Privacy rights???

There should be an option that gives us the ability to be hidden from the Leader boards... today I get one of the usual daily IM's (I get at least one a day) "How do you make so much money?" ... " Do you BUY all that money?" things of that nature... oh, one was real cute today.. "I envy you, teach me how to make money".... This really pisses me off.. I ask them how they know how much money I do or don't have and thier response is ALWAYS, The Leader Boards.

It is not anyone's business how much money I do or don't have... and it should be within my rights to decide if they should know or not... half the time I don't even know I am on that stupid list til some money hungry freak IM's me... UGH!

I am sorry this just really pisses me off!

I'll abstain from my opinion on the Leaderboard, but... I hope you reported abuse for each and every person who IMd you for abuse.

We shouldn't let people's abuse force a change in features. While you may have a valid argument about privacy, I think a change in policy should be made because of your argument, and not the griefing you received.

To discuss this topic, recall this post on privacy I started a month ago:
/120/87/30513/1.html

The constitution doesn't guarentee a right to privacy.

no it doesn't... but they don't splatter your info all over the world and on websites either.

I wouldn't be so sure about that.

I don't think it's an unreasonable request, actually.It shouldn't be too hard and if it is well -- the Linden's could say so. I think this is atleast in the realm of "considerable".

This particular comment doesn't seem like greifing. Sounds like someone paid you a compliment and wants to learn.

With that being said, I agree that some information should be private, like RL info. Which is private unless we give it out ourselves. However, any content or Lindens dollars made in world is not private and we all know this coming into SL. We don't even own what we create really. At anytime the Lindens can just wipe it all out and its not ours to claim. The only suggestion I have to keep off the Leader Boards is to convert your money into US$ and/or create several alts to hold the money so you don't end up on top ten.

After the past several weeks I have come to realize that the Lindens are going to do what they want and not listen to the consumers. So, no sense in trying to make a change even if the Majority of SL agrees.

MJ

Sensual i think for the first time in my life i agree with you. That is why i have resulted in numerous alts.. its more of a job to keep transfering money around to stay out of the leader boards.. i also suggest deeding land to a group with you and your alts.. its sad but its true the non stop ims get annoying.. i used to get them for both land and money before i started alt whoreing i suggest you do the same.

I never said it was griefing... its just annoying... and not because this person wants to learn, but he envys me because what he saw on the leader boards... he never met me, never saw any of my creations.. he only saw the #'s by my name...thats not a compliment in my book.

It's true that LL can pull the plug at any time, but we do own what we create in SL. The whole legal thing is kind of ambiguous, but.. Well, I just wanted to specify.




Anyway, I think the Leader Boards are completely useless and should be removed. But what do I know.

They seem pretty useless to me too, I dont even understand how they come with the numbers they do, they never match anything I see when I look at my account.

You have to remember.. each meter of land you own values your networth at 1L a meter so.. if you own 60k meters of land its going to show you have 60k linden dollars more than you do.

I never heard of that but it doesnt matter in my case since I do not own any land on the main grid, and also the numbers on the leader boards are far less then what I see on my account.

This is in the TOS...

5.3 Participant Content. Participants can create Content on Linden's servers in various forms. Linden acknowledges and agrees that, subject to the terms and conditions of this Agreement, including without limitation the limited licenses granted by you to Linden herein, you will retain any and all applicable copyright and/or other intellectual property rights with respect to any Content you create using the Service. NOTWITHSTANDING THE FOREGOING, YOU UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT BY SUBMITTING YOUR CONTENT TO ANY AREA OF THE SERVICE, YOU AUTOMATICALLY GRANT (AND YOU REPRESENT AND WARRANT THAT YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO GRANT) TO LINDEN: (A) THE ROYALTY-FREE, FULLY PAID-UP, PERPETUAL, IRREVOCABLE, NON-EXCLUSIVE RIGHT AND LICENSE TO USE AND REPRODUCE (AND TO AUTHORIZE THIRD PARTIES TO USE AND REPRODUCE) ANY OF YOUR CONTENT IN ANY OR ALL MEDIA FOR MARKETING AND/OR PROMOTIONAL PURPOSES IN CONNECTION WITH THE SERVICE; (B) THE PERPETUAL AND IRREVOCABLE RIGHT TO DELETE ANY OR ALL OF YOUR CONTENT FROM LINDEN'S SERVERS AND FROM THE SERVICE, WHETHER INTENTIONALLY OR UNINTENTIONALLY, AND FOR ANY REASON OR NO REASON, WITHOUT ANY LIABILITY OF ANY KIND TO YOU OR ANY OTHER PARTY; AND (C) THE ROYALTY-FREE, FULLY PAID-UP, PERPETUAL, IRREVOCABLE, NON-EXCLUSIVE RIGHT AND LICENSE TO COPY, ANALYZE AND USE ANY OF YOUR CONTENT AS LINDEN MAY DEEM NECESSARY OR DESIRABLE FOR PURPOSES OF DEBUGGING, TESTING AND/OR PROVIDING SUPPORT SERVICES IN CONNECTION WITH THE SERVICE. YOU ALSO UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT BY SUBMITTING YOUR CONTENT TO ANY AREA OF THE SERVICE, YOU AUTOMATICALLY GRANT (OR YOU WARRANT THAT THE OWNER OF SUCH CONTENT HAS EXPRESSLY GRANTED) TO LINDEN AND TO ALL OTHER SECOND LIFE PARTICIPANTS A NON-EXCLUSIVE, WORLDWIDE, FULLY PAID-UP, TRANSFERABLE, IRREVOCABLE, ROYALTY-FREE AND PERPETUAL LICENSE, UNDER ANY AND ALL PATENT RIGHTS YOU MAY HAVE OR OBTAIN WITH RESPECT TO YOUR CONTENT, TO USE YOUR CONTENT FOR ALL PURPOSES WITHIN THE SERVICE. YOU FURTHER AGREE THAT YOU WILL NOT MAKE ANY CLAIMS AGAINST LINDEN OR AGAINST OTHER SECOND LIFE PARTICIPANTS BASED ON ANY ALLEGATIONS THAT ANY ACTIVITES BY EITHER OF THE FOREGOING WITHIN THE SERVICE INFRINGE YOUR (OR ANYONE ELSE'S) PATENT RIGHTS. YOU FURTHER UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT: (I) YOU ARE SOLELY RESPONSIBLE FOR UNDERSTANDING ALL COPYRIGHT, PATENT, TRADEMARK, TRADE SECRET AND OTHER INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY OR OTHER LAWS THAT MAY APPLY TO YOUR CONTENT HEREUNDER; (II) YOU ARE SOLELY RESPONSIBLE FOR, AND LINDEN WILL HAVE NO LIABILITY IN CONNECTION WITH, THE LEGAL CONSEQUENCES OF ANY ACTIONS OR FAILURES TO ACT ON YOUR PART WHILE USING THE SERVICE, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION ANY LEGAL CONSEQUENCES RELATING TO YOUR INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS; AND (III) LINDEN'S ACKNOWLEDGEMENT HEREUNDER OF YOUR INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS IN YOUR CONTENT DOES NOT CONSTITUTE A LEGAL OPINION OR LEGAL ADVICE, BUT IS INTENDED SOLELY AS AN EXPRESSION OF LINDEN'S INTENTION NOT TO REQUIRE PARTICIPANTS TO FOREGO THEIR NORMAL INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS WITH RESPECT TO CONTENT THEY CREATE USING THE SERVICE, SUBJECT TO THE TERMS SPECIFIED HEREIN.


Awww well.. I just wanted to specify

I really don't want to hijack this thread, but I just want to say that SL doesn't appear to own our creations. The language seems to suggest that they are avoiding being sued or charged for those things. Creators keep rights to content they create, except for those exceptions, which seem reasonable.

That article on MSN said: "But already one virtual world, "Second Life," cedes intellectual property rights over player creations to players themselves."

Maybe you are right, though! I don't know. I'm not an expert. Thank you for posting that, in any case. ^^

AND NOW BACK TO YOUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAMMING.

I don't see why every discussion about privacy / AV rights has to end with someone saying "it's not that way" and then someone posts a TOS legal mumbo jumbo and then that's it.

The original post is a suggestion, not a question. The poster was not looking for what the official legal rules are, instead, the poster wanted something to be added, obviously.

Again and again, when someone quotes the TOS, inevitably someone will post, "Well, obviously this is mostly a legal document protecting Linden Lab against lawsuit, because 3/4 of the stuff they talk about what they CAN do, they never do. Like opting to remove your account and all your content."

SL is evolving into the Metaverse. Architecture, money system, and rules will need to change as the game expands into Metaverse. Instead of focusing on what is, is it possible that we can focus on ... what's possible?

The future is the only important thing! And LL is, as far as I can see, doing a good job of supporting it. Of course they have to cover their asses. What major company wouldn't? Allowing intellectual property to the players is a really good thing, though. [Un]Fortunately, they seem to be pioneers in this? Perhaps we will see more of this in the gaming industry in the near future.

Anyway, to get back on track, I have heard time and again that no one actually looks at the Leader Boards. And now I hear that they are actually harming things? Really, there seems to be no use for them. If anything, they are just a really sad attempt to make SL more "game-like". Like, "OMG, I'M WINNING! TOP SCORE! PLZ INSERT 2 QUARTERS!!"

I understand that some of the top developers in SL might use this to gauge their popularity or something, but that's only interesting to... what, the top 10-20 people in each category? And most of those people seem to overlap. So.. not too many people, it looks like. Perhaps this feature can be implemented on the website and taken out of the actual in-world interface? People who are REALLY interested can be bothered to check the site. And we could use an extra spot on the bottom bar for some Edit or Mouselook lovin', anyway. o_o Don't know why Leader Board has its own big blue button and neither of those functions do..

To my mind, the leader boards are nothing more than adolescent holdover from the High Score lists of Asteroids and Space Invaders.

Here in SL, do these boards hold any discernable *affirmative* purpose? I can only guess at the original intent of the leader board. But a cursory look at the forums tells me their de facto function is little beyond providing ammunition for people seeking topics of gossip at best, strife at worst.

Let those who wish to be seen on the boards have that opportunity. Let those who wish not to participate have the ability to opt-out.

I'm an all-or-nothing kind of guy. I also like numbers and data.

That being said, it bothers me that the leaderboards only show the top ten "leaders" for various subjects, and then 5 fairly random samples below it (around your standing).

If we're going to have leaderboards, make it fully viewable; I want to see all 20,000 entries for every listing.

If we're not going to get that, could we get rid of it? It's worthless except as a penis-larger-than-thou waving contest in its current iteration.

LF

Here's a pretty popular list it took me about 5 seconds to pull up.

Forbes 400 Wealthiest List

In the real world, if you are a CEO, an athlete, a celbrity, a politician or any number of things, what you earn and what you are worth are readily available.

If you don't want to be hassled by some people asking for advice, then live a quieter second life. Otherwise, try to realize that its part of being high profile (which you are in SL) and deal with it.

The right to be secure in your possessions has been stated to mean Privacy by everyone from lawyers to the Supreme Court.

IANAL, but for those who have been in-game a long, long time, there might be grandfathered content that falls under a different TOS. If you created content, and haven't logged on since the TOS change, that content might still be under the old TOS.

*sighs*

I'm not sure this list presents a correlative situation to SL.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't lists like this generally assembled from things like financial disclosures to government or corporate investors? If so, aren't those disclosures made to satisfy a variety of regulations which have discernable legal reason for becoming public record?
RL disclosure is neither an attribute of fame nor of wealth as such; it's presumably an attribute of reasoned regulation for defined purpose, and is reviewed by competent authority.

Here in SL, the people who earn, create, or buy wealth have no equivilent to say, an SEC to make reports to, no corporate investors to show clean books to, no voting public to demonstrate non-conflict of interest.

I think a list like this would be closer to SL if one could find something like the net worth of 400 named people in any random town. Not I, a private citizen -- nor 20,000 other private citizens assembled in the lobby -- can have a bank give the dollar and cents total of either a neighbor's account, or of the account for the local privately owned bakery.

start and alt and only give them as much money as needed, ooooor, start an alt and store all your money in it. you could even have an object that lets you withdraw and deposit to and from that alt without ever having to log on and look at it's ims. First Sensual Bank of SL