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SL Exchange WebSite Censorship

Merwan Marker
Booring...
Join date: 28 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,706
01-21-2005 06:42
On 1/12/2005 when my Administrative Access was Locked Out - this also resulted in loosing access to our hidden Administrative Forum where all our managment/business messages were located.

Today, 1/21/2005, my access to SLExchange.com has been reduced further.

I no longer has access to the Public Forums, or to my Private Messages.

I did cc: the message below from these forums to the Public Forms there. As stated, this is the first mention made of this difficult situation at SLEx.


Ring 'Them Bells



Has attempting to restrict people's ability to communicate ever helped further the truth?



_/_/_/
_____________________
Don't Worry, Be Happy - Meher Baba
Jacqueline Richelieu
SL Resident Economist
Join date: 28 Jul 2004
Posts: 260
01-21-2005 06:45
Merwan, what is being done to you is probably illegal. If you can find any transmission in which you were called a partner, you probably have claim to half the business. Additionally, your actions can probably be shown to demonstrate that both of you worked under the assumption that you were a partner and not some at-will labor.

If this cannot be resolved, you might seriously think of legal action. Especially if SLEX becomes worth the $150k some have proposed it might be worth...
Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-21-2005 06:46
Sounds like the SLE Master is out to control the information and surpress the truth. Typical socialist at work.. hehehe Boycott the SLExchange.
blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
01-21-2005 06:49
:D
_____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :

"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches."
Inez Angelus
Elephant Rider
Join date: 11 Nov 2004
Posts: 129
01-21-2005 06:54
For what its worth, I'm going to remove all 6 of my items from SLExchange and pull out what money I have made. Honestly, its not an earth shattering decision since I've only sold like 2 items on there and frankly I'm too busy to set up any more items anyway.

If I ever feel the need to sell SL items on the web, there are other alternatives that don't make me nervous about who I'm dealing with.

Merwan, sorry this is happening to you.

I tried to stay neutral - Big Business was never my thang, nor was organized protest against the same - but this missive just makes me very very unsettled about who is getting the percentage of my sales (however dismal) and their personal code of ethics.

Very interested to see what project you apply yourself to next, Merwan, as you seem to be a very dedicated individual with admirable standards of conduct. Good luck to you in the future.

-Inez
Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-21-2005 07:00
This is the perfect time for somebody to create a competing website and steal away customers from SLEX..
Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
01-21-2005 07:02
From: Alby Yellowknife
This is the perfect time for somebody to create a competing website and steal away customers from SLEX..


One such site already does exist. And it is free to list there ( http://secondserver.net/ ). There are also 2 other similar sites that I know are in the works.

EDIT to add: I am not internally associated with any of the sites, nor do I currently list products on any of them.
_____________________
*hugs everyone*
Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
01-21-2005 07:03
Merwan,

As you know you have my full support - you are welcome as well to use my forums - I would be glad to set up one for you if you would like to keep some of this off of the main forums. Please let me know - I am sorry you are going through all of this.
_____________________
Cristiano


ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less.

~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more.

Alby Yellowknife
Sic Semper Tyrannis
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,148
01-21-2005 07:06
From: Pendari Lorentz
One such site already does exist. And it is free to list there ( http://secondserver.net/ ). There are also 2 other similar sites that I know are in the works.

EDIT to add: I am not internally associated with any of the sites, nor do I currently list products on any of them.




Spread the word... Screw SLEX and relocate to http://secondserver.net/
Moonshine Herbst
none
Join date: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 483
01-21-2005 07:09
I have removed my 24 items until further notice. Prices are from 150 to 5000, and I've sold quite a lot, but i dont care.

I feel that Merwan deserves his rightful part of the commission, since he was the one that convinced me to list my items there. I was quite reluctant to list my stuff, but Merwan isnt the type of guy to give up so easily, so it is 100% because of him that I made money there in the first place.
Moopf Murray
Moopfmerising
Join date: 7 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,448
01-21-2005 07:17
Merwan, I've supported you throught this situation so far but I want to repost here what I posted in response to Ferran earlier regarding your posts on SLExchange:

From: someone
Merwan has stated that he doesn't want a boycott and, in his most recent post, has said that he's not trying to influence people. I find this second point confusing made, as it was, on a post that clearly laid entire blame for the situation on Apotheus and went to great lengths to show that it's Apotheus' action (or inaction) that causes this to continue. It even makes it clear what the source of the 'blackmail' issue is. Saying he's not trying to influence people then making such a post against Apotheus is a conflict of positions. In addition I notice that Merwan has re-posted the same message twice on two different boards on SLExchange's forum - these do not appear to be the actions of somebody who is "not trying to influence people" and I'd suggest has done his cause more damage than good. Merwan appears to be playing the forum now, publicly challenging Apotheus based on what have obviously been private discussions between the two.

I cannot say that I blame Merwan for going so public on this, as it appears that he's getting nowhere privately, but to pretend that by posting publicly he's not trying to influence people is tenuous to say the least.


I'm sorry but I think you knew that posting on the SLExchange forums such words would get the posts deleted and you banned (I know I've been periodically refreshing the SLExchange forum because I fully expected it to happen once Apotheus saw it), which would give you something more to add to your argument here. As I said in that post earlier you appear to be playing the forum now, and I stick with that assesment. I don't think you're doing yourself any favours here.
Nephilaine Protagonist
PixelSlinger
Join date: 22 Jul 2003
Posts: 1,693
01-21-2005 07:31
Hi Merwan :)

I have been following all this with great interest the last few days. I am so very sorry this has all happened to you- it is neither right nor fair.

On that note, I have deactivated all my items on slexchange.
It was 14 pages of TEDIOUS PAIN ;) to do it, but it's done.
If there is satisfactory resolution for you, then I will reactivate them. If not, I wont, and will be in touch with whomever I need to be in touch with to cancel the acct entirely.
This has nothing to do with the current BOYCOT!! thing, and more to do with the fact that I will not do business with people who I percieve to be shady.
I dont know Apotheus personally, but these actions look shady as hell. That's enough for me.

Merwan, when I was getting all the slexchange stuff set up, was it Apotheus that answered all my questions? Was it Apotheus who dropped everything to come over and get the ATM set up at PD? Was it Apotheus who has responded to numerous forum posts and sent numerous IW IMs simply to congratulate me on updating new product, and to thank me for my time and involvement? No. It wasnt. It was you.
I dont doubt that Apotheus has done a ton of work to get and keep the site running. But the face and heart of slexchange has been Merwan.
And with all of this hubbub, I think it's safe to say that SLexchange has lost most of it's face, and damn near its entire heart. Maybe if there is satisfactory resolution, in time both those things can be restored to the level of respect they DID have. But I am not hopeful on that count.

I am sorry, Merwan. :(
-Nephi
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Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
01-21-2005 07:35
Merwan, *HUGS* ... No matter what happens, you should forever be proud at all the hard work you did for slex and for all the consumers and retailers you brought in. It very much was *you* that people associated with slex. So again be proud of yourself, you deserve it! :)
_____________________
*hugs everyone*
Liona Clio
Angel in Disguise
Join date: 30 Aug 2004
Posts: 1,500
01-21-2005 07:44
Merwan,

Thank you for updating us on what's going on. I know you wish this was a private matter, and I can understand how difficult it is to deal with a situation like this. My opinion of the situation is a bit more informed, and as such has changed a bit. It does not seem right to me when a person won't discuss a disagreement, especially when financial contracts are involved. I hope you'll be able to resolve this...and even if it can't be resolved, know that you have a *lot* of support from your friends here!

Alby....Long Time Listener, First Time Detractor! I find it amusing that you are supporting a boycott of SL Exchange...Aren't you a neo-conservative Bush supporter who believes in the sanctity of capitalism? I'm willing to bet this might be the first time you've agreed with Ulrika, tho. :)

EDIT: ACK! Nephi's not on SLEX anymore??? No more PixelDoll shopping at work??? *Whimper* :(
_____________________
"Well, my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle."
blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
01-21-2005 07:46
:p
_____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :

"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches."
Moopf Murray
Moopfmerising
Join date: 7 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,448
01-21-2005 07:51
From: blaze Spinnaker
I did the posting.

Anyways, we're all bugging him for information. I think its reasonable that he lets people know what's going on.


Keep with the program Blaze. I'm talking about Merwan's original posts on the SLExchange forums much earlier today which were removed by Apotheus and led to him being banned from the SLExchange forums. Hence......Merwan starting this thread here.

It's reasonable to let people know what's going on, absolutely. But Merwan's words today, whilst saying he's not trying to influence people, are down right obviously trying to influence people and the situation in general.

Oh yeah and your new posts there under the name 'Sky Marshall'...just as over the top and as bad as Ulrika's posts on this forum, just so you know my feelings.
blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
01-21-2005 07:56
:rolleyes:
_____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :

"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches."
MrsJakal Suavage
Purple Butterfly
Join date: 18 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,434
01-21-2005 07:58
From: Moopf Murray
Keep with the program Blaze. I'm talking about Merwan's original posts on the SLExchange forums much earlier today which were removed by Apotheus and led to him being banned from the SLExchange forums. Hence......Merwan starting this thread here.

It's reasonable to let people know what's going on, absolutely. But Merwan's words today, whilst saying he's not trying to influence people, are down right obviously trying to influence people and the situation in general.



Moopf...usually I agree with alot of stuff you say on the forums but not this time. I can see why you would think this, however, I know that Merwan has talked to many of us Merchants privately over the past couple weeks. It was not to pursuade us to leave SLEX it was to encourage us to stay while he tries to work things out. I can't speak for the other merchants, but I personally requested to be informed of the results of this possible resolution. I trust Merwan and waited to pull my stuff until I heard the results.

This is still MY choice. The only influence that Merwan had was getting me to stay as long as I did. I feel confindent that this is the case with many others.
_____________________
Liona Clio
Angel in Disguise
Join date: 30 Aug 2004
Posts: 1,500
01-21-2005 07:59
From: Moopf Murray
It's reasonable to let people know what's going on, absolutely. But Merwan's words today, whilst saying he's not trying to influence people, are down right obviously trying to influence people and the situation in general.


Words influence people, Moopf...there's really no way Merwan or you or me can avoid that other than being totally silent. People have to base their opinions on something. for my part, I don't see any evidence that he's trying to pander for sympathy from the forum crowd...I kinda think that's a kneejerk assumption about a lot of posts on the forums.
_____________________
"Well, my days of not taking you seriously have certainly come to a middle."
David Valentino
Nicely Wicked
Join date: 1 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,941
01-21-2005 08:05
Merwan..hang tough bud. I'm very sorry you are having to go through all of this. I will be sharing some of these recent events with the vendors at my place who don't frequent the forums, and let them decide if they wish to take action.

I don't know why, after observing man's ill treatment of man for so long, that I feel shocked at what was done to you. Greed, dishonesty and self-interest seem to be almost held as virtues in our modern society.

You've always been kind, helpful and friendly Merwan, and you worked very hard to get SLEx off to a great start. You deserve far better than this.
_____________________
David Lamoreaux

Owner - Perilous Pleasures and Extreme Erotica Gallery
Moopf Murray
Moopfmerising
Join date: 7 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,448
01-21-2005 08:05
From: blaze Spinnaker
All I did was quote, Moopf?

I think this is a far better alternative to boycotting, which is what everyone is trying to do here.


You posted the same thing on every single board on the SLExchange web site, apart from the one you don't have permissions for. You don't think that's a little...erm...inflamatory and over the top? :rolleyes:

Apotheus is nowhere to be seen and hasn't posted publicly on it since the 18th, Merwan's gone full circle in prodding the forums here for support and creating a situation on the SLExchange forums that he could then bring back to this forum as another example of how one-sided this is, nearly 1000 items have been removed from SLExchange today by my reckoning and you're spamming every board on the SLExchange forums with repeats of Merwan's post. Oh and then there's the messages that Ulrika appears to be sending to people in-world which I've been told about:

From: someone

Hello, I'm contacting you as you're a merchant on SLExchange. There are some recent developments with SLExchange of which you should be aware.

Apotheus Silverman has terminated his relationship with his business partner without compensation. In an attempt to control the business he has tried to blackmail, stonewall, and intimidate his business partner into either leaving or selling out for a fraction of the site's worth.

I am asking you to show your support for ethical business practices by sharing this information with others, contacting Apotheus directly to request a resolution, and withdrawing your wares from SLexchange in boycott.

Below is supporting information from Apotheus's partner and other users who intend to boycott SLExchange.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Merwan Marker


When a bell rings, the sound travels from a single source outward. A bell can not be un-rung, this song can not be unsung.

Many people have asked me to speak about SL Exchange so they could decide how to proceed. Others have asked what to do regarding their products and L$ held at the site; some have asked what will happen in the future. I have even been encouraged to join in other ventures and to become active in boycotts of one sort or another.

I am NOT attempting to persuade public opinion - my goal has been just the opposite! I have worked to keep this private and to get back to business as usual, and that has not happened.

I've talked privately with SL residents who are uniquely involved with our community and who would be honest with me. I have also consulted with others I know personally and professionally.

SL Exchange has been involved with a number of RL and SL businesses. We have had discussions concerning services, features, and expansion into additional SL and RL markets. Other businesses are aware of our efforts from different perspectives - venture capital investors, Linden Lab folks, and other inWorld business people. I have used due diligence at all times, and have honored the terms and conditions of my SL Exchange business contract, the LL TOS and Community Standards. I continue to do so.

There is a written partnership contract detailing the SL Exchange business. I have a 40% owner share in SL Exchange - my business partner knows this, and has acknowledged our partnership contact as recently as today.

Simply put - I have been party to an attempted hostile take over of my ownership share of SL Exchange. This began early morning of 1/12/2005 when I was locked out of SLExchange.com and denied access to our business accounts.

At no time prior to 1/12/2005 was I informed by my partner that he had serious concerns about our business transactions. Six days later, just after midnight on 1/18/2005, he began this thread. During the previous 6 days, (12th-18th) he refused all attempts to discuss his grievances - including an inWorld meeting with a Linden Lab representative and myself.

On the afternoon of 1/18/2004, I received a message from him acknowledging our business contract, and an offer to purchase my 40% portion of SL Exchange. The offer stated that my failure to sell to him would result in SL Exchange ceasing operations. Some inWorld discussions have occurred, but we have failed to agree on how to value the business. I've been presented a final buyout offer and I am again told my failure to sell to him will result in the liquidation of the business. I have rejected his offers.

Lastly, the reference to blackmail in message #1 was not made by me. It referred to the first message to me on 1/12/2005 explaining why I was locked out of the website. In that message a L$-amount was offered to be paid to me immediately on 1/12/05 in return for my silence concerning the termination of my involvement with SL Exchange. If I choose not to agree to his cash offer, he stated I would receive nothing but I would be free to talk. I was also informed, there would be no negotiations, no telephone calls, no instant messages regarding this situation.

I thank everyone for their patience and restraint and the many messages of support and encouragement during this difficult time. Your positive words do matter, and their impact on me has been helpful.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Aaron Levy

I have no reason whatsoever NOT to believe what Merwan said in this post. It is because of that fact that I will not be part of a project that gives profit to Apotheus any longer. Apotheus started this thread as a P.R. stunt to salvage his image because he KNEW it would go public.

And I don't care WHAT Apotheus says the "definition" of blackmail is, HE IS BLACKMAILING MERWAN with his REPUTATION. Apotheus is taking this entire matter and putting it on Merwan's shoulder's, FORCING (blackmailing) him into taking what is obviously a lesser amount than Merwan's share is worth.

Merwan has EVERY RIGHT to not cave into threats and the shady practices of Apotheus. If SLExchange ceases operation, it will be because of the majority shareholder ceasing its operation.

People -- go get your money our of SLExchange NOW. We have witnessed the kind of business practices Apotheus uses, I will not allow him to do it with my money, no matter how large or small of a SLExchange customer or merchant I am. And this is saying a lot for me, because sales of my products on SLExchange beat my sales in-world almost 5 to 1. Hell, most of the time I don't have money in the game unless I've got SLExchange sales coming in.

It's a cool service. But cool services run by crooked people... I will not support.

I mean, hell, if Apotheus had just voiced his concerns, plans, ideas with Merwan, this whole ugly situation probably would have turned out a lot differently.

Now to go update my SecondServer account...

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Jonquille Noir

I've also withdrawn my business from SLExchange.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Asha Lumiere

eah and he did it so well I thought he was the sole owner. He is the reason I used the service because I know he's trustworthy. I don't think I'll be using it anymore either. Why can't I withdraw my funds?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Moopf Murray

OK, I hope everybody is now removing their money and items from SLExchange. If Apotheus is willing to harm the merchants so obviously over this by ceasing operations if Merwan does not accept he needs to have everything pulled from beneath him. Let him cease operations. He'll never run an equivalent service like SLExchange after this if he does indeed go through with it as the community will just kick it into touch before he gets it started.

It's clear that Apotheus doesn't have the merchant's interests at heart here, only his own greed.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Francis Chung

I have temporarily de-listed my items from slexchange. I've seen enough that I'm seriously concerned about who I'm doing business with.

I will await for Apotheus to present his side of the story before coming to a final decision.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------



Quoting me in her own in-world rhetoric (did ya ask if you could?).

Everybody, and that includes Apotheus and Merwan, get a bloody grip, would you.
blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
01-21-2005 08:13
:rolleyes:
_____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :

"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches."
Moopf Murray
Moopfmerising
Join date: 7 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,448
01-21-2005 08:17
From: Liona Clio
Words influence people, Moopf...there's really no way Merwan or you or me can avoid that other than being totally silent. People have to base their opinions on something. for my part, I don't see any evidence that he's trying to pander for sympathy from the forum crowd...I kinda think that's a kneejerk assumption about a lot of posts on the forums.


Liona, I couldn't agree more that words influence people, which is why it's odd that Merwan should use the words he did yet try to say he wasn't trying to influence people when it is obvious he was. Posting on SLExchange what he did this morning, he is either extremely naive or knew that they would be removed and he'd have something else to bring here to 'not influence people' with. I mean he started a thread about it here straight away, obviously not wanting to influence people.

Merwan's been dealt with harshly, I just see him spiralling into prodding the forum now, trying to make the battle very public because he's getting nowhere privately. That's not conducive to helping the SLExchange merchants now, is it.
blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
01-21-2005 08:29
:o
_____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :

"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches."
Mash Mandala
http://depoz.wordpress.co
Join date: 19 Jan 2004
Posts: 211
01-21-2005 08:40
Merwan, the only reason I listed my items on slexchange was because I trusted you. With that said, I too have deactivated all my items on the site and have withdrawn my money.

When this first started, I contacted Merwan about how to remove my items from the site. Because he is and always as been in this for the right reasons, he told me not to jump and to hold off and see how things went. Merwan, I know this was your stand. But because it seems to be going nowhere and appears that you are getting the royal shaft, I will no longer support a site who would treat partners as such. Really makes me wonder what they would do to their customers! Hang in there!
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