Classes in SL

Hi All,

I'm supporting Instructors in SL and would like to hear your feedback about educational opportunities in world. There aren't many classes listed on the event calandar per any given week. Why do you think this is? What do you think LL could do to assist Instructors better? This is just an informal solicitation for your feedback..I appreciate any comments you are willing to share

get people in the SL Instructors group that will actually have classes

Jesse,

I have started a project that will hopefully encourage ALOT more scheduled classes. We hope to start having daily classes as soon as next week. IM me inworld so I can show you around.

Writing curriculum as fast as I can!

What would be nice is a 'most wanted' list of classes

Many of the current problems with events apply to classes in SL:

Low turnouts. Classes get lost in the long list of events in the Find window. Lots of effort, little reward. Dwell a non-factor. Perceived lack of Linden support or interest. Somewhat difficult to do...you're simultaneously typing, fielding questions, dealing with griefers, editing objects, etc. And sometimes, it has to be said, classes are run by less than compelling hosts/instructors.

Right now, classes battle with other events for the hearts and minds of SL's residents. In real life that's not so much the case; rarely do people look at their evening ahead and ponder "should I go to a club, or attend a figure drawing class?" Classes are a separate animal and need to be treated as such. They require structure and planning from the attendee as well as the host. In general.

I personally would hesitate to teach a class without a partner to help with the grunt work. In real life teachers get TAs. I think it would be a good practice in SL as well (speaking as someone who would be perfectly happy to serve as an assist to an instructor).

Schwanson's project is definitely a step (or two, or three) in the right direction.

/120/85/38654/1.html
and other threads are relevant here


classes:
1. timing makes classes difficult - when the teacher is on, and when a critical mass of interested students are on, do not always coincide
2. hard to find: the events listing system needs to be improved, with a special section or filter for educational events (whether LL sponsored or not) -- for current and future days

they do happen, and there are people continually rallying around spurring new classes. See stormy's latest thread for example.

general consensus among teachers on the forums (as I read it) is that the current LL sponsor system doesn't really work -- cumbersome for return so most don't bother

DIY things work really well, like the Ivory Tower. I made a DIY building tutorial, and i think Touchstone (led by jase byrne) will start getting more involved with DIY teaching tools that get around the first two problems i mentioned.

the problem with DIY tools is that LL hasn't done much to make it easy for a newbie to discover them. People discover them through word of mouth, forum posts, etc. I can live with the fact that LL doesn't have much in the way of documentation, but you might want to do a better job of leveraging user generated content and getting it in the hands of new members. Things like Brace Coral's HAND system are a help, but it's still something that needs to be discovered, rather than a resource or link to resources that is presented during orientation.

I went to teach art classes for those who had never done it before. I quickly had to quit due to no one showing up. Make sure there is a large amount of people interested in classes before you attempt it.

I can think of a few ways of getting more people involved in teaching/tutoring SL users.

1. Streamline the application process. I'm wondering, do you ever turn down a potential instructor based on class content? If not it seems the process would be swift, "any complaints?, no?.. Approved!"

2. Eliminate class attendance requirements. If you are in class waiting to teach you shouldn't be denied support regardless of how many attend. One night you may have 20 attendees, the next might only attract 1, it shouldn't matter. I wonder if school teachers get paid if the students don't show up....

3. Allow multiple listings of the same class on any day. If you want to teach 3 clothing classes, 5 building classes, and 2 animation classes in one day you shouldn't be restricted by the events rules and you should receive support for every single class in my humble opinion.

If they make it easier to apply for instructor status, eliminate class attendance requirements and allow multiple listings regardless of the event calender rules, more instuctors may join in the fray.

Make the events list open up on the classes section by default, and maybe instructors would get some actual attendance
People used to teach a lot of classes back when there werent many events... now that we have a hundred, well, noobs would rather just play tringo

I agree.. I used to hold classes a lot more than I do now.. The main things that stop me doing it now are low attendance, not getting paid if it drops below 5, and the whole process you have to go through to get support.

I also don't think the amount of support reflects the amount of work a class takes. I don't hold classes for the money and never have, but L$500 for an hours work just seems disproportionate.

Also categorizing the event calender I also think would help... If there was a clear cut classes section I'm sure the events would get better attendance, the events calender is a mess as it is.

Well, I used to teach a lot and do events, I am only choosing one type of event in what I chose to do in SL. However back then when I was new... I was very excited of all the choices of classes to attend. I wanted to cover all of them. From photoshop, creating clothes, psychology, how to build, even nice sex psychology classes lol was pretty coool...

This classes encouraged me and taught me to be prepared and do my own classes on dressing, hair, posing, ect...

Some reasons why I don't do them anymore:

1) You only can do a certain amount of events per day
2) You have to join a darn group if you want to be paid by lindens and be a mentor. I need more groups pleaseeeee, at least put groups by categories, but do something!!! Why do we have to be limited to social groups?
3) No pay
4) Location is limited
5) Event List is LOADED of Tringo, Slingo and bingo.. I wish at least you divide the events by category, easy to spot over that. I don't even look at event list anymore
6) People don't care anymore of coming to learn a good class (They are playing Tringo)

Why bother myself in taking time to teach if when I book an event there are 20 events on tringo at the same time? I gave up on that one.

I really miss taking classes. One of the best classes I attended was Judy Brodie, I will never forget that and Toy, she taught me how to build and water texture.

Wow, editing this one.. I wish I remember the name of the teacher that taught me how to photograph in SL.. and wow... I learned so much from her, I have so much fun now taking pictures because of her. Was in a nice museum on the top floor after that we had competions of the best picture. She used to reimbursed the money for the upload too and pay us a bit. I am sure she can't do that now, since there is no pay to teach unless you are mentor.

i've been holding class categorized events... and people are showing up simply because it's a class.

and on more than one occasion, i've had people ask me how to do something, and i've had to spontaneously start a class.

i think there is a demand for classes of any type.

i do think that providing more support for classes would help get more classes going.

It is sad to see that over the last 6 months the classes have disappeared. I have been wanting to run my classes for a couple of months, but am dealing with connection problems, which with any luck will be sorted in a month. Please, anyone interested in learning about cat and dog psychology as well as beginner creative writing, IM me and I will put you on the class lists. Was also thinking about running a class on The Four Pillars of Destiny - Chinese based astrology. If this sounds of interest to you please let me know.

Greeting Jesse,
Tang and I Held lots of very structured classes 3 times a week. Bought 7,000 meters of land to build the Learning Center. We started by contacting Char Linden and the ball was rolling. We were amazed at the mentor group chatter and the Support we got from Char and at times another Linden she would send. Things were going great we loved the spin-off questions we got from folks during and after the classes, got lots of im’s about how to this and that’s. Was fun but also work. Then the bottom fell out!!! The Linden help / support system crashed...

Char got replaced and a new untested cutback of support and pay system was slapped on us. This other Linden seemed to have other duties off line most of the time and rarely showed an intest in the whole program. Then the money dries up changes were broadcast thought-out SL. We are cutting your strippens, dwell, ratings and anything else we can blindly think of. LL promotes the commercialization of everything and Made the Linden Buck Rule, There is nothing knew here, if you are fishing around for other ways to get a once working program back on track, ASK CHAR! After the hassle of getting / posting a class for payment from the switch-hitter guy LL put in and for the last 6 months watching LL watch it fall apart… sham on you!


LL takes away one of the best Liaison you have and replaces a good sound foundation program with a hacked up mess, watch it fall the to ground in a burning heap then come back to us and ask what happened ??? Someone needs to be taking notes!

LL has done what it set out to do------ dry the moneys up in what ever way shape form it could. Got the gom and other exchanges online and pulling maximum moneys out of our pockets and into yours, it seems the Mentor / Classes ether started the ball rolling on the “NEW” economics of Second Life or got caught up in it.
Now on a lighter note
Some comments on others input-

Pol – hits it “Timing “
Forseti- hits it “LL info/documentation
Keven- misses- open booking will breed abuse
Eggy – hits it “the default event screen “cool idea
Zapoteth- hits it “pay mentors for integrating new users into your game or you do it.
And of course Schwanson- have someone actually go talk with him in game about classes, mentors, and the pulse of SL
Now me, I’ll hop back on the fence and see how it all turns out,
Oh one more thing- I work for a multi-million dollar construction company
And I have only one item on my walls of my office. One small quote in print
Simply and clearly says: “WHO PAYS “ to me means with every action there is a cost
LL has made many changes (actions) without thinking there is a cost for each one of these changes, well there is, some in the form of cash payments and some in the form of the way EVENTS UNFOLD
wow that was good even for me, LOL just my thoughts on this I still love each and every one of you, But Schwanson most of all, hahahaha
Sry Schaw but our prison time together meant alot

-WL

Right before Haney "left" I got approval for a beginners class in Photoshop, intended to be a bare-bones "just get me started and how do I use it with SL stuff" kinda thing. I started writing it up with images to display and to give out with the class notes, but then got waylaid by RL activities and stalled out. When I finally had time to address the project again I wasn't sure the thing would work without the ability to have Photoshop open at the same time. This is a program that is memory hungry as so many of you know and often doesn't run well with our favorite memory hog Secondlife and I started to hesitate.

To make a long story short...I've stalled out again in indecision. Any feedback you all could give me would be appreciated. Should I go ahead and try it, do you think or would it be a complete waste of time?

One of the problems I have had with creating events and classes has to do with the dependability of SL.

I go to my own event and crash.
I try to move across the area to a seat and it takes me across 2 sims, through some buildings and hangs me above the seat for several minutes (only small exaggeration).

It is hard for people to keep track of things when they lag and freeze all the time and have to keep re-logging. Also, when the sim rolls away as you prepare.
I was just working on one of my classes, the game crashed and I had to do a cold boot.


A second problem is finding the right time to schedule an event. I have tried going across time frames but that doesnt work any better than closing your eyes and putting your finger on a clock to choose... LOL

The third problem.. and this is a personal one... is that I want to have materials ready for my class. The cost of downloading textures is tough when you have little money and the payment for the class is risky. So, start-up costs are tough. However, there is no reason that people have to have props to teach a class. This is a personal problem in that sense.

As far as Linden support goes, I liked the old method of supporting classes and educational events. I learned as much from the events like Show and Tell and Texturing/Building (Zapoteth Zais) contests as i did from going to a class. However, I don't think that throwing larger amounts at an activity is the answer. I think that having a streamlined, understandable application process and an easy way of reporting the turnout/event with prompt remuneration is more important than throwing big bucks at a few classes where little content is conveyed. (Mind you, I am not saying that ALL classes currently held in SL are not well planned or empty. And, I am not pinpointing particular people. So, please do not reply in that vein.)

Maybe bring back a few of the "old" teachers? I miss Jamie Otis. I went to his classes long after I stopped being a newbie.

Once a different way of finding classes is possible, that should increase visibility.
Then, all we have to do is get people to them. Perhaps more can be done in orientation to show newcomers the methods of locating education oriented activities.

Just ideas.

Great comments, folks. I'm catching up on the reading from:
/120/85/38654/1.html

and will post again here later today...

I'm currently putting together a self-paced Texture Tutorial. I'll be hosting it on my land, and also at the Ivory Tower. (The new one- I'm sorry, but I'm at the wrong computer, and I can't think of the Sim name. Natoma?)

I'd be delighted to teach classes, too, on any number of topics. (SL stuff, Photoshop, Critical Thinking, Philosophy, Wicca, Tarot.... got a topic? )

I was thinking of teaching on my own land, but I have to admit that I'd really prefer to teach in some venue that was set up for it.

So, umm, Jesse, if you want a teacher...?

(edited to refer to Jesse, not Jase. Oops. )

Hi Jesse

I'm coming in late to the party as usual, but I will put my two cents in.

The main thing I found frustrating about the way educational events are handled now is twofold.

1) The signup process is not very user friendly, and I like many others just didn't bother. There are too many "rules" as illustrated in the previous posts. Why its much easier to put on a best boobs contest then get a class going! That might be a big reason why things are as they are right now.

2) The bias towards "SL only education". I'm paraphrasing but that means I can only be "approved" if I teach my Inventory 101 class and not my seminars on African art or textiles.

Mind you I gear those other classes in such a way as to spark ideas and creativity towards building, texturing and clothes making in SL! But as the criteria stands, it looks to me like anything other than direct How-To, SL Basics classes wont get approval.

Lastly, if you are doing a good job at putting a class together, it takes a LOT of preparation before you get to the point of holding your hour long event.

As mentioned here already, you can see you've got monetary expenses (picture uploads for your visual examples) as well as time expenditures on creating and gathering your materials and putting it all together into a lesson plan and notes.

Most don't do it for the money, but as stated before 500L doesn't cut it, as well as all the hoops to go through to eligible for it, and then after all your hard work and only 2 people show up you get squat.

Its nice to feel recognized for your efforts, and get some return on your investment in creating good content for SL.

I say broaden the scope of whats educational, make it as easy as setting up a sexy avie contest, and don't link compensation with attendance, and up the ante on the rewards for doing so.

We have in the United States for some odd reason disregarded educators when it comes to compensation. Lets not see this trend continued in Second Life. As mentioned so eloquently by Bel Muse in that link, Jesse - LL needs to get behind any education program in a big way in order for it to succeed, and see any significant changes on the events calendar.

Thanks for focusing on this issue!

Perfectly said Brace. Wish my brain was in a good enough gear to have made sence at 2am yesterday lol...

wow Brace,
you got me all goosebumppitdy

Kudos

It seems to me the two chief issues are the approval process and the worry that people will do all the work to hold a class, then not get five attendees so they have wasted their time.

Approval Process: I got approved off the bat to teach two classes because I applied, but I can only run those two classes so many times before my market for them dwindles. I love the idea of being able to link through the events page to a simple form to fill out (fill in the blanks, no more than 5 questions if possible) to be approved to teach a new class. IF I could reach the place to apply from the events page, I would be about 10 times more likely to think of that as an option when I am posting the easier events (truth or dares, usually).

On the issue of minimum numbers: my hunch is that with the flood of new players, people are quite likely to get the minimum number of attendees (5) but why not just be sure that they will be compensated, and also rewarded for having a very good class / posting adequately ahead of time? Why not pay the instructor for the number of students he/she gets at the rate of $100/student? This provides instructors with an incentive to build word of mouth about their teaching and to post in advance. It also helps instructors feel that if they have less than five turn out, they will at least recoup costs for uploads, etc. $400 is better than 0 by a long shot. This way, instead of making a set $500, an instructor can make anywhere between $100 and $2000 depending on how many students are interested in the subject. This might also garner us more advanced classes as it might be worth the while of designers to quit building long enough to teach.

I see a few drawbacks to the "pay per student" idea although I must say it has some great merits. The first drawback is it would still pay you nothing if no one attends, and even if a few show up, very few instructors want to spend an hour out of their free time for 40 cents, 2 dollars is hardly an incentive.

Also, Paying more for classes that draw a large crowd might be abused by "learn tringo" classes. I'm not saying tringo isn't a valid class, many want to learn, it is part of SL, but it's bound to be more popular than a basic inventory class. Both instructors work hard and deserve to be compensated regardless of popularity imho.

On that note, I didn't realize support was limited to classes teaching SL things. However, as I was pondering Brace's comments about those limits it came to me, why not insert your African Art and Textiles in a "how to create clothing and buildings using African textures". Or "How to create and modify African Art and Textiles", To me that would satisfy LL and you get to teach those things you love. I teach an inventory basics class, I want to show was how to instantly transform from your current look into a freaky looking creature or a cartoon character, so it fits both needs. Turns out it makes an inventory class more fun and brings more people. Instead of calling it Inventory 101 I call it "AV Madness" or "Monster Madness".. anything to make it more exciting. They still learn the basics of inventory control and something extra. When they leave they can change their looks with ease and instantly reverse it. They take with them at least one complete AV. They are able to transform in front of their friends.

Just an idea.... I love all the ideas, very thoughful.

Me and glossy page just did a Fountain Creation Contest at Persephone Phoenix's spa last night . A few people came and we provided textures and water scripts from the library. Few actually came and wanted to be taught or observed and we tried our best *oh the script lag* to help. So there is desire for such events.

I don't think it will be changed *cries* as much as we ask...

We have asked for group space for looooooong time and nothing.... it is been a year and still 15 groups, I started when we were allowed only 10 and omg.. that was awful...

But I won't touch that...

I will be positive and maybe the educational department will change.... I am with Brace about classes.. teaching what we know.. the knowledge we have and not just like.. . "Inventory lag 101 class" but a nice class on "How to boost your self confidence" or stuff like that...

Well put Brace!! You rock gurlfriend!!!!