"I know if I was in Mexico I would make an effort to learn Hispanic."

I was thinking something along these same lines...

My Great-Grandmother spoke German primarily and very little English, A mere handful of phrases that got her by with the local merchants. Even then, it was quite broken English. No one ostracized her or threatened to take away her kids. She managed to raise TEN kids, all of whom were hard working and went on to lead successful lives and raise families of their own.

Why is this stigma being attached to only certain groups? ("That was then, this is now" is not going to cut it for me).

Nolan,
You are misinterpreting.... I applaud you and your staff members. However you are very niave if you think that everyone has that desire to learn. It's those that have no desire to try to learn to communicate that I am talking about. Also, having dealt with court systems personally, I am quite sure this woman was given a list of available local resources.

And for those that are trying to imply that I am prejudiced towards Mexicans, I am not and would like to point out that I did not use them as an example in my original post.

The only thing I dislike are people who REFUSE to learn the local language. Then they consider you arrogant for thinking they should learn to communicate. If they are making a genuine attempt at learning/speaking english, I have no problem with taking time to peice together what they're saying.

Thank you Tikki, exactly what I am saying!

For the record, I meant the court system being potentially prejudiced.

While it's true that not everyone wants to learn, I do not think I am being naive. I have worked in this restaurant off and on since college (15+ years ago). The influx of Mexican folk to our area had already started then and has steadily increased since. During this period I have been exposed to many, many Mexican people, most of whom do want to learn English. I also lived in an area of the US that was 81% hispanic demographically for several years. Many of them, especially the older folks, spoke very little English if any at all. I suspect that a judge in that area would never consider coercing a person to learn English by threatening to take their kids. Yeah, pull their kids away from them, that will really solve the problem. "You will learn English or we will tear apart your family!" What a way to endear them to our system.

I am sure they gave them resources too, which is great - I just see no need to threaten the removal of children to coerce someone into learning English. It's plain wrong. I had friends in High School and College from Vietnam and India - most of their parents spoke nearly no English if any at all. Their kids were some of the brightest around - in fact my friends Ravindra and Hoang were near genius'.

In Switzerland, some folks speak German, some Italian, and some folks French. I wonder how they manage without threatening to take away people's children? All 3 are official languages, and not everyone speaks the other languages.

The article did say that the initial reason for this mother being in the court to begin with was for child abuse/neglect. Now I am not going to try to guess (as the article does not give specifics) what the extent of that abuse/neglect was. However I do suspect that part of the intent there was to persuade the mother to be able to understand "Do not beat/starve(whatever the case may be) your children" if you wish to keep them in your care.
For the record, I agree with what you are saying as well, it would be wrong to threaten to take someone's child because they could not speak a particular language. I just don't think that was the point, and it certainly was not mine.

It does give specifics. She was unaware of immunization standards in the US. That was the impetus.

Rather than threatening to take away her kids, they could simply have had a translator (they have them available here in MN in the courthouses and I am sure they do there as well) tell her about the policy, then gave her six months to show that she was trying to learn English or face coming back before the judge. The coercion, in my opinion was unneccesary. She didn't intentionally "neglect" her kid. It was ignorance, not malice.

It also says she is a citizen. How did she become a citizen knowing no English? Who failed there? The system. When my ex, who is Korean, applied for citizenship, she had to demonstrate some knowledge of English and the structure of the American government. Why was this not done at this woman's citizenship hearing? Now she will be penalized because they let her slip through the cracks?

Not implying that about you at all.

Again, English is the language of the USA, and people should learn it if they want to be able to communicate with others. What I tried to explain is that there are many reasons people do not speak the language; we cannot simply say that they don't speak it because they are lazy, although no doubt it is the case with some.

For a good example of what I mean, listen to Governor Schwarzenegger speak. He has been in this country for about 30 years. He is a highly motivated and extremely dedicated individual, who has spent countless hours of instruction trying to get rid of his accent, but if you arrive here after a certain age, believe me, and I tell you from personal experience, it is very difficult to learn the language or shake the accent.

Now, if Arnold has had such a hard time even with his intelligence, dedication and access to the best speech instructors, what can we expect from a poor (as in money poor)immigrant who possibly cannot read or write in their native language?

There is nothing more frustrating than not to be able to communicate. I am sure 99% of immigrants would love to be able to speak English as good as they speak their native language, but for a variety of reasons, it is not as simple as it sounds.

- T -

Very good point.
I've heard that the part of our brain involved with learning (and pronouncing) language is at its prime when we're kids. It's more difficult to learn a new language as a teen or an adult. That's one problem with requiring foriegn languages in high school- it's kinda late. I've studdied Spanish on and off since I was 13 (over 20 years) , but I still can barely understand spanish-speaking television and radio. Ideally a second language should be taught much earlier.
I'm hijacking slightly, but has any school tried this? Lets say most people in community X speak either English or Spanish. Starting from Kindergarten, all kids (regardless of whether they speak English or Spanish) get half of their instruction in English half of their instruction is Spanish. If it worked, you'd end up with kids who were fluent in both languages.

Tito what the hell are you doing in Off-Topic cabrone? I thought you vowed to stay away!

Most Mexicans have larger than average heads!

This is a marginalizing statement, but since you brought it up, I've noticed it too. I think it's because it takes more brainpower to speak/read/write hispanic.

The only Mexican head I see on a regular basis is on top of a cerveza tecate that was poured to fast!

Tecate has no head unless you use sal con limon

Surely you didn't just call me Sal!

My wife has a big head!

As a matter of fact I have two big-headed babies!

Oh and another thing....their feet are meatier! I guess it has to do with climbing tress to snatch the coconuts.

Better than one big two-headed baby!

Don't ever fucking call me Shirley again purseboy!!!!

Ouch !!! Lo siento Paris

Did I Missy the point of this post?

LOL
<---- wordless therefore no retort

When I lived in Japan, I did not expect people to speak English to me. Instead, I learned enough Japanese to get along.

The US is an English speaking country-period. If you are going to live here, you should learn the language. The more crutches we provide to immigrants to keep from learning their new country's language, the harder it is for them to integrate into American society.

On the other hand, being tri-lingual myself, I do believe in the value of learning a second language and think it should be started at an earlier stage than HS.

-Kiamat Dusk
Wo hui putongua. Saya juga bisa bicacara dalam bahasa Indonesia.