Censorship

Interesting to speculate whether a famous and controversial film like Liliana Cavani's The Night Porter could be shown in SL.

Charlotte Rampling and Dirk Bogarde recreate a wartime sadomasochistic relationship they had when she was a prisoner and he was an SS gaurd - a serious film about human cruelty and decadence, complete with sexualized Nazi uniforms.

David,

Ah hah we are talking about a different thread - sorry...though my statements remain the same. Jessie has been on a thread closing rampage.

As far as the second topic, I can see how it would steer into a dangerous territory of implied hate speech, even if unintended, in violation of LL's TOS. I can imagine any discussion of how those items can be sexy would be very upsetting for a segment of SL community. Censorship? Yeah, I suppose it is, but there also needs to be some sensitivity when it comes to that topic, as you are talking about the deaths of millions of people, including the family of some SL residents. You can't separate the symbolism from the rest of it ultimately, no matter how hard people may try.

LOL! I was about to agree that we were talking about the same thread. Upon review there were some comical pictures posted in the thread, but certainly nothing promoting hate speech or intolerance.

In fact, there was no pro-n*zi talk at all. It was more of an observation about how comedy and sexiness can still encompass the more inhuman parts of human history without promoting those inhuman acts.

The thread started by the person asking people to join their IN GAME group so they could discuss and roleplay the subject matter IN GAME. Thats a very solid connection between the thread and in game.

Religious approved? Hell I see more and more of my religion being shunned everyday at work or by the government.

LL stands to lose more than any of us if those types of discussions get out of hand. Its their world we just live in it. They make the rules which are based on laws in places they wish to market their product. And in some countries, its not how civil a discussion is, its simply mentioning a topic. BUT we are free to make our own world or our own forums and discuss things however we like.

Actually, Godwin's law suggests not that the thread is over, but that any hope of useful discussion is over. My own observations suggest this is true.

What upsets me here is not the fact the thread was closed, it's LL forums and they do what they want (even though that doesn't make me agree with it) ; no, it's the fact it was closed after what, 2 days ?
I think LL should assign more staff to the forum, because in this case to me it looks like they check every once in a while and don't give a f*k.
No wonder people feel a chilling effect when they finally close a thread, but so long after it started and thus seemed acceptable.
Swift closing of thread is better IMO.

To take it one step further, Beau, if I was a potential investor and took a look at Second Life and saw a bunch of people running around wearing white sheets with Nazi signs on them do you really think I would want to invest my money in that?

Thanks for bringing that up, Merwan. It has been grossing me out (as far as forum moderation can gross one out).

I agree with this. I have watched in the past couple of weeks as some threads became heated, and then died down or get back on track, or started to slide into back-page oblivion, then be locked. It's kind of mystifying.

However, if you limit the possibilities of a Second Life where discussion and communication are potentially more free than the first, people will also start to question why they are there at all (and a lot of people DO use SL as a chat room). When business depends on community, it might be a better idea to sometimes put the freedom of the community first and the opportunity to make money by limiting that freedom second. Limiting freedom might make money in the short term, but it also limits the reasons that some people choose to have membership.

This is just my opinion. This is a complicated issue and both sides have valid points. Maybe immediate money really is more important than long term commitment of a community. I cannot guess whether or not LL has any secret agendas that would benefit from that strategy, nor would I want to (surprises are fun!).

That thread was closed at a very odd point, I thought. It had started to get a big ugly and then came around to a sensible enough discussion of the case and then, wham, Jeska killed it off in what was an obvious case of Monday morning quarterbacking.

Hi Everyone,

Just thought I should make an appearence to reassure you:

A) You are correct, I'm new to LL and might even make an occasional noob mistake (ie. calling an off-topic forum post 'too off topic', ha!)

B) I have no interest in censoring anything or anyone. My only role here is to enforce community standards and the Linden Lab T.O.S. agreement.

C) Our FOCUS is to preserve the supportive nature of the forums and prevent abuse of the system.

D) If you feel that we are overly restrictive in enforcing the T.O.S. agreement by banning offensive imagery, posting RL information about people, or taking measures to prevent trolling, please let us know or by all means free to set up your OWN forum.

Finally, and most importantly, despite the substancial (putting it mildly here) demands of running SL, we are making it a TOP PRIORITY to listen to YOU and make sure you know you are being HEARD by US. Feel free to email me directly anytime at: [email]jesse@lindenlab.com[/email]

Thanks!
- Jesse

wow.

Yeah, that's really all it boils down to.

I dunno, seems like a reasonable response to me. I don't mind a little attitude in my Lindens.

Still, I'm curious about how the Lindens interpret standards and corporate policies as they pertain to issues like these. As an example, does something like The Night Porter in SL , mentioned above, constitute an issue? Is there a difference if it's public or private? Or does it have to do with more obvious and blatant "political" displays, such as displaying the swastika on the side of your building, or the Confederate flag on the tailgate of your scripted pickup truck?

Hi Jesse.

Moderating a forum is a thankless task. Personally, I'd rather work behind the lost luggage counter at O'Hare.

I think LL is to be commended for the moderation policy here -- allowing anti-LL diatribes, and intervening only when residents are personally attacked or when offensive material is posted.

Don't all you forum readers appreciate how marvelous it is that you can say "LL sucks ass" here and it doesn't get deleted?

Be careful what you wish for.


Buster

If the potential investors are willing to wait a few seconds, they'll probably discover that the Klansmen are being chased by a dalek, a 30-foot Gary Coleman, an Elmo pez-dispenser and two slices of blueberry pie.

-- Neal Stewart

Hi Jesse

Don't those two comments above kinda conflict with each other?

If you don't like it..tough..but we are here to listen to you!

They dont conflict. Basically if you feel they are moderating too agressively, simply email them and discuss it.

SL is a freer place than other online games I've played. I'm glad the Lindens have avoided a lowest-common denominator approach to speech.

? Could you clarify this sentence? I'm going to assume, unless corrected, that what you mean to say is that you will enforce the ban on the publication of RL information.

The way it is written, it sounds like it could mean you will help enforce the TOS by publishing RL information if you have to.

everyone gives the lindens such a hard time, and I think that should end (unless its complaining about some reasonable bug, like login waits).

Here they are, making this great thing where a lot of people get together and do basically anything, and people continue to look at the glass as half empty. Next time you're going to use a about LL, think twice to see if it really deserves harsh words.

Just my two-cents.

Down with the MAN...umm..man!

Just kidding. The Linden's all know I love them. I even have "I LOVE LINDENS" tattood on my penis!

Linden Lab
Is fab
Not drab.

They make Second Life,
To get away from the wife,
and all the strife.

People give them a hard time,
While their concern for users is prime,
So I write this rhyme.