Passage Solution to the New Continent

There has been much discussion about the ways to get to the new continent.
SIM PURPLE is the gateway to the new world, something about which we are very proud and wish to share with others.

At this point there is no TP direct to this area. Until such time that the Lindens feel it is appropriate to put TP's up north (if ever) we have established a spot for "Explorers" to begin their journeys.

There are several means of transport. First of all, you will find a community boat dock for all. It is clearly visible towards the edge of the sim. In addition, directly above the dock is an airstrip sitting at 50 meters high.

Both of these are for free use by the community at large. Please be courteous and do not leave vehicles around so that all may have space to enjoy their trip.

If you want to set your HOME to an area close to the new world but have no land to do so, we have established a small part of the land and separated it from the group ownership of Sim Purple. To use this as your home, you will need to join "THE EXPLORER's GROUP" club. It is an open enrollment and available at no charge. By joining this group, you may go to PURPLE 147, 172 and set your home to that spot. It is located south of the dock and will be marked with an Explorer's Group Insignia.

In addition, at the dock and on the "Home" spot, you will find silver flight bracelets free to copy. If you have no appropriate vehicle, wearing these will speed your journey.

We are also interested in anyone who would like to help provide transport for others to the New World at no cost or at a nominal fee not to exceed $2 per trip. Please contact Mash or Baccara if you would like to work on this with us.

It is our pleasure to share our good fortune of having Purple be the path to the new world with everyone.

Happy Trails, Mash and Baccara

I suppose it's a good thing that people are getting together to cope with the usual Linden-induced difficulty.

Meanwhile, it's worth pointing out that in other threads, people are not at all happy to just sit back and wait on this, and have some very strong opinions about feeling they were misled to ever buy land in the New Continent, since they assumed, based on past performance, there would be telehubs. Some are even tiering down in protest or not buying. So compensating for this difficulty is something they may not encourage.

I personally am determined to remain in the new world, and whether or not there is a telehub, I will stay. It is disturbing to find out that this subject could be so manipulated. It's especially disturbing to find out that some players believe "the community has already spoken" and voted for "no telehubs" although there is no such "community that has spoken" because none was accessed.One can't take an easily-spammed forum poll as a vote, or one Hotline to the Lindens post, but realize there is some really serious differences on this issue.

While I respect your effort to create a volunteer, free effort, I really have to question why you then are trying to subdue others who would like to make commercial ventures. It's one of the problems in the game that anyone who tries to cover real costs finds themsleves undercut.

Why the arbitrary fix of $2 for tickets, so that only those who collect a token amount can use your "public access" land?

Why would it be "wrong" to charge money for the difficult and time-consuming job of ferrying people over to the new area? I recall Charlotte Gillepsie, God bless her, was charging $50 for the ride, and it was a great idea.

If you set up a ceiling of $2 on your very strategically placed land, you're implying that others who charge more, who you will bar from your "public access" are somehow to be mistrusted.

I, for one, will go on offering $50/week rentals of our landing areas for log-ins, so that you can join the group Aztecha in order to land at our mall at Columbia 158, 76 or join Ravenglass Rentals to land in Calleta and then set yourself to home as a group member. Or if you don't want to have "home" set at these locations, use the "log in at last location" preference and log-out from there. But if you use our land to "set home to here," you'll be able to get to the New Continent in a jiffy.

If you pay $50/week to rent a stall, obviously you can get a "set home to here" automatically. So that's what I recommend you do!

Currently, I do not have a single request for a $50/week log-in (though we have rentals of vending space in the mall). And that's because people think it's a joke. It's not! This is a great way to get out to the new world fast, and well worth it if you are trying to shop for land or start a business there.

Since I am frequently out in the New Continent IM me or Prokofy Neva for a TP -- happy to give them. TP's are the fastest way to get out there.

It's not racketeering to charge money for services in this difficult-to-settle-area. The land there costs more on the auction, the resellers are pricing high, and it is difficult without a telehub. A variety of ways should be sought to improve transportation.

Cope with Linden-induced difficulty?
People were freaking crying outloud for a more isolated place, away from clubs, malls, casinos. They just gave us what we wanted.

Random,
While you feel it is OK and not "racketeering" to charge a rental to actually use and do business on your land, you do feel that it is OK to criticize someone else for doing it for free.
The idea for setting a nominal charge at all instead of just offering to give someone a place to run their vehicles from, was only to possibly help that person or persons pay themselves for their time and effort in setting up some sort of system.
We have offered this land to set to home in good faith; we do not get dwell because it is group land NOR have we ever made it to the developers incentive list for owning it which does get considerable traffic. (even before the new continent)
Most of this land has been owned by Mash since last year when it became available at the auctions. We now own the entire sim except for the small portions which were donated to Athos Murphy for the work on the SL Railroad, a wonderful long term project. If anything, having the new lands above us has not helped our sim performance because of so many vehicles being rezzed and left around the property. It has not, however dampened our enthusiasm for the New World, nor made us retaliate against those who have "dumped" vehicles with us on a continual basis. We have no vested interest in how people get to the new lands, because we own nothing there and don't plan to.
We were actually ONLY attempting to do something community oriented, something I am sure most people would agree is not new with either of us.
There probably isn't any good solution to this problem, as we am sure the residents of the area would be split on anything proposed. We are happy for all those who profit from the new lands, and merely offered to assist in helping people get there. No ulterior motives, no profiteering, just a simple act of community spirit.
We really don't care to get into debates with anyone here. We wish you luck with everything in the New World and elsewhere, This was just our way to try to help. If people would like to use the area, we are glad to have them do so.
If not, as they can see here there are certainly other alternatives.

Best Regards, Baccara

Yes, because you've implied a criticism against anyone charging, and set them up to be racketeers. I'm for ending that climate of intolerance for business in this game. There's a constant call to be doing things for free. It's laudable, but it's also valid to do things for pay. I'm merely attempting to establish that base.



But then everyone wonders why there are never even anything approximating RL wages here?



But group land *does* get dwell. I don't know why you are saying this. I have group land and it goes get dwell. The developers' awards are based on whoever contributes the most tier to the group, I believe -- there is now an explanation of this by Jeska on the Linden forums, and follow-up explanations in long threads on the subject. Groups do get dwell, but perhaps not as much, maybe that's why it isn't so visible. Check inside the group's menu under " money" and you will see that there are dwell points divvied up among all group members equally.

.

I imagine if he plays his cards right, he could hook up that RR to the one the Lindens have built in Obscuro, and rail transport from Purple to the New Continent could be one of the features that people would flock to try. I imagine this is already being discussed.



I can only tell you what the Lindens have told me, as well as a number of older players, in regards to my complaints about all the "boycott Anshe" signs appearing all over the new continent: right-click on your land, go to "objects," type in the minutes for autoreturn.

Sorry, but that's what they tell me. Doesn't sound very friendly, I know, but there it is.



That's understood. But in part people do community-oriented things to get the glory of doing community-oriented things, and it can enhance other sides of their business. That is legitimate. I'm merely saying that running businesses is also legitimate, and setting artificial ceilings on would-be ferry-runners isn't really fair.



Those who try to run businesses in the new world often do it at a loss, or break even. If they succeed, you shouldn't contrast yourself to them as the communty-spirited ones, and they, the racketeers. Business is good for SL. There should be more tolerance of it.



I think since you have what amounts to a monopoly in land ownership at the perfect staging ground for entrance to the new world -- really by accident -- it would be the right public-minded thing to do not to put a cap on the cost of ferries.

From: Random Unsung

Yes, because you've implied a criticism against anyone charging, and set them up to be racketeers. I'm for ending that climate of intolerance for business in this game. There's a constant call to be doing things for free. It's laudable, but it's also valid to do things for pay. I'm merely attempting to establish that base.

I applied criticism of nothing. It was you who criticized us for capping the fee, which we have a right to do.

I imagine if he plays his cards right, he could hook up that RR to the one the Lindens have built in Obscuro, and rail transport from Purple to the New Continent could be one of the features that people would flock to try. I imagine this is already being discussed.

I assume the HIS to refer to is Mash. He has not discussed that with anyone. The railroad belongs to Athos Murphy. The land is his now, not ours.


I can only tell you what the Lindens have told me, as well as a number of older players, in regards to my complaints about all the "boycott Anshe" signs appearing all over the new continent: right-click on your land, go to "objects," type in the minutes for autoreturn.

Sorry, but that's what they tell me. Doesn't sound very friendly, I know, but there it is.

What does that have to do with us?


That's understood. But in part people do community-oriented things to get the glory of doing community-oriented things, and it can enhance other sides of their business. That is legitimate. I'm merely saying that running businesses is also legitimate, and setting artificial ceilings on would-be ferry-runners isn't really fair.

I know you find it hard that sometimes in this world people just do something to try to help. Shame really...


Those who try to run businesses in the new world often do it at a loss, or break even. If they succeed, you shouldn't contrast yourself to them as the communty-spirited ones, and they, the racketeers. Business is good for SL. There should be more tolerance of it.

I never criticized you, it seems to me that it was YOU who started a debate.

I think since you have what amounts to a monopoly in land ownership at the perfect staging ground for entrance to the new world -- really by accident -- it would be the right public-minded thing to do not to put a cap on the cost of ferries.

Lets see, the land was bought and paid for. Since its inception it has hosted different types of projects and/or commerce. Last time I looked, everyone has a similar chance to own whatever land they have the resources to buy and support. I rarely post in the forums anymore except when I have my own post to do. Not everything has to become mean spirited. I am sure that you will lambast me for saying that so let me say in advance...

have a wonderful day ! The weather is beautiful....

Great job Mash and Baccara. I think its a great idea and since Ive not been interested in the new lands I may now just take a boat ride to it since your offering a spot to do such from.

I know from past experience that you both have done great services for the community. Dont let one or two distractors ever bring you guys down.

Or even just one that is two.

I think this is a great service! Last time I rode the ferry IRL from Long Island it was only a couple of bucks, so I don't see the cap you have in place as being out of line by any means. Heck, I can take a City Bus from where I live for a couple of bucks and it will take me all the way downtown, and that's like 15-20 miles depending upon the route.

It sure is a beautiful day. Spring is in the air.

Baccara, you and Mash have provided a very nice service for people. I for one think you should be able to do whatever you want with your land, and if you choose to provide a community service, then more power to you.

Random/Prokofy, I really and truly try to stay away from your more vitrolic posts. But you jumped all over Baccara, saying she "implied a criticism against anyone charging", saying she isn't being "public minded" because she is devaluing your login service at the new continent, etc. etc. etc. You're upset because she's undercutting your prices, and its pretty clear, no matter how much extra flotsam you inject into your posts about land return and anything else you decide to harp on.

You're so fond of business in SL - react as a businessman would. Advertise the extra value people get for your $50 login. Make that login spot worth $50 and make sure people know it. Don't cry foul because someone undercut your prices. In fact, what she's offering and what you're offering are two entirely seperate beasts. She's offering a login in Purple - you still have to fly to the new continent. You're offering a login RIGHT IN the new continent. Market your angle. If its worth $50, people will pay for it, even if there is a similar (but not the same) service available for free. Don't forget, there's every chance someone who also owns new continent land could offer FREE logins right on the continent. A good businessman should be prepared for this kind of eventuality.

Baccara has no obligation to anyone in SL other than herself, and the fact that she chooses to use the resources she pays real money for every month to assist others in SL speaks to her generosity.

Thanks for the kind words all... Lets not forgget my lovely husband Mash in this. It is hime who bought most of this land to begin with, he just isn't awake yet (Mountain time)

My tree is blooming in front of my house. Life doesn't get any better

I skateboarded in the new sims.

Lets see some pics ! Hugs Jack

Baccara, I hope you won't mind me adding to this thread after speaking to you in world

I too set up a free service, Cecropia Gateway. It's a small plot of land in Cecropia (77,77), by the entrance to the new continent. Just join the Cecropia Gateway Group (open sign up) and set the plot to home.

PS Baccara - if you could IM me when back in world, that would be super fantastico

The response is all pretty predictable, with hugz all around and more offers for volunteer help and lectures about not crying foul.

It's not personal, it's not vitriolic, it's simply establishing that there is far too much of an anti-business climate in SL.

Yes, they're separate beasts, and of course someone can and will come and offer a free continent log-in, but that's not the point. The point is that there are two or three streams constantly running at cross purposes in this game. One stream contains long-term players who have been subsidized in the past and continue to be subsidized in various ways, who are content-providers and well-advertised ones who like to add public service/do-good kinds of activities to their menu of more quiet boutique commercial activities to position themselves in the overall SL reputation and business market. Another stream of players are not subsidized, are new, have no networks or reputation value-adds and try to run open businesses, often mass market or non-boutique in nature, to cover costs, sometimes providing loss-leaders but generally treating the game as a commercial space.

The first stream of players constantly gripes about the second, calling them gougers, barons, whiners, defrauders, tacky etc. You're adding to it now by making my very legitimate critique about the destruction of the business environment in SL turn into some lozerz whine about getting their business undercut. It's not about that.

Seizing the opportunity to get the glory of public service, seizing the opportunity to put a cap on what transporters can charge, merely because of the accident of nature (one hopes) of owning Purple land, is overlooked, just because the person is "nice" or "has good builds" or "is one of us" or "is a long-time player" or is "doing a public service."

But that phrase, that act, that imperious overreach of capping transportation on $2 is a killer. It's just like the "free" goods that are free and copyable...but not modifiable.

I honestly do not care that she has "undercut" me because it's a game. I have no need to make $50 off some log-in, it's just an experiment. But I am pushing this point so you all can see, the invisible, killing, deadening hand in this game, that privileges the volunteer freebie givers with long-established subsidies over those entering under harsher economic conditions who wish to run businesses.

Charlotte Gillepsie isn't here to defend herself, but that $2 cap was positioned against her. She had a business ferrying people for $50. Now she'd have to move, and be cut out of this "public access free land" merely because she attempted to cover some tiny fraction of the real cost for this service.

Honest to God, people, you just don't get it. It's not about you and your friends and your family. The issues are bigger. To make that evident, I'm quite aware that I have to come off looking like a harshing nasty idiot. But my points are valid. It's wrong to force a $2 cap on "public land" just because you're on it. What you've essentially done with this move is make land all around you now be biddable sky-high if it appears on the auction, and open up the opportunity for huge price gouging.

What's the appropriate thing for the Lindens to do with this situation? Make a genuine public-access Governor Linden land that allows no commercial services on it. Don't let one group of players seize the eminent domain here and the public airways and waterways and get the glory of selfless service, the dwell, and even $2.

OR put the land up on the market if it becomes available, possibly by auctioning the water beyond Purple. If this is to be the gateway to the new world, we need to prevent trolls to profit unfairly in any way from it. That includes getting glory and dwell for selflessness. One of the ways you prevent trolls is to allow a free market where a price is found between a willing buyer and a willing seller.

Hey, nice chess move Hiro, positioning yourself in the market as the selfless giver of free services even as you profit from land sales. WTG!. I'm sure your high volume of land trade in the New Continent at the high prices you charge (after having to pay high auction prices) can enable you to make the profits you need to offer free services and an endorsement of other long-term players' free services in an endless round robin of beta test love fests.

But since I'm not a land trader, I'll go on doing business and charging at least a minimum fee for the work of managing rental groups and TP'ing people into the new continent.

Excellent!

Thanks Mash and Baccara for doing this! Your heartfelt freely given contributions to our community are an example to us all!

Know what? If it were my land - I'd make it free and would build a huge billieBoard that said something like -

"Free-It-Forward!"

Actually there is far too much of a business climate in SL.

That's my opinion. So who's right? No one. So why put down other players?

1. There will ALWAYS be a call for free things, nothing will stop that. There are vast volumes of commerce in SL, to say there is intolerance for commerce in SL is laughable.

2. I think allowing people to set home points on your land is generous Baccara/Mash, and hope you get some traffic flow-over to your new home depoz store (I still have to come check that out).

3. Eggy, I completely agree with you. Some people wanted to get away and have a remote area. Linden Lab has provided that alternative. If you don't want to be remote, don't buy in the new peninsula. It's really not rocket science. That said, the lobbying for and against a telehub will inevitably continue.

"As a man without a care in the world, seeking somehow to justify his constant idleness, I have always found such festive mornings in a country house universally attractive. When the green garden, still moist with dew, shines in the sun and seems happy, and when the terrace smells of mignonette and oleander, and the young people have just returned from church and drink tea in the garden, and when they are all so gaily dressed and so merry, and when you know that all these healthy, satisfied, beautiful people will do nothing all day long, then you long for all life to be like that."
~ Anton Chekhov ~ The House with the Mezzanine ~

There is tolerance only for medieval guild commerce, positioned on an arcane, complicated, and Medici-type subsidy of an artisans' class. There is intolerance for other more modern types of commerce.



Cheerz, hugz, pozrates all around. But those who continue to charge for this service aren't ebil, they just cover costs and try to make some profit in this harsher climate for business in the new world, which they are going to be ploughing back into SL anyway, in the form of their purchase of goods and services. Honestly, I don't think you get it about modern economies.



If Linden Labs wanted to provide that alternative, they should have announced it up front. It shouldn't be included in a cryptogram in a convoluted story that you need a Keds' Decoder to read. People who bought in the New Continent were led to assume from past performance that this company would provide the telehubs. That's not rocket science. Smug gloating about people getting the rug pulled out from them isn't the appropriate response here. I personally don't care if there is a telehub because it's an interesting experiment. But many did buy land out here, including new players buying first land, and LL made no announcement whatsoever of its intentions. I continue to find that manipulative.

There is tolerance only for medieval guild commerce, positioned on an arcane, complicated, and Medici-type subsidy of an artisans' class and arcane reputation points system mirroring a virtual reputation network (thriving on gossip and drama). There is intolerance for other more modern types of commerce that are less "personal".



Cheerz, hugz, pozrates all around. But those who continue to charge for this service aren't ebil, they just cover costs and try to make some profit in this harsher climate for business in the new world, which they are going to be ploughing back into SL anyway, in the form of their purchase of goods and services. Honestly, I don't think you get it about modern economies.



If Linden Labs wanted to provide that alternative, they should have announced it up front. It shouldn't be included in a cryptogram in a convoluted story that you need a Keds' Decoder to read. People who bought in the New Continent were led to assume from past performance that this company would provide the telehubs. That's not rocket science. Smug gloating about people getting the rug pulled out from them isn't the appropriate response here. I personally don't care if there is a telehub because it's an interesting experiment. But many did buy land out here, including new players buying first land, and LL made no announcement whatsoever of its intentions. I continue to find that manipulative.

I'm sure the excessive business climate in SL has been hard to deal with in selling your handbags, shoes, and houses, Ingrid.

What you mean is there is too much of a business climate you don't like, which is not the high-end, quiet, private stash, sterling edition kind of designers' work sold in your own boutique or huge mausoleum edifices to long-dead civilizations. What you mean is you don't like the hustle and bustle of modern commerce that seems "cheap" or "tacky" in a mall or strip or cluttery commercial sim.

And I didn't knock another player. Players who charged $2 were knocked, including Charlotte Gillepsie, not here to defend herself, who charged $50 in a very dashing and entrepreneurial spirit on the first day. That's the kind of spunk SL needs, not a lot of free wikis. Why should people who charge more than $2 be knocked, excluded, and pilloried, and kept out of the gateway to the new world?

I've mostly created and done things for free because this is a hobby and I can't be bothered to deal with real customers. Second Life has so far accomodated business minded people and hobbyists, and a wide variety of blending between the two. The message I'm hearing from Random (or whoever he really is) is that SL isn't big enough for the both of us. I feel like I'm being attacked and that there's a serious effort to drive me and people like me out of SL. I'm not sure how to react. But I know one thing, it's only making me more likely to give stuff away for free.

Thats sounds like a pretty cool setup, Baccara.

Nope you missed my point completely. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But that doesn't mean you should be poo-poo ing what others are doing because they don't play the same way you do.

Ummm...Ingrid? Did you read the first post?

That player poo-pooed anyone charging more than $2 for a ferry ride. It was an indirect slam against Charlotte's $50 ride -- the player felt called upon to put a rather fussy an artificial cap on the ferry ride of $2 because deep inside, she felt that people charging $50 were gougers and scam artists. That's poo-pooing other players. Using the platform of being an older, respected, posrated, player, she can set up that dynamic, so that new people charging $50 rides are then viewed as scum by contrast. I oppose that.

While not conscious, it was an indirect slam against me charging $50 to TP. So I stood up and defended myself.

They have 0 tolerance for anyone playing as I do or as Charlotte does or dozens of other people making businesses. I'm pointing that out.