lb v2 Scanners Gone

At 1am PST The lb v2 scanner dropped from the radar. I tested about 25 sims and all reported clean.

I hope they are gone for good and whoever is responsible for removing them. I thank you.

Well either the Lindens or Pete obviously got sick to death of the incessant whining. Oh well, one-nil to the pitchfork wielding mob, I guess. Well done, you all deserve a self-congratulatory wank. Oh you already did?

Ok. So that drama is over - who y'all gonna tear apart next? I'll volunteer if you like!

Did the sim performance improve markedly? Did you measure the FPS before and after?

It sickens me how LL can cave in to the demands of two noobs and a couple of very casual players who have done absolutely nothing for SL.
If there had been a vote it would have been like 0.05% of people for the scanners, 0.05% very loud people against the scanners, and 99.9% of people would say "what scanners? what's a scanner?"
Three cheers for the angry pitchfork wielders with far too much time on their hands, and far too little to worry about.

Luo went from 600 to 1145 FPS

Actually, they did some research and made sure to contact the appropriate parties to have a potentially server straining issue looked into. Given that it was successful, they improved server performance for a lot of people. What have you done for SL today?



Almost. "What scanners? What's a scanner? By the way, have you noticed this sim running faster lately?"

I was in the middle of developing a counter measure, when it stopped responding. I looked at my code closely, but everything seemed ok, then upon glancing at the stats, I noticed the bot itself was gone and sim performance improved radically. I am curious to see how others find their sim performance now

Well, Eggy, doesn't Weedy rest her case on this one? Willya just LOOK at that FPS. We've heard time and again that these scripts supposedly temp rez or whatever and don't draw on resources, and yet...they do....there is some field-tested proof for you.

I went around with one of those Brainiac scanners today on Furness because I have been absolutely bedevilled trying to figure where the lag and scripted objects are coming from when there are only like 3 of us owners on with anything much scripted, and even accounting for one very laggy store, they just can't make up that many items on a quiet residential sim.

I keep looking and looking and one odd thing is that the Brainiac scanner gets some items that it can't name. I have no idea if this is it or just things out of reach.

I checked Furness earlier this evening, it was in the 300s. Now it is in the high 700s. Still not great, but double what it was. The active scripts have dropped from high 400s to mid 300s. I have no idea if these land scanners were at work.

Tharu sim went from 500 to 850

I said it more than once before: if they were hurting simulator performance, then they should be removed. I just have trouble with the notion that a couple of cubes with a single script in them would cause much of a slowdown.
The thing about Sim FPS is:
- It's not a good measure of performance
- It varies wildly on its own
- Anything above a few hundred is fine. As long as the Time Dilation is 1.00 or thereabouts, the sim is running at full performance.

Yeah, but someone who owned land in the sim would lose buffer for his own scripts.

Now instead of the lowest reasonable FPS being 100 FPS it becomes 300 or 400 because the scanners were consuming the buffer zone.

Anyways, I think more investigation is required to ensure that these scanners caused a reduction in FPS.

Yeah, I mean, it's not like this was a formal benchmark performed in a controlled environment.
Chance Small's scanner was obviously very agressive, it had like FORTY scripts constantly scanning in parallel, but this one sounded like it spent most of its running time actually getting somewhere, and a temp-on-rez prim moving non-physically doesn't sound like a terrible CPU strain to me.
ANYWAY!
They're gone now, so let's not go into senseless forum drama again. No point in arguing how good or bad they were, I guess. The whole point is that they WERE, and now they aren't anymore, so go on with your lives and wake me up when there's some NEW drama to read

Night Eggy

Im out too

Which am I, Eggy? Noob or very casual player? Which is Hiro? Which is Kats? Which is Flip? Which is Juro? Which is Stoneself? Khamon? Malachi? CrystalShard? eltee? Hank? Aimee? Tcoz? Nolan?

Maybe you can dismiss a couple of those as casual players, maybe. But none are newbies, and most I would not classify as casual and all have done things to further SL.

Nice try dismissing the complaints by dismissing the complainers, though.



Ignorance is not acceptance, and I'm shocked you would even suggest that. I suspect there are more people activily against the scanners then for them, by a fair number (Just looking at the thread), and if you actually bothered to tell people what the scanners were, I suspect the figure would increase.

Shall we do a poll, now?



Yay for us!

I knew about these things in a vague way, but I didn't know they were in almost every sim until I read about it here. I checked out Moraine the other day but didn't find any, thank goodness.... if they're truly gone now, I'm glad of it.

Personally I think it's too bad that people have to get to this point-- mass complaining and forming virtual angry mobs-- to get any action on an issue like this. I know, the Lindens are busy people.... I'm just saying.

Sim FPS is not the best metric, no. But Indigo did go from ~700 sim fps with only me there two days ago, to averaging ~900 sim fps this morning over a course of about 400 polls (this morning), one per second.

Sim FPS above 100 is NOT fine. What you're forgetting to account for is that if a sim is at 700 fps without anyone in it, its going to be crushed by the time you get to about 20 people the sim, especially if you're stuck on an older server (as Indigo is).

I won't rehash the whole discussion about new servers versus old servers and performance, but Cory did admit in a town hall that Chromal's analysis was correct. Saying "anything above 100 sim fps is fine" is true if you have 30 avatars in the sim... However, if you want to have a sim that can support any kind of event, you really need all the juice you can get.

Again, I respect Eggy and Kris a lot, but I don't think this was an "angry pitchfork witchhunt" at all. It was a discussion about whether or not people have the right to use resources on sims they do not own 24/7/365. I think if people want to do things like that, they should get permission of the landowner. Pete's scanners were CLEARLY coded to get around autoreturn and violated the spirit of the law and land tools, if not the letter. This is more about philosophy than individual impact. Pete's project was akin to spyware or virii.

And no, that doesn't make him a bad person. There are a lot of things in life I wish I hadn't done, or that on second thought, embarrass me greatly. Pete, if you took them down, THANK YOU. Lindens, if you took them down, THANK YOU. Now modify the ToS so this whole thing doesn't ever have to happen again!

Regards,

-Flip

Oh yeah, now everyone that has a different opinion than you now is a noob or a very casual player? And "a couple" right... i saw much more than two couple players talking against the scanners, and most of them are FAR from being newbies. Probably YOU are a newbie compared to some of them, expecially considering the fact that noobiness is not measured only in time.
Truth this couple of "noobs and very casual players" completely demolished any points the meager couple (or little more) of defenders of the scanners (you included) brought and didn't care about the intimidation someone tried to exercise. It's called discussion, and during discussion the rez date doesn't matter.



So the fact that most people in SL know little about scripting and it's effects means that the ones that do are free to do what they want at the expense of others? Suuure.
By the way, considering the percentage of the few defender of scanners with the objectively high number of people that attacked them i would definately doubt that the percentages would be 0.5% and 0.5%, but anyway an high percentage of the germans during WW2 didnt know about the existance of the concentration camps. Does this make concentration camps acceptable?



So again, if one has a different opinion than you he has too much time on his hands and too little to worry about?
Well i have a real life job, two commercial activities on SL (that thank goodness have quite a good success so far and take a LOT of time to work on) and withthe activity as a photographer for the biggest modeling agency in SL i have quite a lot of things on my hands.
What about you?



Whoever in my eyes acts in a way i deem wrong causing grief to honest residents to achieve his own selfish goals.
And if i have to be labeled as a witch hunter for this, i am even quite proud of it, i will keep my guard up to make sure this "pollution of the sky" doesn't happen anymore, and i am sure many others will do the same.

Anyway i am glad to see that the land scanners disappeared, another victory of the interests of many against the selfishness of one.

By the way, Anton went up from 450-500 to about 650, maybe it's not indicative, but it's sure a good thing.

Thank Pete. He turned them off. He came over to my place in Stillman last night to talk about the odd flux in my sim fps - which I thought *may* have been occuring from his scanners. Pete turned them off and we watched. Without his scanners, Stillman still had the same fps: hovering around 1050 and dropping to mid 600s every minute or so. Clearly, whatever is causing the issue in my sim was not Pete's scanners.

Has anyone been tracking thier sim performance?

You'll volunteer to let us tear you apart Kris? Cool, but how bout I take you to dinner instead

Just by way of making a point: Who the fuck decreed that a newbie's point is any less valuable than someone else's?

Thanks, and now back to your rigid, ape-hierarchy way of looking at the world....

Umber went from ~2500 to 3300. But it's so hard to tell what causes what because of people coming and going, etc.

Probably when you turned off your wings.

Yes that was with my wings off. When I turn them ON, sim FPS drops to about... somewhere in the ballpark of 3, maybe 4. It depends on which systems I shut down, the flapper, the teleporter/radar, the mass orbiter, the av detector, the anti-push, the animation overrider, or the little script that makes me smile (literally).

You need to get that huge mini Aimee to fly.

eggy, you have no clue what yer talkin about, jus repeatin BS mantra that even LL has long since abandoned.

I wouldn call myself a clueless newbie, or a casual user... If anyone outside of LL knows more about the specifics of sim performance than i do, i would be admittedly a little suprised.. and honestly these weren't the laggiest objects in most sims.. no.. but at the same time.. the question could be what right a user has to lag a sim at all, if a) they are not present in it, and b) they own no land in it.

There has to be a line where you say a user simply can not, or should not, be able to arbitrarily run an entire network of objects like this.. because while no, one user doing this will not 'break' second life, 100 users doing this actually *WOULD*.. and where do you, as LL, effectively draw the line?

Either you basically say that this can not be allowed, or you are going to have to say to the 99th person, sorry, the other 98 people are okay... but you are going to have to stop now...

The former would be overall the most fair course of action, don't you agree?