically available.

I love SL, but I believe it incourages the opposite of what it should when it comes to commerce. If we all become gamers-----nobody is going to spend the time making good things for people to buy here. I know I am starting to wonder if I will, and I bet I am not alone either.

I'm with you Brandi. Seeing camping chairs tells me a lot about a business and is a sign for me to stay away.

a) Camping is cheesy.
b) Camping makes a less enjoyable SL experience.
c) Camping isn't cheating.

I say this because, well, it happens in real life. In terms of "viral marketing" and even historically, people would seed the public with plants to create hype for events. Event managers would seed crowds with really enthusiastic people. Stores have even hired women to pose as housewives and chat up other shopping housewives to promote other items.

So... no. It may be pathetic, vaguely dishonest, and annoying, but it isn't cheating.

I also hate going into clubs and see a bunch of camping pads around and the place is full of just campers. Its very irritating. I usually end up leaving and never returning to that club. So, the campers didn't do a thing for a true paying customer other then cause me to never return.
However, I am not against camping. Its how I started in the game to make enough money to better myself, better my look with a different skin, shape and even better clothing. So can I totally frown on campers ...no.
I do if it is used inside where I want to go where it would ruin the atmosphere but used creatively I rather like it. At a mall a few scattered campers scrubbing the floor or washing windows gives it a rather quaint feeling, a reality like atmosphere.
I use campers at my brothel just a couple outside shackled to a post. they don't move in a dance, they simply hang there tied to a post ..Not only does it give it the "flavor" I wanted but many times those that hung for hours on that post turned into very dedicated future workers for my brothel.
If used properly campers do the trick of what we want, but with anything it can be taken advantage of. Do I feel that campers should be banned, hell no. For what ever reason SL needs them whether you agree or disagree. If a business exploits campers to an extreme simply don't return. No matter what the business there are ways to use campers in a much better way them just dance pads around a dance floor inside an empty club. Perhaps the owners of the club will eventually get a clue to why in a month they have to close due to it not working for them and they are bankrupt!!
The last thing I want to see is another thing banned or made illegal in SL...we keep losing more and more as it is. I say, leave the camping issue alone. Instead take on a more positive issue like convincing SL to fix the endless lag issues or inventory disappearance problems, or the many other endless problems and leave the camping issues alone.

Problem is its the owners themselves running those avies sitting in those money chairs. Whats really a laugh is they want to be in the top rankings. So they let these that are lucky enough on the camping chairs. But soon after the event is over the reset the sim not paying those campers. population around 85 right after the event."RESET" nobody gets paid. Talk about your cheap dance club owners.

Camping...bah.

If you can afford a PC and a broadband connection then you can afford to spend maybe $10/month on Linden dollars and spend more MEANINGFUL time in SL other than sitting in one spot doing nothing. Come on....$10. One less freaking fast food meal a month.

How true this is..........is so strange this people have a very high end computers ADSL lines. And they can`t spend for account? Unless they don`t want a meaningful time using SL.

If people choose to give money to others here that's fine!

I am against the tie between camping and search where all business owners are either forced to use campers or pay much more than they would for ads to get themselves on the search list ahead of businesses that do use them--and use their own alt herds to pay themselves back. If you are high on the search list you get people to your store or club before the guy that is down the list even if he has better products than you do.

Everybody knows it's happening--But the bottom line is if you run a business here, you'd better get more computers and build your own alt herd cause otherwise you will have
to live with far less customers than you would have if the flaw in the computer code was removed.

If there is money around and people can get away with it--they will cheat. I will agree with that. But I will never agree that it has to be allowed to be this easy. The system
is flawed and I think there should at least be an attempt to make it better than it is.

Some might find it surprising given my previously aired views on camping, but I don't mind people doing whatever they want in this open ended world provided it doesn't hinder others. I don't object to camping in general; just camping on mainland sims because it prevents landowners accessing their own land or condemns them to eternal lag. Camping on private sims, particularly those which specialize in helping newbies obtain knowledge and monies for example, I'm fine with. If estate owner wants a 1fps sim full of grey builds and avatars, that is their prerogative.

SL wants to see more sales of new land areas that come as 1500 mts for just 1.6200Ls so they can make mthly $us charge fees on the over basic 512mt holdings. Hopefully the extra 2x 512 parcells (that make up the 1,500mtrs) can be sub divided and Hopefully resold before you score another $US mthly charge! But time is against you doing that! And support is bound to slow your efforts as much as is possable! Count on it!
This compares to the 59,000Ls for new land 512 mtrs if you can find one without suposed mthly fees, or parcel restrictions!

Second hand land ppl give up on is rising, as they abandon it!

Dont forget that Ls sell back to SL at less than 1/2 the buying rate!!!!!!!

PLUS you can only cash out 2,500Ls/mth.
And you need to have your card details listed to do that!
SL owns you if they own access to your card details! And you cant even post forums without them either!
Im premier yrly already before i worked out what i was in for!
And they wont let me post without card details being currently listed, even though ive 10 mths to go!!!!!!!!!!!
Work that out?????? But its a no brainer

So why is SL so obsessed with owning our credit card details?????????

Back to the main issues, the last thing SL wants is for the mainland working better than island regions, as as large parcels make massive fees while being subdivided and sold off!

And non active SL residents to lose their land after they dont resign for another yrly premier! Just to get more accounting and online stability issues SL and support are famous for!


Campers are booted off the grid regularlty with rolling logout priograms running automatically!
Lets face it owners are trying to lease or resell parcells/business sites that look more popular, and support turnover/popularity!

Remember that a few 1,000Ls daily given to campers isnt much in real $US!
Now compared that to Add fees to list on SL billed in real $US etc! Give the campers a bone as it may go back into buying off local businesses!

And dont forget you can only cash 2,500Ls per mth back into less than 1/2 the $US dollars they are worth buying, to cash out of SL!
And SL claims you can run and make money from SL!!! yeah if you live in the 3rd world and have good internet connectivity!
Or morte likely use SL to advertise outside businesses, or thair links!

And now that Sex trade is being clamped down on, low paid students cant run links to outside web cam peep shows they run to helped fund their school expences etc! Those and more organised escort/Ph sex agencies!

I camp and gave up on land or business setup after dealing with non stop support problems for over 2 mths non stop!
Support just wasnt set up to deal with most of those problems despite their short sightedness in programming them in to SL!
The last was when they deducted a mthly visa fee without that account being listed as premier at the time. Or having card details even listed on the my accounts page 4 over a mth before the deduction was made! Now thats not accidental as they had to backtrack the previous mths details, and try again well after it had reverted to basic listing again!

I was good at primming products, and was developing new techniquies. But stopped as soon as i found all my time was spent on getting access to login. Or service when i could login later!


News flash Support. how can you run winmtr in SL for a few minutes if you cant loggin?

Then, Clear cash should be reset in reinstalling SL by rights, if you were 1/2 competant in your programming!

Why do you usually ask me to perform tests i have only just told you i ran in the ticket you are responding to? If not some earlier message on that same EPIC unresoled, but frequently FIXED mentioned ticket?

What? This makes no sence

You cant make money in SL as you cant cash enough out per mth! Only 2,500Ls worth next to nothing in $US!

If I had a link placed on an add in SL at clubs etc ppl can link onto a direct outside webcam directly at my home (outside of SL)!

I can bill Masses of ppl directly off their credit cards without SL getting a cut of the action!

That makes sence to me and SL!
Isnt that why SL really clamped down on sex business that directly bypass the SL site once the contacts are made. This means SL isnt getting their cut, so they finally cut down on the sex trade!

And gambling sites can do the same thing! So gambling chips used in SL can be validated and recashed outside of SL in real $US!

Sure the US Bush government agencies want to clamp down on activites run in SL.
But SL can be moved fully off US soil and bypass them altogether!
And with the non stop grid issues SL has there is a market out there for a real competiter to SL!
Isnt that what SL should be really worried about????

If SL were moved to China or the carrabian etc they wouldnt care about Decency issues! But also lose the ability to use that as an excuse to stop activites that ran for ages till SL got greedy that it wasnt getting more of the action, and wanted more of the cut!

shakeshead. I sure hope the game gets fixs fast. If this causing senceless remarks from people.

Im university educated and had nothing less than credit grades in my final 1 1/2 years of my full degree.
I focused on Program evualation, survey, business and Bureaucracy/government planning and organisation. That makes me more qualified than some to comment on evualuation of SL structure and support evualuation!

Hey i have a full degree to suport my opimions! And lots of direwct contact with tech and account support!

And it was my theory that finally proved correct in getting accounts to actually see this accounts my accounts page! Yes a premier yrly account that account support couldnt even see!!!!!! Hows that for poor programming by SL? When they cant even see active accounts that are paid up!!!!!

SL exibits all the problems of a beauracary totally lost touch with the ppl its designed to liase with and service!

Ignore the july start date as this account was created back in June, and it took that long for SL to get it activated after not sending activation codes or sresponding to my support ticket lodgements form both accounts. Yes this was created after deciding to not put a full premier payment on anexistant account SL had already screwed over before trying to start from scratch.
But as you can tell it hasnt gone smoothly with this new account either! And ive totally lost confidence in SL as a result of it

Well i have a pretty good background of school. But that doesnt matter really does it? No disrepect but there is no proof LLABS is doing away with escorts and sex..........Its all ASSumption.

One thing I find funny...a contradiction per say, is...

People complain their hearts out about being ignored. Ignored from voicers. Ignored by voicers. Ignoring my text chat. I'm being discriminated and ignored!

And yet, these same people have nothing to say about mindless AFK campers that ignore everyone.

Don't take this personally...it's just an observation. *shrugs*

HAHhah ok.........whatever