Question about moving out of one's country--

Suppose one was finishing an American education in Adolescent Education--English with a minor in Film Studies. This student will have a lot of college loans to pay off after graduation (we're talking roughly $40k) but this student is really worried about what his nation will be 'up to' in the next four years. Are there countries outside the US that take in outsiders and allow for residency that doesn't cost a bazillion dollars and decades upon decades to earn? This is NOT a "US-bashing" thread; I'm curious from people who have researched this (I know some people have) if there ARE places to go aside from America that would allow for success without having to live in the gutter or without feeling oppressed. Anyone know how residency works with Canada? Australia? any other countries you think would be good for people trying to escape all this?

You mean you can't even suck it up for 4 years?

Seriously though, check out

http://www.escapeartist.com/

It's a great ex-patriot website for people wanted to flee America (no it's not a joke site).

They have information on moving overseas, living overseas, where to find jobs, etc...

If you really want to move... and can't afford it.. contact me in world.. I will HELP make arrangement to help you pack if you are serious.

edited to add the word HELP

wow. take a deep breath, switch to decaf, pet a cat, sit down and put your feet up.

i would so love to see 49% of the population flee the country every four to eight years hehe. imagine how easy parking would be.

My understanding is that Canada is a much easier bet. In my understanding of Aussie immigration policy, its fairly difficult to immigrate to the land of Mad Max. You must basically prove (quite extensively) that you will be able to contribute to society.

This isn't a "four years" thing. The things Bush has done for THIS four years will have long term effects that America will have to live down and battle for years to come. Another four years could kill America completely. Turn it into something resembling 1984. It certainly is headed that way now.

show of hands, who here has lived in a real totalitarian regime?

I was in the US Army

did they ever hook a car battery to your testicles or cut off your fingers because you snuck a copy of Cosmo into the barracks?

> Are there countries outside the US that take in outsiders

Most places will let you live there either as a tourist or if you can find a real job. No-one will let you in to clean streets, but who'd want to do that anyway?

Azelda

It's the coil that hurts, not the battery

I once snuck a guy named Cosmo into the barracks, all I got was some weird looks though...

All kidding aside, no I haven't lived under a totalitarian regime. Maybe I should try it for perspective's sake though...

If all the hyserics in the nation were identified... I have a feeling there would be a high correlation with the number of ardent Democrats... but that is just a gut feeling..

OTOH, to help those out who have serious intentions of leaving the country.. I do offer the following deal for you... I will mortgage my house/take out a loan to buy you the tickets provided you make the following promise... never to return and never to speak or write about American politics again....ever.. anywhere. If you can't take the results of an election in stride, I thin k leaving is probably the right thing for you to do and I want to help. But everything has its price - the price of valued criticism of our system is living here and playing the game if you want my opinion. You leave... you can't play anymore.

Oh, and you would be in good company leaving to avoid the system and the things about it which you disagree with. That valiant American hero Sylvester Stallone, the English teacher, ran to Canada because he couldn't handle it here. John Wayne applied for exemption from WWII military service. They reestabllished themselves as admirable people in some people's eyes... Not mine maybe.. but what do I know?

You don't need my respect.. but hysterics won't garner you any... and my offer is genuine. I dare you to take me up on it...

((seems I remember something similar last election season.. Baldwin and others? threatening to leave? then denying they ever said it.... hmmm.. what did they gain? what does the thread starter and other similar hysterics gain? Attention! that's it! Attention - however negative - is still attention! Remember that.))

WTF does THAT have to do with anything?

since the subject of killing America and turning it into 1984 came up i'm curious to know if anyone's got first hand experience with totalitarian regimes. that's WTF it has to do with anything.

1. People can be arrested without being charged, access to a lawyer, and held without a trial. That sounds like 1984.

2. The internet, phone services, and other forms of electronic media are now all being monitored by the government. That sounds like 1984.

It doesn't have to be a totalitarian regime to be un-American.

Those things have been going on long before the last decade/he current decade began. So don't try to imply that anything Bush has done is anything new.

If you don't believe me.. go read the Alien and Sedition Acts. Go read about the actions of the Federal government under lots of administrations around election time or in times of "perceived or potential" threats. This is nothing new.. it's the media making things seem like they are not what has nearly always been the case - but most people didn't know it/about it.

Even simple publication of materials counter to government positions and policies have landed people in jail within the last 100 years. So, why go all ballistic on something that is not new, has almost the feel of normalcy in a sense, and just HAPPENS to be occurig under the Administration of a Party you may not agree with?

Just because it's happened in the past doesn't mean it's a good thing to keep doing it.

That's like excusing the murder of 14,000 Iraqi civilians by saying "Oh, we're saving them from a ruthless, murderous dictator!" (Which is especially inexcusable when we're not going after worse offenders like China.)

Patriot Act:

Without a warrant and without probable cause, the FBI now has the power to access your most private medical records, your library records, and your student records... and can prevent anyone from telling you it was done.

Homeland Security Act:

Promotes the creation of what one senator once called "a global security system" controlled by the United States, not to mention a budding police state in America. This agenda falls neatly in line with the plan for American global dominance endorsed by Cheney, Wolfowitz, Powell, and Rumsfeld.

I didn't excuse antyhing.. I said that this is the norm. Trying to blow it out of proportion as if this is something new is ridiculous.

As for the deaths of civilians in another country.. doesn't affect me personally in the least. I wasn't there. I fI was, I wouldn't admit it. I f I was there and admitted it, it was done under orders from a superior.

Seriously.. couldn't care less about dead civilians in another country.. simple as that. Didn't give a shit about the dying Ethiopians starving for food I didn't eat and left on my plate.... leaving it on my plate wouldn't have fed them anyway. Couldn't care less about the dead in the camps during WW2 - wasn't born yet. See? If it doesn't directly affect me, I can afford and prefer to ignore it... that is what a curmudgeon does.

OTOH, I am a realist... I have no real effect on politics except locally IF that. So, why worry about it? I can't fight the entire sysem and win.. so I deal with it.

It ain't perfect, but neither am I as much as I assure myself I am. But it's what we have and what is the best in the world at this time.

Why can't the Pitts just spend their time studying you?

What's there to say about me? I am a curmudgeon. That says it all.

However, there's got to be at least 10 dissertations explaining your narcissism, self-pity, and defensiveness. Your absolute inablity to see anyone else's point except (and sometimes in spite of) if agrees with your own would probably drive even Freud insane.

Go crawl in a hole you ignorant troll.... sorry for the insult to trolls elsewhere.

Are you planning on paying off your student loans? What exactly are you trying to escape?
Did you take out loans funded with tax dollars to get your schooling?

Wow. Get a human soul dude. Humanity is all we have. If we are a bunch of soulless machines like you, then what's the point?

I hear Afghanistan and Iraq are in need of teachers, and the cost of living there is like $2000/ annually in Iraq and $20/ annually in Afghanistan.

People have routinely misread the post... and similar statements I have made.

I have a lot of humanity. However, I am a realist. Ther are certain things I can affect and certain things I cannot. Why waste my time worrying about those things I cannot change or those things which will not affect me? I have enough to deal with without taking on any more.

Soulless? Possibly. I learned a long time ago that you have to be a "soulless" person as you pull the trigger and snuff someone else's life or it can eat you up. I was in that position. So were many others with military (or similar) service. I don't have any problems with having fired at people with the intention of killig them - others do.

I also don't have any problem throwing out uneaten food while knowing there is a starving orpahn somewhere outside my "relatively immediate" world. What good would not throwing it out do?

Gimme a break Hank. Don't read into the post. Deal with it as written. I was VERY specific.

Oh, to answer your question though... there is no point.